Suarez.

Suarez has just blanked Evra's handshake before kick off. For what it's worth I think shaking hands before a game is a load of bollix anyway.

 

absolute bloody idiot. we should be talking about the game, but instead now all tomorrows papers will be dominated by this mans antics. pathetic.

 

All kicked off in the tunnel!

 

Football, the new wrestling.

 

Have that Suarez you racist little c**t

 

Evra acted like a child today, had to make himself the centre of attention didn't he? Prize ****

 

I know that you are ridiculously pro-Liverpool and very anti-Man Utd but are you actually being serious?

 

Yes I am.
Gary Neville made the point that why should the players have to shake hands? Look at Evra's reaction. Grabs Suarez back and looks into the camera. Half time incident in the tunnel? Patrice Evra approaches Luis Suarez on the way into the dressing room. Did he have to do that? no he didn't. Yes Suarez didn't help things by not shaking his hand but why should he have to? Evra could've just left it and taken the moral high ground instead if celebrating at the end in such a manner, he's perfectly allowed to but why do it? Evra is just a **** stirrer who wants all the attention in him.

 

To be fair I would be pretty pissed off if someone who racially abused me refused to shake my hand if I offered him a sign of forgiveness before the game. Suarez is simply a horrible human being and Evra is a better man than me for even being prepared to touch that c**t.

If Evra wants to celebrate in front of his own fans at the end of the game then he has that right; if he wants to rub Suarez's nose in it then even better; it's the least that he deserves after what he's done and the absolute sh*t that he and Liverpool Football Club have put Evra through for having the temerity to be the victim of racist abuse.

 

I think most who have played the game will agree, that when you beat somebody who've you had a bit of animosity with, it's impossible not to rub it in their face.

Evra offered Suarez an olive branch and it was rejected. As far as I'm concerned, he's got every right to give Suarez the proverbial middle finger and enjoy the victory.

 

Suarez didn't help the situation by refusing to shake Evras hadn, who abused who ? if it was the other way round you could half understand it. Smacking the ball into the dug out on the stroke of half time didn't help.

Both could have handeled themselves better.

 

Dalglish refused to do a post match interview with the written press, it doesn't help the situation at all

There are times to back your players and time to be a man. Can you imagine what Warnock would ahve said if it was one of his players ?

 

Why did evra need to agressively grab Suarez's arm and cause a fuss? And why did Ferdinand refuse to shake Suarez's hand either?

Also 20 seconds in he goes for Suarez with a 2 footed tackle, which players in the past have been sent off for. He ended up completely taking out Ferdinand, but the intent was there.

He then squared up to Suarez in the tunnel at HT, and had to be held back by Liverpool players, police and stewards.

Obviously Suarez used a racist term against evra, and nobody is denying that Evra is the victim in all this, but he doesn't half make it difficult to sympathis with him when he acts in that way.

 

Evra reacted to being rejected by a player and club who have treated him inhumanely for the last few months. It was a spur of the moment thing and I challenge you to say with certainty that if you were in his position you wouldn't do the exact same thing out of anger and distress. Ferdinand probably refused to shake Suarez's hand because he doesn't like racists who reject a sign of peace from a person that they have abused and spend the whole game cheating. The whole Man Utd team should have followed suit after that.

It was not in any way a two footed tackle and he went for the ball. If he went in a bit hard then fair play to him; wouldn't you? I for one would be glad to see Suarez's leg hanging off and for him never to play football again so I couldn't care less if Evra's legal tackle was a bit over the top.

You don't know what happened in the tunnel or what prompted it, anything could have been said by Suarez, it's not as if he hasn't got previous. Suarez kicked the ball aggressively into the dugout and stormed off shouting things at Man Utd players.

And finally, people are denying that Evra is the victim. 40,000 Liverpool fans for 90 minutes at Klanfield for a start.

 

Indeed it was spur oft he moment but it doesn't justify the assault. He certainly went in with the intent to injure Suarez which is a straight red.

True, but the report I heard said Suarez squared up, and I'm yet to see or hear anything to disagree with that report.

I don't think they are denying it, more so venting their anger at how stupid Suarez was. Obviously it would be detrimental to the team to boo Suarez, so they vent their anger another awy, with more abuse etc. I think it's purely psychological rather than with any malice.

True. I fully agree.

But that's no justification for going out to deliberately injure somebody. It's a reason, not a justification.

We can all agree that Suarez made a racist comment and that it is Evra who is the victim.

On a separate point, did Evra give a reason as to why he didn't make an official complaint to the police about the Suarez comment? He should've, and Suarez should've quite rightly been locked up.

 

Looked more like Evra and Ferdinand communicated poorly and ran into each other, as opposed to this apparent attempt to end Suarez's career, that Simms seems to be describing.

You talk about finding it hard to have sympathy for Evra, whilst simultaneously showing sympathy towards Suarez, whose behavior instigated this whole situation.

I think you're living in a fantasy world, honestly.

 

I disagree.

I do have sympathy for evra, but i can see why others don't. I have no sympathy for Suarez.

Here is a video of the handshake incident for anybody who hasn't seen it.

[video=youtube;80Oed8OT4vw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80Oed8OT4vw[/video]

 

Agreed.

Simms, defending Liverpool's fans' racism/ignorance with some sort of psychological mumbo jumbo about them blaming Suarez is quite simply a load of bollox, as is describing Evra attempting to tackle Suarez or grabbing his arm as an 'assault'.

If you can't find sympathy for Evra or can see why others can't then there is something seriously wrong with you. He has been the victim of racist abuse, abused by more or less every fan of one of the most supported clubs in the world and has been called a liar by Liverpool Football Club and their players, which then consequently sent out the message to their moronic fans that he deserves to be abused and ridiculed. When he attempted to put an end to this and offer an olive branch to Suarez he was once again rejected and humiliated by him.

 

That's an fallacious conflation. I was positing an possible explanation, not defending their actions.

I did just post that I have sympathy for evra and have repeatedly said that Suarez is quite clearly in the wrong. See post #20.

 

I think Gary chuckle brother Neville had a valid point that he would rather the players shook hands after the game rather than before it,and if you saw someone you did not like walking down the street would you offer a handshake,of course you would not.

Eva at the end did celebrate like a idiot and ok that is alright,but he did it in front of suarez,and he just ignored it and walked off whereas some other liverpool players took offence to this..Neville went on to say he was fined a few grand for celebrating like this.

Both clubs should have said no handshakes before the game,QPR v Chelsea abandoned the pre-match shake...Also Terry and bridge didn't shake hands and nothing came of it and did not spark a reaction like today.

 

Thanks for posting that video, and confirming that it wasn't a two-footed lunge, but poor communication between the 2 United players going for the ball.

 

Well as far as possible explanations go that is probably the biggest amount of bullsh*t i've read on here.

And I never said that you didn't have sympathy for Evra; you did however say that you can understand why others don't which is quite frankly unbelievable considering all the sh*t that the guy has been put through over the last few months.

Also, I would advise against using terms like 'fallacious conflation' in an attempt to add some sort of intellect or credibility to your wafer-thin argument as it only serves to make you look more foolish, especially when the term doesn't make any sense in this context.

 

Good piece in The Guardian about the events of today:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/feb/11/liverpool-kenny-dalglish-luis-suarez

Can't say I'm a massive fan of The Guardian but the journalist hits the nail bang on the head here.

 

Whereas your explanation that every liverpool fan more or less is a racist, is perfectly reasonable?

Because some say evra has trivialised the situation with his celebration and squaring up to Suarez etc. I don't agree but i can see that some believe he has.

You suggested I was defending it when I did not.

 

I never said that every Liverpool fan is a racist, don't twist my words because it stinks of desperation. What is said is that more or less every Liverpool fan is guilty of either ignorance or racism. That cannot be denied.

Whether you intended to or not you did in fact defend Liverpool fans by making out that they were not acting towards Evra 'with any malice' and that they are not motivated by misplaced hatred of Evra, which stems from him being undeniably racially abused, which is needless to say complete rubbish.

 

Explanations are not defences JB.

 

I think we know why patrice is acting this way. bloody french

[video=youtube;80Oed8OT4vw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=80Oed8OT4vw#t=27s[/video]

Evra has withdrawn his hand as Suarez approaches (especially when compared with prior handshakes with other LFC players). Evra then offers his hand as Suarez goes past, making it look like Suarez refused the handshake

 

patrice evra.... grade a ****

shrek was up to his usual tricks again.

all the cockney reds where out today!

 

Suarez and Evra acted badly today. Fair play to Evra for offering to shake Suarez' hand, but for Suarez to reject it is despicable. Even worse still is Dalglish doing anything other that comdemning Suarez. Disgusting Kenny.

Evra had no need to celebrate in that manner at the end of the game. Yes it wasn't by the Liverpool fans, but he knows perfectly well that to do that on live television would only exacerbate the situation. He should not have done that. It would have been perfect is Evra had shown some class, and walked off the pitch whilst clapping the fans, instead of running around like a maniac. Poor show Patrice.

I am fast beginning to hate Liverpool for the way they have conducted themselves throughout this whole order. There is something rotten to the core in Merseyside.

This whole issue could and rightly should have been put to bed today before the final whistle, but thanks to these idiots, it will carry on.

 

God, you sound just like one of those pathetic, little victim complex Scousers.

Suarez didn't even look at Evra so how can it be said that he intended to shake his hand? At no point was Suarez's hand in a position where it would have been possible for him to make contact with Evra's.

 

Put my head in my hands when he refused to shake hands, whatever had gone on could have been put to bed with a handshake, but instead ignited an already highly explosive fixture.

Dont agree with Ferguson though and his post match comments, saying he should never play for liverpool again he is a disgrace, this is the same manager who welcomed with open arms a player who kung fu kicked a supporter.

I do however agree with Gary Neville (theres a first), he has put the club and specifically Dalglish in a difficult situation.

Just another everyday Liverpool/Man U match I suppose.