Squad Rebuild

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Squibba, Jun 28, 2020.

  1. Squibba

    Squibba Predictor Choker 14/15

    Despite all my moaning, today is the first time I've actually genuinely feared relegation might be a very real prospect. All dramatic, kneejerk reactions aside.

    People keep saying they wouldn't mind The Championship and I agree to a degree but how much of this squad would we really want to see in the second division?

    Ben Foster - Nope. Nice lad, old unbothered.

    Cathcart & Dawson - Nope, old get rid.

    Kabasele - Would probably be alright in The Champ.

    Femenia & Masina - Don't mind. Will be decent players at that level.

    Cleverley & Hughes - Would be great. Not sure TC's body could handle it and think WH has higher ambitions.

    Capoue - Sell, won't try a division below. Barely enjoys football now.

    Douccoure, Pereyra, Deuolofeu - Lol.

    Gray & Deeney - Would've been a dream partnership at that level three years ago. Deeney needs to go for us to really rebuild and move forward though.

    Welbeck release, Pedro, Hernandez, Suarez, Pervis dude?

    What would we actually be left with? We'd need like 15 new recruits. The thought of a Championship season rebuilding, blooding youngsters and chasing promotion sounds fun, however after thinking about it the reality is going to be very different.
    scummybear and SkylaRose like this.
  2. Robert Peel

    Robert Peel Reservist

    What about Pussetto, our big transfer window statement of intent?
    wfcmoog and Jumbolina like this.
  3. Harrybassetthater

    Harrybassetthater Academy Graduate

    I think I would prefer the championship to another season struggling in the corrupt Premiership where money is the be-all and end-all.
  4. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    It would be horrible. We won't be able to shift the dross but will sell our best assets.

    None of these young, promising South Americans are going to come over for a slog in the Championship, they're already playing in La Liga!

    We'll end up with: Foster, Bachmann, Cathcart, Dawson, Kabasele, Wilmot, Masina, Femenia, Janmaat, Cleverley, Hughes, Chalobah, Gray, Deeney.

    We'll have to cut our cloth accordingly, hopefully there are some big relegation wage reducing clauses in that bunch but wouldn't expect much reinvestment of the fire sale money. Just not sure Udinese have that many players knocking about in their reserves to send us again, otherwise maybe they could've sent them over in January.

    Forestieri is out of contract though so look forward to him resigning along with a glossy "Guess who's back?" reveal, despite the fact he's been crap for a couple of years.
    wfcmoog, Chumlax, Jumbolina and 2 others like this.
  5. Squibba

    Squibba Predictor Choker 14/15

    Oh yes, Pussetto & Chalobah.

    Pussetto probably a bit light-weight, a game every three days could be what Chalobah needs to get back to speed.
    wfcmoog likes this.
  6. Squibba

    Squibba Predictor Choker 14/15

    That's the scary part. We're now the priority club, we have the best Pozzo assets and Udinese have most the junk which is a horrible thought.
    folkestone orn likes this.
  7. fuzzy73

    fuzzy73 Reservist

    Ticket office staff? - Nope, our demand is likely to drop off considerably. We’ll get shot of around 50% of them

    Hospitality? Well we’ll keep hold of the ones that look after the boxes and we’ll probably use one of the restaurants. The rest can go - say 20%

    Community Trust? No they’re gonna lose their PL grant and we can’t afford to bankroll them - 30% of staff and cut backs on trips with the youngsters

    Admin? For what? No-one will be ringing up about any of our players anyway. Let’s make do with two of them

    Club shop? I this retail market? With no Adidas apparel to sell? - 80% cuts

    .....these are the poor people I feel sorry for after a relegation - not whether ******* Capoue can’t get a better club than Leeds next year
  8. Optimistichornet

    Optimistichornet Penguin Assassin

    Honestly the whole squad needs an overhaul from top to bottom.

    GKs - Foster, Bachmann, Dahlberg
    RBs - Femenia, +1
    CBs - Cathcart, Dawson, Kabasele, Wilmot, +1
    LBs - Masina, +1
    CMs - Chalobah, Quina, Cleverley, Hughes, Dele-Bashiru, +1
    WMs - Sarr, Deulofeu, +2
    STs - Deeney, Hernandez, +2

    Its not very promising. Those are the players I would keep, but how many of them are going to want to stay? I could see Sarr and Deulofeu both going, as well as probably Hughes.

    I would make that at least 11 new signings needed to make us competitive. Honestly we could go down twice in a row.
  9. Relegation isn’t a real prospect it’s probable.

    Doucs, Geri, Sarr, Hughes, Chalobah, Pereyra, Capoue, Welbeck, Cleverly, Janmaat... won’t stay. It’s going to need a full rebuild.

    Little point speculating until we know what is there to work with: Bachman, Femenia Wilmott, Pedro, Suarez, Pussetto, Hernandez, Estupinan....
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
  10. StuBoy

    StuBoy Forum Cad and Bounder

    Honestly we should be looking to just survive in the Championship next season. We’ve got a bit of a whiff of the Sunderland, Portsmouth, Bradford etc about us.
  11. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    Could easily see us crashing and burning in that league as well. We are an absolute mess.
    wfcmoog and Bubble like this.
  12. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    I read the first 2 lines, and unfortunately the imbeciles running the club have all the below on sometimes lengthy contract extensions so they are all staying for many years in some cases and sucking the teat.

    Ben Foster - Nope. Nice lad, old unbothered.

    Cathcart & Dawson - Nope, old get rid.
    wfcmoog likes this.
  13. Bubble

    Bubble Wise Oracle

    Sell 'em all.
  14. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Absolutely. The Pozzo incompetence is going to come home to roost. Large external debt. Few saleable assets. What a dreadful owner.
  15. The Voice of Reason

    The Voice of Reason First Team Captain

    Who will buy them o_O
  16. LondonOrn

    LondonOrn Reservist

    Behave. All of the three seasons after we were relegated from the top flight ended up with us finishing in or near the play-offs with much worse teams (we already have more points than we did after the whole of 1987/88 and 1999/00), and arguably the last two occasions we should have done a lot better if anything.

    Even without Sarr, Deulofeu and Hughes and new signings there's no way that that list of players is anywhere near Championship relegation material.
  17. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Meh. The 87/88 team was completely overhauled by Harrison. About 8 new recruits? The 99/00 team was refreshed by Neilson and had Smith and Gifton coming through. This is an ageing overpaid team with huge external debt. It's a lot different. Pozzo has done extremely poorly.
  18. Carpster

    Carpster Reservist

    Looking forward to playing the Scum again. If they stay up obviously.
  19. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    A dreadful owner in the last couple of years, I’d probably agree with. A succession of poor choices and listening to bad advice has affected the playing side of the operation massively. The position we’re squandering now is a position he got us into though. That’s going to be painful for Pozzo too, especially as after a few years in the PL we’ve worked out the survival standard really isn’t that hard to achieve.

    I’d still say gravity was always going to come for us eventually and suck us back into the Championship. Relegation is not in and of itself proof of poor ownership for a club like Watford.

    And on the debt - the non-Pozzo stuff is just an advance on PL tv and prize money for this season isn’t it?
  20. I Blame Bassett

    I Blame Bassett Squad Player

    I agree.
    This team would struggle in the Championship.
  21. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    When we go down (which we will), we will end up in a worse position when we went up. Large external debt and ageing players on long contracts. All at Pozzo's door. Compare to what would happen if Burnley went down. He is an awful owner in my opinion and if we somehow stay up this year it will embolden him to continue with his ridiculous model.
    Wexford-yellow likes this.
  22. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Edit: I'd agree the gravity argument - however I think Pozzo has spurned the premier league riches, and fairly sure he has done well himself.
  23. Loyalhornet

    Loyalhornet Academy Graduate

    There will naturally be a big squad overhaul . Who knows what is likely to happen . The championship is very hard to get out if as we know , but when the dust settles, taking all the emotional stuff out of it , I think we’d have as decent chance of going back up with the Pozzos at the helm.
    Knight GT likes this.
  24. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    I get what you’re saying but clubs that go down and are better off are rare as rocking horse ****, so that can’t really be the standard to aim for in my view.

    I’m not gonna go hunting around for examples right now but I’d guess most clubs of our stature relegated after several years in the PL face similar issues. Go down inside the first couple of years and there’s probably enough people left in your squad and staff who know what it takes to get out of the Championship. And maybe, if you’re lucky, a couple of younger players ready to step up to the first XI. Last five years plus though and the division seems to breed squads like ours. A load of bang average players, a couple of youth prospects, a player or two who will easily attract moves whatever happens and a mercenary cherry or two on top. It’s grim.
    Jumbolina likes this.
  25. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Yeah all fair. I suspect most (not all) other clubs have more saleable assets that we do though. Pozzo has allowed this squad to age and to compound it has handed out extensions like confetti because he can't bear to have someone leave on a free transfer. Honestly he's a Serie A dinosaur.
    UEA_Hornet likes this.
  26. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Objectively a lot of our squad should be worthless but I have a funny feeling if we go down there’ll be inexplicable bids for Dawson, Foster, Gray, Success that’ll leave us gobsmacked. This league defies logic most of the time.
  27. Is Gino following a ridiculous model?

    We have the second smallest ground in the Prem, with no room to swing a cat in the concourse, and with limited hospitality opportunities. Inexplicably many of our fans seem determined this shouldn't change.

    Our TV revenue is mid to lower table.

    And the family are not super wealthy.

    What should he be doing differently?
    Knight GT likes this.
  28. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Not running up massive external debt? Not filling the first team squad with ageing poor players while focusing on players we loan out that will never play with us? Not putting dreadful Cathcart, Prodl and Dawson on 4 year deals? Living within our means. Developing some younger players that can actually compete for the first team squad. Identifying some lower league players who can make the step up. Not having "Other expenses" in the accounts that dwarf comparable clubs?
  29. In all honesty we probably have a decent mid table championship side.

    Andre Gray is actually probably a decent championship mid table striker.
  30. Very few clubs make a profit at football, most run up sizeable debts.

    The ageing players are ones who have been with us for some years and weren't ageing when we signed them. Dawson and Foster aside I can't think of of an ageing player we have bought.

    Living within your means exists in football for very few clubs, see above.

    Our much vaunted Harefield Academy set up was a crock of sh1t and produced no players of any calibre. The club had to effectively start again.

    Lower league players? Who do you suggest is good enough to make the step up? And if they are, why is no one else buying them?
    Knight GT likes this.
  31. Ágætis Byrjun

    Ágætis Byrjun Reservist

    Getting relegated at a time where giant corporations are going bust and the economy is in the bin... we'll be lucky to have a club in a few years.

    Huddersfield looking like the next quick-fire double relegation.

    Players I'd like to realistically keep? Foster and Hughes. Others are already halfway out the door, couldn't care less or not good enough.
  32. Better to be near the top of Div 1 rather than treading water just above the relegation trapdoor in the champ.
  33. Hughes won't stay, there will be plenty of offers
  34. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    On ageing players the point is we can never let go. Endless contract extensions hence our first team squad is largely valueless. Are you happy that Dawson and Cathcart have 3 years to go?

    As for lower league players. Some may not be cheap but spurs, West Ham, Bournemouth, Leicester and Burnley all seem to find some very effective players which also keep their value. We just have mercenaries that drain wages. Our domestic approach is shambolic.
    Chumlax likes this.
  35. Harrybassetthater

    Harrybassetthater Academy Graduate

    Next season in the championship surely we will be in prime position to loan some promising youngsters from premier London clubs. Cheaper than buying duds and putting them on 4 year contracts.
    Bwood_Horn likes this.

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