Gracia Out

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by GoingDown, Apr 7, 2018.

  1. No need to shout.

    He can and has done a decent (albeit limited) job there when no other full backs have been fit.
    wfcmoog and Unhappy bunny like this.
  2. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Reservist

    Back in the 80s we, and supporters of other teams like us, were quite happy with those mid-table finishes because almost all the excitement came from going for the Cups.
    Unhappy bunny likes this.
  3. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Costs a lot of dosh just to stand still these days though.
    dynamo380 likes this.
  4. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Cos Elton is lot better at singing than Gino.
  5. HELGO

    HELGO Reservist

    I still think JG is very limited and I still think he’ll be gone by the time of our return match with Bournemouth.
  6. vic-rijrode

    vic-rijrode First Year Pro

    Not now he isn't - have you heard him croak recently?
  7. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard Squad Player

    Has this 5 game wonder with no plan B ****** off yet?
    BigRossLittleRoss likes this.
  8. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    Elton has recently croaked ?? **** !
  9. miked2006

    miked2006 Premiership Prediction League Proprietor

    Quique Flores returns.
  10. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    If that is how we're going to react to going down to 10 men lets hope it doesn't happen too often otherwise we will be in trouble!

    Maybe it was just a long curse of MOTM?
  11. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    Pipe down. We’ve scored away goals. Massive progress.
  12. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    And I suppose Gino does a beautiful tenor rendition of Just One Cornetto?

    Actually, I did see Reg in concert this year & he was superb.
  13. oxhey67

    oxhey67 Squad Player

    PowerJugs likes this.
  14. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina Squad Player

    Leighton Buzzer likes this.
  15. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    Won't be good news for some on here, but I think it's good to tie him down and give the club some stability (even if that turns out to be just an illusion).

    Strange thing is, if he loses the next two games and we played like we did against Bournemouth, I think he'd be under a bit of pressure.

    But, it tells the players he's going to be around for quite a while so that will have a settling effect on the squad.

    I look at what he's done with the squad in general, and how so many players have improved under him. Ok, the last match was a bad one for everyone, but overall there has been a marked improvement in attitude across the board.

    I do have some reservations though, in some of his tactical substitutions, however, overall I think it's good news and a new contract fully deserved.
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2018
    Leighton Buzzer and PowerJugs like this.
  16. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    If it is a 3-year deal it will stop the apparent trend of players totally easing off after January with the mentality of "we won't be relegated & the coach won't be here next season". Even if the 3 years proves shorter than that in practice.
    Bubble and Leighton Buzzer like this.
  17. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    Personally think a new contract shouldn't be drawn up until we see where we are around end of Nov/Dec time - its a bit soon for me. But I'm certainly not as against it as I once was!
    Chumlax likes this.
  18. miked2006

    miked2006 Premiership Prediction League Proprietor

    The harmony of the team seems better it's been since peak Zola.

    He's done well on player development, with a number of players (most notably Capoue, Deeney and Holebas) improving dramatically.

    He's set us up very well at the start of games, given us a solid base (despite our fairly poor defensive options) and we create enough chances each game that we are often likely to score (despite our fairly poor attacking options). We're playing decent football, despite our defensive outlook - not an easy task.

    The main problem for me is our lack of rotation/ substitutions. Not only are we going to get tired, but we are equally going to have unsharp (and potentially disenchanted) players coming off the bench. We keep tiring and he doesn't act, allowing the opposition to take control of the match. Even with the winter break, we'll likely start losing points and picking up injuries in December/ January if we don't bring in fresh legs more frequently.

    Overall, Javi has been doing very well on most measures with an average, cheap team and deserves a contract extension. Hopefully he learns soon that he needs to be a little more proactive, otherwise I can't see him seeing out the rather generous 3 year contract.
  19. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard Squad Player

    Great news, glad we're choosing to stick, only criticism would be the substitutions but I'm confident he'll sort that out
  20. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Reservist

    On the subject of Gracia's substitutions: surely we could never have any manager about whom the entire fanbase would say "He gets it absolutely spot on. He does exactly what I would have done." It's all just a matter of opinion.
    BigRossLittleRoss likes this.
  21. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    Jokanovic was damn near close though.
  22. another_mrlizard

    another_mrlizard Squad Player

    Have any of the experts on here mentioned substitutions yet?
  23. luke_golden

    luke_golden Space Cadet

    He was good at making subs, I’ll not argue that, but I do seem to remember a fairly regular complaint on here at the time that subs were a necessary fix because we’d been set-up completely wrong, whereas Gracia has perhaps been too slow to react to opponents adjustments.

    The myth of Jokanovic has obviously grown due to his success with Fulham, but I do feel as though Gracia has been pretty good at getting us prepared to start games, and often that preparation has worked for 60-70 minutes or so. I would agree with those that feel as though he’s been slow to make adjustments when needed in recent games, but it’s also understandable that he’d continue to show faith in the same guys who were getting things done in the first 5 games.

    I think Success is working towards being given a start, same goes for Chalobah. Injuries and suspensions are going to force rotation as well. Overall, we seem as well prepared for games as we’ve been for a long time, including set pieces - attacking more than defensively I’ll admit, but certain a step up on Silva.
    PowerJugs and Oscar calling like this.
  24. Manatleisure

    Manatleisure Reservist

    Contracts are of no consequence. Players leave and managers get sacked regardless.
  25. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose First Year Pro

    I agree, but there has to be some sort of cut off point. Unless they are let go for obscene circumstances like match fixing or money launderers, the buying a manager out of a contract based purely on results can be crippling to a smaller club.

    Let’s not forget what happened to us after the bald Italian was let go.

    Managers have a small shelf life due to results, as we all know football is a results business and it’s cheaper to buy out one contract than 22 contracts of lazy half arsed players.

    None of our squad falls into that category thankfully, but the gulf between us and the big six is getting smaller. For me that is progress. Getting pasted 4 and 5 at Arsenal and Man Utd haven’t happened for a while. To me, going into games with more confidence we won’t get smashed is a shining report on just how far Graciahas come.
  26. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    No, we just get pasted by Bournemouth instead. Real progress.
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2018
    Oscar calling likes this.
  27. Chumlax

    Chumlax Reservist

    No; I think in deference to your position as the expert of experts, they all thought they'd let you do it.
  28. hornetgags

    hornetgags McMuff's lovechild

    Until Muff scored, I thought we were bossing the game, we didn't capitalise on our pressure and got hit with a sucker punch. Kabs had a brain fart moment, Javi didn't react correctly and the game was gone.

    Had Muff not manufactured the red card, I thought there was enough there for us to get back in the game with 11 v 11.
    Hornpete likes this.
  29. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I agree. I thought we were by far the better team until the red card. Up to that point I thought we'd come back to win. So Gracia's plan for the game before it starts is often good or very good. For me, it's how he reacts to changes in a match that seems to be a problem.

    It seemed obvious to me that we needed to get Mapps on and have two central defenders on the pitch, but he saw it a different way. That's fine if it pans out and we get back into the game, but it didn't work out that way. Defensively we were pathetic and conceded two further goals that was more the level of a Sunday league side. Only then did Mapps come and I don't think Bournemouth threatened for the rest of the match.

    So, I do not attribute the defeat to Gracia, however, I think it's fair to blame the size of defeat to him as he did little to reduce the loss of a vital central defender.

    Hopefully everyone learns from that defeat, and I expect another loss at Wolves. For me the key match would then be Huddersfield. If we have another match like we had against them last season, where we capitulated to a dreadful 1-4 defeat, then I think it's fair to consider Gracia would be under pressure at that point. However, I do not expect us to flop against Huddersfield, so this scenario is unlikely to happen imo.
    PowerJugs likes this.
  30. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    I get that some fans really don’t like Bournemouth but how can they be considered to have manufactured the red card? Kabasele was reckless when taking the GK out and then King hardly dived - whether you think it was a second yellow or not, it certainly wasn’t a dive.
    WillisWasTheWorst likes this.
  31. BigRossLittleRoss

    BigRossLittleRoss Squad Player

    You d be surprised at the amount of idiots on here who think that if a manager acts contrary to their opinion he is a bad manager.

    I know football is a game of opinions, it is just a shame that so many of them are small minded and self centered.
    oxhey67 likes this.
  32. hornetgags

    hornetgags McMuff's lovechild

    Congratulations on making the biggest incorrect assumption about my comment...well done.

    Did I say it was a dive? Did I say it wasn't a penalty?

    So, feel free to get off your high horse and ask why I used the term 'manufactured red card'.
  33. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    No high horse at all. You said something, and I debated the term you used. Too many people on here want to start arguments when someone doesn’t agree with them rather than just calmly explain their point.

    If you felt I went about it incorrectly, I apologise. Although I’m not really sure what for!

    Feel free to explain what you meant by that term...?
  34. BigRossLittleRoss likes this.
  35. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

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