Vydra to Derby

Really unfair assessment.

We all know how quick he can be and his finishing is heralded but when he came back from West Brom it was nice to be reminded that his first touch is generally excellent (overshadowed in our minds perhaps by his pace and finishing) and he has been known to work his socks off. Yes he can be sulky, and yes his agent is a jerk, but. Good player.

Perhaps the debate over whether he's good or not just goes to show how far we've come and/or how spoiled we've got.

 

Anya? 3-5-2?

 

no, yellow

 

Sure, but what about West Brom and Reading?

If we have other options on the horizon, then I'm not ready to roll the dice on Vydra based purely on sentiment and nostalgia.

 

Good. Base it on the fact that he was ******* brilliant for us, over 2 spells, is only 24, and he's here now.

 

has vydra really played 200 games for us? and in that time deeney only playing half the time but somehow scoring 20 each season

 

No. 38 goals in 92 for us per Wikipedia inc sub appearances.

 

We all have opinions - in my view Vydra is one of the best one-on-one strikers we've ever had. I'd love to see him get his opportunity to prove himself in the prem'.

 

This. Perfect summing up. well done KGT :sign15:

 

Forget Vydra (and Fessi). We want to be moving on to the next level.

 

Fozzi was craig forsyth, no?

 

So who do you want who will be the next level up from vydra and yet be back up for TD & OI.

 

Not sure you get the concept of continuous improvement

 

But that concept negates your own argument if Vydra stays, and improves!

 

Hmmmm. Think I do. He's only 24 so just think how good he can get? Or are you saying we should ditch TD & OI if they don't show that they've improved vs last season in their first 10 games ?? Or perhaps you're saying sell V for £3m and buy a top notch striker for £15m who will come here to sit on the bench and wait his turn. Great if that's possible.

 

My comment was in response to your post "So who do you want who will be the next level up from vydra and yet be back up for TD & OI."

TD and OI are not the ceiling. Why should the next strikers through the door be only up to their level and not better than? I'm not claiming we can get a world class striker tomorrow, but why set a ceiling?

 

Was it The Manager?
P.s my IQ is 172

 

Instead of continuing this post , why don't we close it and just reopen the original vydra post that broke a 1000 posts , because it's basically the same repeated discussions.

 

The guy is a quality finisher end of. Perfect in a 3-5-2. Can he push for a start, I think so. We got lucky with injuries last season. Not sure if Ighalo or Success will be going to Rio or the African cup of Nations. So he needs to stay. Plenty of others need shipping out before Matty.

 

Both Ighalo and Success aren't in the Nigerian Olympic team (writing an article on it atm so quite sadly know all the squads inside out ), Nigeria also didn't qualify for the African cup of nations so no worries there either.

 

On a side note, who do you think will win reids?

 

I copied and pasted Vydra's league goals into Excel, for the matches in which he played.

Unfortunately, it wont let me have all the data labels at the bottom, without making the graph a ridiculous size, and I cannot be bothered to group into months. I already am not sure if this will be large enough to read.

He clearly has some brilliant patches, and then some awful ones. He definitely needs a run to be able to score goals, but as the graph shows, you cannot just give him a run of games and hope for the best, as it might be a couple of months until he next scores.

And that is true in the Championship, his record in the Premiership was pretty poor: with two of the three goals he scored I believe coming against teams which were relegated that year.

He might be useful if played up front with Deeney, and he models his game on Vardy from last season. That is the potential he has. I just don't think he has the right mentality to do that yet.

I'd like to see him go on loan, put himself everywhere and close down defenders and score more consistently before coming back into the squad.

 

He's unfailingly awful between June-August every year.

 

That's the bar code for Dairy Milk isn't it?

 

it's like he just doesn't turn up?

 

What seems pretty clear from that graph is the downward trajectory of his goal-scoring. As I keep saying, by the end of his spell with us it looked clear that he'd lost some of his energy and sharpness, and that seems to be further evidenced by his even worse return for Reading. It could quite simply be that his peak as a football player was in 2013.

 

Do one for ighalo.

 

I know you're joking, but if you read the post, it only includes the data points for league matches which he plays.

So the graph goes immediately from May-August.

 

Your graph doesn't tell the whole story though, he might have made 23 appearances for West Brom but the vast majority were as a sub for a short period. He only played the equivalent of less than 7.5 games so 3 goals isn't that terrible a return for the minutes on the pitch. Obviously there is an argument that if he was good enough he would have forced his way into the West Brom team but just looking at the appearances alone isn't that instructive. And by focussing on league goals only at Reading, you've missed off the six he scored in the FA Cup. Clearly it was a terrible season for him last year and it sounded like his confidence was well and truly shot by the end of it but I'm not sure the graph tells us much more than he's a goalscorer who scores in streaks.

I'd be happy with him as our third choice striker this season, it's an immeasurable improvement on Ibarbo, Diamanti, Oulare and Amrabat.

 

Much depends on the way a team sets up .... and yes a quick breaking 3-5-2 is ideal for him. However he's not and never was just all speed, he also has two very good feet with it. If there's anything missing it's just in his head, to me his self confidence seems easily knocked.

 

Think you re right about the self confidence. He is very hard on himself if he can't influence the game , which comes across as sulking. I think he does sulk a little bit , but it's mainly frustration that he's feeling.

 

It gives a spread of his goals over a number of years. If he scores 2 or so he seems to go on a run. If he doesn't score in a couple of games his head seems to go down and he becomes a bit of a passenger.

He certainly is anything but consistent, despite the goals for us in the Championship.

That is based on both the above graph, and also watching him for the last 4 seasons.

I have absolutely no idea how good Diamanti is, nor Oulare, and it was clear that Amrabat was never a striker in a million years.

Vydra has everything but the mental side of the game. If he can sort that out then we need to keep him. But I expect that is a fairly difficult task to manage.

 

All this shows is he's never scored a hatrick.

And his agent calls him a top striker fml.

 

Worth bearing in mind that Vydra's poor WBA and Reading seasons were both operating under the same manager.

It's pretty clear that Vydra is a confidence player. Maybe Clarke is just **** at supporting his players. He certainly doesn't seem to get the most out of his teams.

 

I really hope he does, but I don't think so, however if it was Vydra that might be different