Udinese are 17th on just four points, just two points off the bottom of the league, they’re in the same dire position as us now and don’t have the capacity to lend us any players, let alone any good ones, anymore than we have the capacity to lend them any… oh but wait, we sent Ferreira there didn’t we.
To be fair, the gap between the PL and Serie A has grown a lot in the last ten years. The fact that Isaac Success plays up front for them says it all. Lower Serie A isn't much better than the Championship. If you look at their bench, who are we going to loan? Okoye, Quina and Kabasele?
Sadly just another awful, incompetent and often shamefully petulant step on our journey from mid PL into possible footballing oblivion. I actually thought we competed reasonably for most of the first half, but then our defence parts like the Dead Sea and that was all but game over. Everybody has to accept some blame. The players are turning in below par performances while happily accepting their wages. The Head Coach has decided to re-invent himself from a hoofball merchant (which is good) but on a weak and depleted squad clearly not up to playing the new style he demands (which isn’t). But as with all organisations, the buck stops at the top. The incompetent ownership have created a club full of instability, where hardly anybody believes they properly belong because of our revolving door for managers and players. How many wear the shirt with pride? We seem to have a plethora of nonsensically overpaid leaders and middle managers off the pitch, but hardly any on it. We’ve been asset stripped all summer, and on the evidence of last night not replaced the quality that left us with anybody even half decent. Did any of our new signings grab your eye last night? But it’s ok coz some of them were signed because their agent is mates with our owner. We are being mismanaged into a terminal decline. I lost faith in our owner after he turned down Farioli when he was offered to us, so I’m pleased to see many others on here are now also realising he’s an out of control meglamaniac who has to sell up for the good of all our futures. These are very tough times for sure, and I find myself actually looking forward to the next international break and two whole weeks of not having this badly run and wasteful club getting me down. As a fan who grew up supporting us in the first GT era, it breaks my heart to see how low we’ve sunk now and how badly run we are. And yes to be balanced, also how badly run we are now to the early days of the Italian takeover. Back then we looked smart, now we just look stupid, maybe fatally so. Unstable, rudderless, no heart, just a collection of incompetents mugging us for extortionate salaries, (alleged) crooks shaping our recruitment, apathetic players, fans treated like fools rather than valued customers, a club drifting dangerously downwards. Very sad to see because it genuinely doesn’t have to be this way.
It's a scenario I set out right at the beginning of the season. When players are fully onboard with blue skies and pre-season this is when everyone is at their fullest optimum with enthusiasm and motivation. But I cut through all that as I've been around long enough to know these feelings don't last very long once the novelty wears off and reality strikes. That QPR first half was a one off. We'd kept our training and intentions of playing well under wraps over pre-season (and full credit for the club for doing that). It took QPR completely by surprise and we could have had 6 or 7 in that first half. After that time teams have readjusted and worked us out. Even during that QPR game there were signs for me in that second half, were we struggled. Fans have to move on from the motion we are that team which played the first half against QPR. Never have I witnessed a low level of performance like that from an opponent in an opening day fixture in 40 odd years of watching football. It was a one-off, or fluke if you like. We are not that level of team. Subsequent matches have shown us where we are as a side. Competitive but ultimately lacking quality in keys areas. I predicted long ago, that players would only run themselves ragged, or play with that "intensity" as Ismael kept insisting on during pre-season, if they could see it was getting somewhere. If they thought all this extra running in training was worth it, they'd stick to it. But they quickly worked out, it's not a secret weapon for winning games at all, so they've subtly stopped doing it. I totally expected this to happen. This is what we're seeing now. Players have given up and from the last few performances looks like they're trying to force a change of manager. They don't like all the hard work and rules. This is why we really needed a lot of new players to come into the club who have not been part of the culture at the club previously. They got rid of a lot, but mainly retained others who are still part of the problem. We look sh1t in every area of the pitch. The only position where I think we actually look semi decent is on the flanks. We do have some quality in that position....the rest are all under the level we need to be at and we do not have the quality within the squad to rotate and keep players on their toes. This is why I was adamant, even in pre-season, why Ismael would only last until the international break in October. I stated this many times and it's because I knew it would all unravel by then. He'd be gone by 11 games. Now, this is where the fly in the ointment comes along. With this contract extension, the hierarchy may have boxed themselves into a corner. My prediction of him going over the break, may well now be incorrect, but the state the club will find themselves in after 11 games is still bang on. Far too many fans have been seduced by the 'Parlaci Gino' event and also by the QPR first half. The Q&A was all BS and the first half against QPR was a fluke, or at the very least an aligning of stars that will not replicate again with this group of players. What we're seeing now is an obvious (to me anyway) conclusion to the summer recruitment.
That’s definitely true regarding the gap between Serie A and the PL, but within Serie A the financial disparity is far, far smaller (the team who finish first in Serie A earn less in total prize money and TV money than the bottom side in the Premier league). They also have a ground with a 25k capacity which ranks around 10th in the league for size, so Udinese should find it far easier to compete in Serie A than Watford ever would in the PL, with a bit of smart ownership, and yet they’re circling the drain just like us, hard to imagine why…
The defence will always get the blame when we let in soft goals, but it's really a team problem. If you watch the first goal again, there are problems in many areas. 1. Chakvetadze gets turned like a dummy, which in itself shouldn't be a disaster, but... 2. Lewis reacts slowly to the fact that the full back has now cut inside with the ball and there's a run from midfield coming into the channel. 3. TDB gets confused. He starts tracking the run from midfield, then realises that Lewis probably has it covered and that he himself should be stopping the full back who is not sprinting unchallenged towards the defence. 4. Hoedt, for some reason, thinks that this right back has a thunderous left foot and goes all in to block the shot, which of course leaves him wide open to be turned inside out 5. TDB is just out of reach to make the final challenge because he's now lost in no mans land. Everything comes down to players reacting slowly to a simple situation in front of them, which makes me think that this is a combination of poor players and poor coaching. When the right back receives the ball it's a simple 2 v 4 situation. How on earth are they not able to cope with that? Literally 6 seconds later the ball is in the back of the net without any other player touching the ball, it's ridiculous.
Not to mention Hoedt's pathetic leg dangle after he gets done. I don't know how much of this is down to VI - it's the basics not being done. We're back to last season's culture where they all think someone else should step up and take responsibility. Individually, I expect most of the team would be fine in a team that had leaders and a good work ethic, but together, these shirkers can't / won't play competently or as a team. Nice one Pozzo. Hope you and Mogi really lined those pockets on this bunch of losers.
https://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/sport/23834900.watford-boss-kept-players-dressing-hour/ At least VI is as angry as we are.
Wonder if it might be time to play old man Livermore. Ok he's slow but supposedly is a leader and can at least organise the troops while he wanders about slowly in front of the back 4 ?
Who knew that our QPR game was actually our first relegation 6 pointer with the next one scheduled for Saturday fortnight with a newly fired-up Sheff Wed? Can only imagine that Colin's handwritten application is already sitting on Chansiri's desk and he'll be popping into Hillsborough for a chat in a day or so. And as ludicrous as it sounds, might we have been a bit premature in loaning out Ashley Fletcher and Joao Ferreira and selling WTE and Kabasele when viewing their replacements' efforts of late. I know, I know, what on earth are things coming to? Surely after Cardiff it'll all calm down and the earth will start spinning on its axis once again. Won't it....?
Hard to say, but I do think the coaching staff need to take a look at themselves when the players collectively collapse like that. Analysing one situation doesn't tell the whole story of course, but it shows that we're missing some totally basic things which makes every situation more difficult than it is, and eventually it breaks. I would like to think that dealing with situations like the one that lead to the first goal should be so drilled into the team that they would just react on instinct. It looks to me, though, that this is _not_ drilled into them and that they are trying to solve the situations as they appear in front of them, which leads to slow reactions and confusion, which leads to goals like that. I'm not a certified coach by any means, but just looking at that situation and with my limited footballing knowledge from when I played football as a kid it would appear fairly simple: Situation: Full back cuts inside with the ball and central midfielder runs diagonally towards the channel Solution: - LB (Lewis) tucks inside to cover the run into the channel - CML (TDB) challenges the full back - CBL (Hoedt) positions himself to cover if TDB gets turned I'm pretty sure most Under-16 kids knows this stuff, so why don't our senior players know this? Yep. Lewis' initially positioning and slow reaction to what the full back does, coupled with TDB not trusting his left back to do his job, is actually the main reason for the whole situation. Hoedt should do better in the one on one, but when defenders get exposed time and time again eventually they will get turned and are left as scapegoats.
Side note, ref was one of the worst we've had, for both teams. Bought every dive, but ignored clear fouls, to help even it up. Not that it made a difference, we could have had Ismael with a whistle in the middle and we'd have lost
Ah bless you. Nice to meet you, I’m at that desperation stage of reinventing Kayembe as some destructive ball winning beast in my head. Welcome to Watford Fans Anonymous.
The most depressing thing is that the pashun and commitment that we had heard so much about seems to have completely evaporated. If they played badly but at least fought for every ball and supported eachother the defeats would be easier to take based on their limited ability alone.
I thought it was about time we let him go, but considering we didn't bring in anyone to replace him, maybe not...
Hmm, because our midfield 3 in a 352 was so great last time, switching to a 343 with just Kayembe and TDB in there will somehow be enough?!
I was dredging back through the memory banks and the way we've started reminds me quite a lot of 1995-96, the last time we were relegated from the second tier. When you look at the list of players there's a sense that the squad isn't actually all that bad but when you see them play you realise they are just interchangeable. The ones waiting in the wings are no better than the ones on the pitch (but they're also no worse) so we've got a revolving door of players who aren't able to offer enough. Bayo, Healey and Rajovic is a case in point – all about 4 to 6 out of 10 players at this level. I don't want to be unkind to individuals but some of them could be transferred to, say, Exeter City in the next window and be out of the game in a couple of years' time. They look like people who are Championship players for no other reason than that they are on our books. When I see Manchester United play I often think that some of their players would evaporate if they didn't happen to have a Manchester United crest on their shirt. Next stop Burnley, then Rotherham. 'The Luke Chadwick Effect'. I think some of ours are like that – albeit their starting point is at a lower level. There are flickers but they are unable to put all the elements together at the same time. When they can score, they also concede. When they look decent at the back, they don't create anything up front. When the shape is good, the energy is low. When they're playing with some sort of commitment and pace, they're all over the place positionally. The early signs were decent – not just referring to the QPR game here because that really was a one-off against a woefully-prepared opponent. At Coventry I thought there were encouraging signs but it feels like that was us at our maximum and that we are seeing the true level now the initial impetus brought by the new coach has worn off a bit.
Out of the team who played yesterday, Bachmann, Ngakia, Sierralta, TDB and Louza are the only ones who have been at the club for any length of time. Ngakia, Sierralta and TDB don't seem like the kinds of players to completely down tools, kick up a major fuss, or be that influential either. And Bachmann for all his stroppiness hasn't been cited in the past as one of the players who wanted managers sacked and is currently our captain. It's not as if GKs usually have to work that hard anyway. Louza is the only one of our longstanding players out there yesterday who seems to have a poor attitude, but supposedly he's not even that popular in the dressing room anyway. So who exactly are these longstanding players that are trying to force a change of manager as they have done previously?
It's rather refreshing to have a coach who will call out the team for making schoolboy errors. I respect VI for that and good on him. Whether or not the players now will try to change or even care is another matter.
Whilst I agree that the players you mention don't seem to be the ones who will kick up a fuss, I think the issue is that simply they've been here through all the turmoil and as such they're expecting it so subconsciously turn off? It's not a deliberate thing but it's just so ingrained in the fabric of the club. The rot is at the top and quite simply nothing will completely change until that's cleared out
Not sure that's the issue. Sunderland weren't that good either until our defence parted at the end of the first half for their first goal. Sunderland have perhaps the youngest squad in the division, but it's not as if ours is old any more. Of the team we put out yesterday only Bachmann, Lewis and Hoedt are both aged 25 and above and have already done something in the game. The majority of the players out there are should still have plenty to prove going forwards.
Honestly though I reckon the players are immune to all this. This has to be towards the 10th time in the past few years we've heard about "harsh words" and "home truths". It simply doesn't work
When Chelsea lost 4-0 at Muff a few seasons back, Sarii kept them back for over two hours demanding a response in their next game. I cannot remember how that went, but it does show some managers will go that extra mile to try to find out the problems. Woy just shrugged his shoulders and laughed with the media for example. I do agree that most of the players' will probably not care about last night's post game rant, but as a fan you would like to think they would take some pride in what they do for the club most of us have supported for years.
Not going to beat a dead horse here by looking into every single situation, but just looking at the goals it's scary how we're not even doing the basics. Again, I think the coaching staff need to question if they're actually coaching the players properly or if the messages aren't coming across. Just look at the second goal: I think this came from a short corner or something, so it's not unexpected that the positioning is a bit chaotic, but seriously - how are Sierralta and Andrews not fulfilling their jobs here? Asprilla is putting pressure on the midfielder with the ball. You would expect Sierralta to cover the right winger and Andrews to fall back to cover the right side of our box, but no... Asprilla is clearly shocked that Sierralta is not covering (wrong caption, sorry). Meanwhile, Bayo seems to think that we're on a counter attack and has completely left the danger zone, now running towards midfield. Behind him there's a 4 v 3 situation materializing. Yep. At this point we're already doomed. Lewis has smelled the danger, but it's too late. Andrews has probably also realised (2-3 seconds too late) that he's not where he's supposed to be. There are three more Sunderland players in there against two center backs. Since everyone else has been dragged towards the ball there's also a glaring hole in front of our box for a pass or a rebound or a loose ball. What happens afterwards, with the lost duels, is not the real issue. The situation is already terrible. In this split second you have 8 Sunderland players actively involved in the situation and maybe 4-5 Watford players desperately trying to recover an already lost cause. I get that Porteous and Hoedt get a lot of stick because they're always in the thick of it when the final dual is lost or they get turned inside out like training cones. They're also extremely susceptible to sloppy passes, bad positioning and are generally not playing well. But the problem runs far, far deeper than just those two center backs.
He's terrible. VI clearly knows this as well even though they're mates as he avoids using him and prefers Kayembe (who though isn't that good either Is Except it's not even half the team or half the squad who have actually been here that long any more. Most of the players are fairly new. And the longstanding ones don't seem as if they should be that influential. Of course in order for the team to do well you really need all the players to be putting in the effort, but in theory we should have more players now with the required motivation than we had in the previous couple of seasons.
It's clearly shambolic. Our defenders are better than this, but they're just not doing their jobs. Whether it's a loss of form, or a deliberate act to force a change of manager, I don't know, but I've seen them play matches and have given up virtually no chances to the opponent. There were other things too, such as the Hoet pass straight to a Sunderland player, whilst under no pressure. This led to the clearance by Porto off the line. Hoet does this a lot. But even the clearance from Porto seemed to be one where he was thinking should I clear this or just let it trickle in. Seems to be a bizarre switching off from from Hoet, Porto and Louza collectively. They turn up for games, but are vacant during key moments making inexplicable mistakes or just not picking up runners. They are not doing this all the time, but just enough to make a difference in matches. Right now you can't trust these players, but we have to play them as we have no viable alternatives. Recruitment are chickens coming home to roost.
Probably 4132 or 442, definitely not a formation with a lone striker. I’d like to see TDB as the deeper midfielder as he is good on the ball and can go box to box if required. A midfield of Asprilla, TDB & Kone with the focus on keeping the ball but passing, moving and driving forward. If also like to see Martins pushed forward as a false 9 with space to run at defenders and link play with the main striker. At the moment that has to be Bayo or even Ince
Was watching our game last night but got quickly bored, (we were utterly inept), so switched over and watched the Geordies v PSG. How bad are things for any Watford fan to do that?
