Did we sign him for that though? He was vocal about having turned down bigger clubs than us to join. I’d say it’s more likely that we talked a good game to get him and then made a judgment call that worse players were somehow better than him in the summer.
It just seemed like we never really fancied him from day one, that’s what I meant about signing him because he was a good deal rather than because we liked him as a player. I’m just guessing ultimately, but Gino clearly signs players for the first team and players for the player trading model that he can profit from, and to me it seems he saw Zinc as falling into the latter category for whatever reason. If that is the case the ultimately that’s entirely stupid, especially when we have players like Sema in the squad.
It felt like the majority of posters thought he was crap last season. Interesting that there has been an apparent sea change there. Personally, I liked how attacking his mentality was, and the way he looked to move the ball forward in a way no one else in the squad did. I think he'd probably be a better squad option than Gosling and Tufan, but until we see him in a Premier League team it'll be hard to be sure.
He was basically what he is now. A decent enough Championship player with clear technical ability. Capable of really impressive moments, but also very capable of disappearing mid game. Didn't stand out for the second best team in the league, and isn't massively standing out consistently for a team bang in form and fighting for the play offs. Which isn't to say he wouldn't have potentially been a better option than Gosling/Tufan/Sema, but that doesn't mean he'd have been good enough. And looking at the minutes the above players have played, is it not more beneficial for us and him that he's playing regularly, rather than sat around as an emergency option?
That's the key question, really. It all comes down to how much he'd have played this season, and since we don't really know that I'm not going to be too critical about him going out on a loan where he has game time. It's not as if the likes of Gosling or Tufan have played much anyway.
I mean, in Tufan's case, the amount of minutes he got and how much he played weren't hugely correlated.
Any reason why this thread and my comments have triggered you into action tonight?! Just messing. I genuinely appreciate our greater sense of harmony recently so if anything I said (including the above) steps over a line, I apologise! I was childishly looking for a rise, I admit as much. We have all done it! I do stand by the fact that I think it has always been crazy, and another sign of Gino’s increasing lack of awareness regarding squad balance, that Zinckernagel is out on loan and performing whilst we not only retain, but actually play, some of the utter wasters we have in similar areas of the pitch. I find it odd beyond fair reason why some people are happy to talk down the things Zinckernagel is doing, yet equally talk up the non-existent things that those who are actually playing for us aren’t doing. It’s a difference of opinion which is fair - but it’s one of those I really struggle to understand.
We've Miguel Layuned him. Signed him, never played him in his preferred position in the Championship so he was fine but a bit underwhelming and then binned him off as soon as promoted, only for him to have a good season playing for another team in his actual position.
And he still put up good numbers that surpassed the vast majority of the squad in key metrics whilst being utilised badly. And he has been shipped out whilst Sema stayed and utter garbage like 34yr old Kucka was brought in. I have yet to see anyone post a good argument for why any of the above happened.
The problem I have with radar Viz’s like that is it doesn’t really provide any context. Any viz without passes received is invaluable imo
There was a slim possibility that Kucka might have been good, but we already knew that zinc wasn't up to scratch so that one is easy to understand. But Sema? I've got nothing.
I don't think there's any chance he will want to be here next season. He could even be passing us in the summer. Looks settled and happy there and good luck to him.
What’s his passes received like? If I had to guess I think he is not as much of a fulcrum as we/Forest expected him to be because of Johnson’s rapid rise has meant he’s the main threat all of a sudden.
I agree with you re. Sema. I disagree about Zinckernagel but your hit rate is far higher than mine so I know better than to argue…! However, Zinckernagel does look good aesthetically - and when your squad has a high gargoyle-factor like ours does, we shouldn’t be just getting rid of these gems. I know you agree with this much at least.
Agree 100%. I couldn't even tell you who our best looking player is these days. How depressing is that!
I know you like Zinc but lets not pretend he's ripping up The Championship or that he looked brilliant for us last season. He has 4 goals and 5 assists in 28 games. That's not bad but not brilliant either. I don't think he would have played much this season and is at the right level for his ability
In half a season? If he keeps up those numbers, that’s very good over a season. The numbers he has put up since being in England are fantastic - it’s undeniable! Good enough for the PL? Who knows as he’s never played in it. But I suspect he would have offered more than some of those who have played plenty for us this season.
He's not even a regular under Cooper. But now Grabban is out for a few months he will get more minutes. Zinckernagel didn't get opportunities to play regular minutes for us in a position that complements his abilities but saying that he still popped up with assists and a goal. I honestly believe he will go this Summer whether we stay up or not.
He has started every game bar 3 under Cooper. Unless your standard for ‘regular’ is that he has to have started every single one of their 30 odd games so far, then I don’t know how you can say he isn’t one? Cooper has started him in the overwhelming majority of the games he’s been there for.
I don't think Zinc is good enough to be a regular starter for us, but I do think he is more than capable of being a regular bench squad player. He is very versatile and those sort of players are great for any team as they can act as cover for more than one position and do a reasonable job when they are asked to step up. As others have said he is probably a better option that others we have in our 25 man squad at present and I for one would not mind seeing him back with us next season whichever league we are playing in as a backup squad player rather than a 1st team starter.
Well this is directly from a Forest so I'd tend to believe him more than you on Nottingham Forest matters. He's started every game bar 5! Only completing the 90 on three occasions out of the 21 Cooper has been in charge. He also added that the arrival of Davis from Villa would probably given him even less minutes and starts but Grabbons injury has changed this and expects Zinc to get more minutes because of this.
His numbers on Transfermarkt and other stat sites are public record. You can believe him, I don’t mind but you said he’s not been a regular under Cooper and that’s not true - your Forest supporting mate saying it doesn’t change that! If you’d said he rarely finishes 90 mins, then I’d definitely agreed. But then we also have players like that…
Looking at his stats he's been largely average for Forest. Is he better than Sema? Yep. Was he as likely to be willing to sit on his arse most the season like big Ken? Probably not.
My Forest supporting mate says he’s the best Forest player of all time. Even better than Collymore. See, it’s easy.
