Gaza/Israel

i dont think that you did no!

 

Not originally anyway

 

Priests didn't use religion as an an excuse.
Paedophiles used a position of trust to abuse children and the response from by the church was extremely badly dealt with. Those men were paedos first, priests second.

You can't go around saying religion in general is evil because of the things you listed. Today at uni the Christian society were giving out free lunch by my lecture, and it would be stupid to say therefore religion is awesome.

 

exactly

 

You shouldn’t dwell on the "root of all evil" comment.....it's not meant literally, it's just a line said millions of times. I explained more thoroughly that once filtered through an evil mind or minds, religion can be used to control the sheep. It is very emotive and a form of control.

There is nothing wrong with praying to an idol, if you have one or many gods, but throughout history there are examples of death and destruction connected to religion. Human sacrifices were common throughout history.

In ancient Egypt they used the bury the servants alive once their king died. Phoenicians and Carthaginians sacrificed infants to their gods. There is archaeological evidence of human sacrifice in Neolithic to Eneolithic Europe, and allusions to sacrifice can be found in classical mythology.

Celtic Druids engaged in human sacrifice, as did Slavic, Germanic, Indian and Chinese cultures.

The thirty years war was between Protestants and Catholics. The Crusades was between Islam and Christianity.

The Taiping Rebellion was a widespread civil war in southern China. It was led by Christian convert Hong Xiuquan, who, having claimed to have received visions, maintained that he was the younger brother of Jesus Christ.....a bit like David Icke!!

The Jewish-Roman wars, the English civil war, the Schmalkaldic Wars were all wars based on religion. The list goes on.

 

I've not said any of this. Your interpretation is wrong here. Please read what I have written before making these comments.

I'm not saying that religion is evil, per se, just as a gun is not a deadly on its own. Religion is used as a tool to control people and conceal evil deeds, just as a gun in the wrong hands can be a murder weapon. This is the point I'm making.

 

Religion as it should be read/portrayed isn't usually bad (some quotes can be interpreted in bad ways but as a whole...). The issue is that people use religion in a bad way. If you told someone blow up others just because you wanted them to.... would they do it? Most likely not. If you told them to do it because the almighty God who will look after you in the afterlife wants you to..... well if the unfortunate person is ignorant enough to buy into it then that's a weapon.

People seem to fight just because of differing religious views. Sure, people fight over all kinds of things... race, origin, colour etc... but religion is quite a big one especially considering how it can take over people's lives.

Well firstly what I meant is that Palestine has two parts and Gaza is the much smaller. If they want to get out of Gaza just go to the other part?

All these neighbouring countries moaning at Israel when they themselves won't do any better is the sad part. If you don't want them, why should Israel? They could more easily integrate into the society of these other Islamic countries, where as trying to get more land from Israel or integrating with them is a pretty bad idea, for everyone (except the other countries of course).

 

You originally made a statement, that you later clarified by changing. I really cant see that there is much benefit of talking about religion on a football forum. The reason that i responded was that what you wrote, could actually be found to be offensive by some people and maybe needed to be better written, you have since clarified what you meant. Lets move back to whats important and thats Watford getting promoted this season.

 

Happy to talk about Watford, but this particular thread is about the Gaza/Israel conflict. It's pretty hard to talk about it without bringing in religion.

 

the last few pages show why religion is bad IMO

 

IMO ?

Confirmed , YOU are a burd

 

Religion also saves lives? Give's people hope. Suicide rates are through the roof? Why? Because people have nothing to turn too, they don't fear a higher being so when things get bad they turn to a bottle thinking that this is the only way. If they had belief things would be different.

Although I agree religion can lead to evil things it is stupid to say it is the root of all evil, it is all down to man's interpretation and man's mind. There are verses in the Quran for example with 90% of Muslims views in one way whereas the other 10% (the idiots) see it in another way and decide to go kill innocent people. Unfortunately that is the problem with religion.

As for Israel it's not about Jew's it is about Zionists. Not all Jew's are Zionists and not all Zionists are Jew's. However nearly all Israelis are Zionists.

Finally, this is not a war, it is genocide of the Palestinian people. I could go on for a while but I don't want to bore anyone.

 

Anyone who is religious is a bender. Fact.

 

Dare anyone to say that to Muhammad Ali 15 years ago.

 

Going back to the original point (don't think we're going to reach a conclusion to the above).

There is supposedly an unofficial ceasefire happening later today, as they weren't getting anywhere with it being 'official' as too many issues to sort out (ha!). Hopefully will last.

 

As I said previously, religion is what you make it. It's just there and can be used for good things too. Some people believe it's actually real though(quite a lot really), just as I thought Santa Clause was real when I was a kid.....(sorry if I let the cat out of the bag there for some).

The thing is once you grow up you realise Santa, the tooth fairy, bogeyman don't really exist. For some reason that realisation does not occur with religion. It's quite bizarre. We all laugh at the Ancient Egyptians. Did you know they worshipped 81 different gods? People consider that crazy now.

In a thousand years’ time the religions that are around today could well be viewed in a similar way.

 

In your opinion though, yes? I'm the same as you in that I don't believe there is a god. But some people do and who are we to tell them they're wrong? They might find it bizarre that we don't believe.

 

Absolutely. If anyone wants to sit on a little mat, face Mecca and pray five times a day, that's entirely up to them. They are NOT wrong in doing this, just as people that believe in ghosts and aliens are not wrong to go to a spooky house or sit outside Area 51 in the hope of seeing a UFO. But when your beliefs overspill and inspire you to kill innocent people then it is clearly wrong and I do have a problem with it.

 

Why, was he still in the closet then?

 

how else do you float like a butterly and sting like a *****?

 

But you can believe a 'big bang' caused the Earth to be created? I on the opposite end find your views as funny as you find the fact a god may exist.

Beliefs isn't the reason they kill innocent people, it is themselves

 

Well tested scientific models which are demonstrated by observable and measurable fact are hilarious. Comedy gold.

 

I'm quite surprised at the amount of support the Israeli government has on here. It's a country ran by Zionist war-hunger lunatics who clearly don't want peace in the middle east.

Everything the State of Isreal stands for smacks of double standers and hypocrisy.

 

Nope...did I mention a 'big bang' theory? You're making assumptions to what I think from out of nowhere.

If you think a god or a couple of gods exist, then fine. I'm happy for everyone that has these beliefs. The thing is you'd better make sure you support the correct one or else you'll be in trouble. God clearly has a massive ego because he wants to be worshipped every 5 minutes and he won't be best pleased if you've been cheering on the opposition.

He must sit there and think....oh no not again.....here they go moaning.....but for some reason they call it prayer. I mean, what's that all about.

Did you know Jesus' mother was a virgin??.....wow....did they not teach biology? Amazing she's got away with that one for over 2000 years. I think she just didn't want to get into trouble with her parents because she was only 12 when she gave birth. Holy Spirit?? yeah right, that Joseph has a lot to answer for.

 

Ceasefire broken by Hamas already CNN confirmed.

https://twitter.com/bencnn/status/271345873169027072

With religion, nobody cares if you want to privately hold beliefs or worship. The problem is when you dictate those beliefs to others, use them to persecute people or try to use them to justify public acts or political ones.
Hitchens relates it to toys. Play with your toys at home, but do not bring your toys to my house or in public, and do not try to stop me playing with my toys. In Hitch's case his toys were alcohol tobacco and condoms presumably.

 

Like has been said before, who are we to question anybodies beliefs? No need to be quite as patronizing HB1.

 

It doesn't. There is no evidence to suggest that religious people are more moral, however there is evidence to suggest that religious people feel more guilty for supposed wrongdoings when compared to non-religious people.

Even hypothetically supposing religion did save lives, which not for a moment I am conceding, the idea it saves lives does not logically lead to the fact there must be a God. Pascals wager has long since been critiqued fully. Any assertion that it is better to believe just in case or for purely instrumental reasons are inauthentic and inconsistent.

In other news not previously mentioned I don't think, A terror attack on a Tel Aviv bus injured 28. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20425352

 

Patronising. Don't you start going all American on us!

And HB1 - although you are saying it's fine for people to beleive in religion, you are mocking it quite a lot. You probably don't like it when people go on about religion, so to then go on about your own beliefs is hypocritical.

 

Patronizing to some is actually reductio ad absurdum to others.

 

[video=youtube;OZjAaT1AC-4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZjAaT1AC-4&feature=youtube_gdata_player[/video]

Very interesting......

 

And Hamas is a pillar of honesty and peace loving innocents.....

 

mossad inside job? wouldn't be the greatest shock in the world.

 

Well, not quite. But Israel is far more of a greater threat to global security than Hamas.

 

Reductio ad absurdum to some, is sounding like a teenager in a chat-room with a superiority complex to others. (Not referring to HB1 here)