Watford FC 3-3 Tranmere Rovers - 04/01/2020 & 1-2 AET 23/01/2020

So are Liverpool.

That 6-0 bumming really hurt and I don’t want to go through it again so soon.


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Somewhat surprisingly I have some sympathy for the hb1 and Relegation Certs positions here.

I've supported WFC for over 58 years now and have always wanted us to win every match and always will. It's a no brainer. So wanting us out of the cup to concentrate on the league is for me utter b.llocks. That doesn't mean that Pearson was necessarily wrong in the team selection he made but that 'needs must' approach given the potential for four matches in nine days was principally down to the powers that be deciding that was an OK schedule. It wasn't. It's an obscenity that that should be required of any club in two important competitions simply to suit TV scheduling. Surely seeing as we put a man on the moon 50 years ago it shouldn't be beyond the wit of football authorities to organise a reasonably regular schedule across the season. Sod international breaks.

Anyway, getting booted out of the cup because we were forced to field a sub-standard team is an entirely different thing to wanting us out of the competition for our own good. The latter view is utter crap.

 

I agree it hurt, that's why I want revenge asap, rather than meekly surrendering our finalists tag. Liverpool are better, yet we lost narrowly 2-0 at their place and were unlucky to do so.

 

I think Gomes should have played both ties for sure. He would have been stronger than Bachmann. His experience, especially with all those youngsters around, would have been very beneficial. Success would have been an improvement as well. Even though he was not that great in the first game, he has to play in this type of fixture or else what's the point of him being here.

I don't think we needed a major uplift on personnel to have got through this tie, but it was slightly weaker than it should have been and that made all the difference.

 

huh this is a good post. There should still have been first teamers on the bench though.

 

That's fine with hindsight but we were all screaming for Bachman to play earlier in the season after he'd had a great loan in the Scottish prem. We needed to see what he is made of and whether he is a serious prospect. We know the answer now but playing a 38(?) yo Gomes when we have 2 "promising" young keepers on the books, one of whom has international caps for Sweden, the other itching to prove himself after a successful loan can't be the answer surely ? As for Success, I'm sure the coaches have given up on him and he will leave one way or another this month. I'd be very worried if they saw it more important to test him vs Tranmere than give a chance to our new wonderkid from Brazil.

 

Don’t care that we lost; we weren’t going to win the cup. 3rd round defeat, 4th round, 5th... who cares. Not winning the cup is not winning the cup.

The U23s got another (or in many cases a first) taste of men’s football and now Pearson and his staff can focus on the league.

Not “embarrassing”, nor a morale breaker. At worst an interesting experiment.

 

Average age of the team last night was 23 years old - Cholevas at 35 shows how young and inexperienced it was.

I was more upset by Tuesday's defeat, last night...meh.

 

Yes, fair points. But when you have an inexperienced backline, and you have a quality keeper like Gomes with all his experience to call on, why not use him. We saw Bachmann in the first game. It was his bad error that contributed to the replay, so did he really deserve to retain his place?

 

If the club were offered a chance to skip last nights match, they would have taken it.

 

That's pretty much what that selection represented, imo.

 

Welcome to the winners enclosure.

 

Indeed, welcome to that enclosure where you get to claim Sarr is useless and Chalobah finished.

 

We certainly didn't play with a smile on our faces when we lost at home to Arsenal last season after the Cup SF (with Deeney getting that moronic red card).

Also, directly after beating Palace in the QF last season we played Man Utd (in the PL) and with our confidence obviously soaring... we lost.

 

You've never seen either of them play live. What would you know about it?

 

I disagree. Winning that FA Cup semi-final was one of the best moments I've had supporting Watford. I wouldn't change that for the world. A brilliant day. It put a smile on everyone's face, even yours I suspect.

 

Considering they in general fared pretty well against a League One side (drawing both legs over 90 minutes) while still only mostly between the ages of 18-20 then at least a few of them should.

I reckon Spencer-Adams could well be a lower PL defender, at least the level of Dawson and Mariappa anyway (yeah not the highest bar haha rofl etc.).

Dalby has already performed well in League Two as a 17 year-old. Hard to tell at this stage with us where his ceiling will be given his age and lack of time with us, but I reckon minimum League One or Championship (with an outside chance of PL).

Dele-Bashiru should be a Champ regular minimum, also with an outside chance of PL regular somewhere.

Quina, not convinced he's suited enough to the PL to make it as a regular every week, but I reckon he could become a regular for a lower-third team in the top division of maybe Spain or Italy.

Whelan and Bennett no chance PL, probably not even Championship. Can't tell beyond that.

Hungbo and Hinds, no idea, not seen enough of them.

 

You have and you wrote them off...seems your logic is somewhat flawed, cupcake.

 

I really didn't care that much. And we weren't even talking about it in that context, it was with regards to the positive effect (or rather lack thereof) on the players going in to the games following the Cup (because the most important thing to us right now is winning the league games).

 

Non-sequitur.

He's not talking about the fans feel good factor, he specifically cited the team's league form following the FA Cup victories which you claimed were correlated.

Well done on attempting to skew his argument, but if you can directly address his comments and keep it relevant, I'd be interested.

 

what, the players are bound to be more confident after a good win. Just because they lost to man utd doesnt mean they werent feeling good beforehand. Perhaps they'd have lose more heavily if we'd lost in the cup the week before anyway.

Anyone who's ever played football knows that winning breeds winning (I know that rules out most of this forum).

 

Yes, but the players who played last night were not the same players who played Villa, or who will play Everton.

I can't see that last night will have negatively affected the confidence of the first team. Granted, it won't have improved it - and if we had won and then gone on to beat ManU, presumably with some first teamers involved, that might have restored some of the confidence lost by the Villa defeat. To me, that was why last night was disappointing: that opportunity has been missed. But, now we have lost, I can't see it will make player confidence worse. Any ongoing lack of confidence stems from Tuesday, not last night.

 

There's always some type of agenda on this forum and always some deliberate attempt to twist things or redirect. I've not skewed anything. I'm talking about the fans, not the players and have done so in all my takes on this.

So if you're going to wade in, understand what you're talking about, or else your just stirring the pot for your own jollies.

 

And the Arsenal match after Wolves (where we were garbage). Just saying "the players are bound to be more confident after a good win" doesn't make it true. There is no evidence to suggest that's the case. Meanwhile, it did not seem coincidental that our form nosedived directly after the Wolves SF.

The players are more likely to be tired, that's for sure. Confident? See above.

I played football every weekend for my secondary school's team, at Uni, and then for my school's 'Old Boys' team - usually the cup games and league games were further apart than the situation Watford currently find themselves in, and the league games never had hundreds of £millions riding on them...

Sure, winning can breed winning, but that's not necessarily the case when it's different competitions, which bring out different mentalities. It especially is not necessarily the case when it's completely different sets of players being used for the League and Cup games.

 

I've played football to a decent level, what I can tell you is beating a team 2 divisions lower in a cup game, then playing against a team higher in your league in the next game has no impact. Play the stiffs against lower league teams and they win, great. If they lose, doesn't impact the 1st team.

Had it been the first team who lost last night, you'd have a point.

But the crucial point it wasn't the first team who lost, it was our under 23s with some fringe first teamers who gained minutes in their legs. If you think the first team squad are going to be overcome with a general malaise because the youngsters lost to journeymen cloggers on a quagmire then give up now, there's no going back for you....but it will have no impact...Tuesday will have had more of an impact.

 

Very amusing: bemoans others for claiming they're trying to "twist things or redirect" and immediately follows that by twisting things and redirecting himself.

Though really your statement "I'm talking about the fans, not the players and have done so in all my takes on this" isn't just twisting things, it's a straight up lie. Case in point, I refer you to your comment below, which was you responding to davidmsawyer's statement that "this will have no impact on the confidence of our first team":

Watford FC 3-3 Tranmere Rovers - 04/01/2020 & 1-2 AET 23/01/2020

 

So if we're going to talk about twisting, let's look at the conversation.

Two examples were provided regarding form following the Palace and Wolves victories in which we lost both the following games.

Your response was the feel good factor for fans. How is that relevant to the defeats in which you said confidence should be high?

Sorry but you tried to twist because you argument was flawed and proven to be unreliable.

So go for it, try and twist it again as I can carry on beating you up with your own words.

 

Ah but did we though? Who knows...

 

Yes, I was talking about the fans. The mood on the terrace so to speak.

How would a team consisting of reserve squad and U23’s affect the first team? Doesn’t make much sense to me. It’s the fans who carry this over in their heads. Bad week, no wins in three, 2 defeats etc. Anxiety transcends from the crowd to the team and this is what affects the team.

You can see how a toxic atmosphere can affect a side, just as a positive one affects it the other way.

You got this wrong, but it’s not my fault you don’t understand even though I’ve explained my thought process. Happy to receive your apology for calling me a liar in good faith though.

 

lowerrous is right, none of us have played for teams where a completely different set of players has been used for different tournaments so he's right that we cannot know the feeling that is given when that team loses. And of course Tuesday will have had more of an impact.

But winning is ALWAYS better than losing. Football at the top level is about fine margins. The feel good factor a cup run brings might just have made all the difference against everton.

Facing them after smashing tranmere for 5 then man united at home will have had a positive effect. The fans would have been buzzing and that transmits to the fans.

It's why liverpool are doing so well, because on ability alone they are not this much better than everyone else

 

How did the positive atmosphere following Wolves at Wembley affect he team on the pitch?

 

The manager was at fault for the downturn in form. He let the players think their objectives were complete. Pearson would not make that mistake.

 

Meh. I remember filling my boots one cup game and the next league game I was walking on air strutting around like Frank McAvennie. Soon wore off but still.

 

I agree winning is better than losing, but you have to put last night into context.

The first team played 2 tough games in 4 days, to put them into contention 2 days after that following a gruelling Xmas period, you're asking for trouble with injuries in an already depleted squad. Then 3 days later had they won, face a Manure team in another tough game, it's a big ask.

We'd have a tired squad facing a massively important game against Everton. I'd personally prefer a rested and healed (to a certain extent) team against them because 3 points before the winter break is paramount.

The FA Cup will be back next year, hopefully we'll be in a better position to challenge as a Premier League team with a fully fit squad. right now...it's not a priority.