News soon on Jokanovic's future

But it can go a helluva way towards stopping you being miserable

 

Sure. But I can't remember a time when £1m p.a. + bonuses would ever have made me miserable.

 

Just generous rather than 'incredibly generous' though.

 

I'd like the Pozzos to see the error of their ways and keep their next head coach until - or unless - he fails. Their idea of stability is to keep everyone except the head coach - even the adsurd Nani lasted a couple of years, which was at least a year longer than was needed to see that he hadn't a clue.

 

By definition no, if we knew what the going rate was.

But I'm not sure the same applies to a head coach/manager. The skill sets are the same whatever league you're in, and if you're a good manager/head coach you survive in the Prem if your players are good enough. If they're not, you don't. You also fail if the "show us yer medals" brigade undermines you. Joker has proved that he can control and improve this group of players, so as far as I'm concerned, he's shown he has what it takes. Just like that young inexperienced bloke we got from Lincoln City all those years ago.

We'll have to wait and see whether Florrie has what it takes to run a team in English football.

 

The god analogy would work if Jokanovic was offered a huge increase on this years money to go to Derby to get them promoted, and be in charge of all recruitment, training and selection.

 

Assuming we escape relegation (which I believe we will...some of the teams who stayed up were incredibly average to poor), that would amount to 2 million for a year's work.

When you consider the reported wages of Monk et. al per this thread....yes, I do fee that is incredibly generous for a manager who hasn't yet taken charge of a single Premier League game. It's 4 times more than Monk's reported salary for his first year, and twice Monk's salary even if we went down!

 

Does anyone know the amount of bonus the Joka got for promotion?

 

The Sun reported a fortnight ago that Watford had offered £1m plus survival bonus, while Joka and his new British agent wanted a £2.5m three-year deal.

Ignore Samuel, he talks out of his enormous arse almost the entire time.

 

No, you said you want Jokanovic to take over another Premier League team so he could finish above us, what is wrong with you? It's funny because the last head coach change we made worked out pretty well didn't it? McKinlay didn't fail did he, would you rather we'd kept him last season then? Keeping Jokanovic sounds like it's been taken out of Gino's hands anyway with his wage demands, how this is the Pozzos fault I don't know. And how dare they get us a European cup winning coach instead of paying Jokanovic millions of pounds a year. The b@stards.

 

Agree with H23. Why on earth wait for failure. Surely coaches should be like players, an ambitious club should be continually trying to improve on what it has. And now is the optimum time.

 

Exactly. Hoban was part of the squad that got promotion but if we sign Heurtaux along with Prodl, we won't be seeing much of Tommie next season.

 

What world do you live in? .... Joka served out his contract and got his well earned bonus and by his own statement was under no illusion regarding his future at the club. - As a self employed contrator, I and hundreds of thousands of others work under exactly these conditions, some more heppy to than others.

Joka's a team coach yet you seem to confuse his job with the GT role, there's really nothing that could be more different.

 

Those figures have to be ball-park accurate, and hus my gut feeling at the beginning was correct - frustration at Joka. What a HUGE opportunity this was for him. I could understand if he didn't feel wanted, but that's a very good offer, and he's flatly turned it down...incredible.

One season away from PL money going insane, one good PL season away from his reputation being worldwide. He's at a club at the beginning of an exciting cycle, and he had the chance to lead us into that cycle. It seems so unlike him, too. What with the money and memories comment he made after promotion. Sad, really. After all that time it appears he didn't desperately want to be here, not the other way around.

 

No. It's twice the salary that Monk was offered for having precisely NIL experience in management/head coaching at all in the entirety of the universe anywhere ever. No Serbia, no Thailand, no getting us promoted, in fact eff all. Neither have you any idea whatsoever of what bonuses Garry Monk has gleaned.

Of course the Joka's worth way more than Garry Monk's initial wage. What Garry Monk's worth now is an entirely different matter and he'll no doubt be negotiating it.

 

How do we know we've improved on what we had? We'll have to wait a few month to know that.

Should we swap Deeney for Wilson or Bamford, who are younger and have scored lots of goals?

 

My caveats were that it wouldn't cost us anything other than the bonus you get for finishing 9th rather than 10th, or 15th rather than 16th. I choose my words carefully.

 

As you say, it seems so like Joker to cast aside a reasonable offer. But it seems very Joker to say **** you to a derisory offer. That's one of the main reasons why I assume he had the lowest of the various reported offers.

 

This makes me sad. I rate the lad; hope he gets a chance!

 

Yes, if Deeney asked for 100k a week and wouldn't sign a contract...

 

That's simply not true. You and I know nothing about Monk's ability or his value to behind the scenes work, but Swansea did and they appointed him because they thought he was the best man for the job. If they had reservations about his ability, they would not have put him into the position.

Having been at the club for a long time he was in a good position to fill the role at the club. He was also very much a known quantity since they'd be working with him for ages. The fact he hadn't worked in Thai league was largely irrelevant; he was an internal candidate well versed in the way the role worked.

Internal and external appointments do not work the same way. With an external appointment, you have no idea of how they work close up and you have to judge their suitability for the role on their record elsewhere. With an internal appointment, you're much more aware of the capabilities of the person and whether or not they're likely to be a success.

We can speculate about Monk's bonuses all we want, but I think it's extraordinarily unlikely that he was in line to make 1.5 million of bonuses.

Swansea are an established Premier League team flirting with European football every year. They're not going to appoint Bobby McClueless just as a cheap option. We can argue about the relative merits of winning the Thai league and (almost) the Championship versus 10 years at a club, but no matter how you slice it that does not equate to it being reasonable to expect to double the (reported) basic wage of a manager at a top half Premier League club right after your club just got promoted.

Swansea have been in the Premier League for four years; we've been in it for four weeks. Perspective is king.

 

Of course we don't "know"!

H23 was responding to a post that suggested we should wait for Joka to fail before replacing him. I was just saying that if the owners think they can improve on him anyway, then they should do so.

You had better get used to it. We have a squad full of players that havn't "failed", but they wil still get replaced. We need a Premiership standard now, not a second tier level.

 

Fact is that a high proportion of newly promoted clubs struggle in the Prem. Replacing the manager is common. Imagine we were bottom of the table at Christmas, we'd have to pay Slav 6.25m to go.

Ludicrous, he overpriced himself.

 

Quite honestly, that's probably the best way of looking at it. It's pretty stark when looked at in those terms.

 

Quite, if there is one thing that anyone who works as an employed person should know, there is absolutely no obligation on either side beyond the contract of employment between the two parties.

Go to work, do a good job, get paid, go home. When that stops working go your separate ways.

When it came to the negotiations between Slav & Gino, it could have gone a few ways:-
- Gino put in a low ball offer knowing Slav wouldn't accept
- Gino / Slav had different opinions of Slav's worth and a deal couldn't be struck
- Slav put in a high ball offer knowing Gino wouldn't accept

Could certainly have been he last scenario; family settled in Spain, sick of living out of a suitcase, doesn't want to appear to be turning down a plum job etc.

 

The argument seems to have polarised between whether Joka is a better financial bet than Flores, yet I think what Unhappy, Kelso and others like me were initially suggesting is that the Pozzo's ruthlessness doesn't always sit well with Watford's long held values of fairness and decency.

People are naturally happy to turn a blind eye to the methods for as long as results keep coming in but, as we see in other walks of life, success breeds arrogance, breeds contempt. For as much as I would never wish for the Pozzo's not to be at the helm, I fear they're in danger of forgetting what makes Watford the club it is.

 

Is Watford the kind of club to hand a Head Coach a 3 year deal on £2.5m a week then?

 

A £390m deal probably is slightly beyond us this summer.

 

Greedy greedy Joka






ahem

 

Sorry, thought my use of the word Yet made it clear that to some of us the money isn't the point; it's how people are treated.

 

I much prefer the way it is now to before when it was a case of our manager getting fed up of having no financial support and jumping ship, or being poached by a team like bloody Reading.

 

I'm sure Joka has been very well treated ... it's you, Kelso and that sad bunny that feel hard done by. Admit it.

You want him to stay in case Flores flops ... though it would be totally the opposite IMO.

 

How has Joka been treated? Or rather mistreated?

 

Yep good point. I guess in an age of greed those that do the honourable thing are in the minority. Shame really.