[SOLD] Luis Suarez

Or people with a grasp of reality?

 

Not really.....if the price would be €10m, I'm sure those defending it would be saying the exact same thing. Great deal by the club, as if it's the best deal anyone could have done.

Selling good players for low prices is not a good thing people. It's just the consequence of poor ownership/management over the past 18 months.

 

Let’s see what the club say though if/when it’s announced? They were pretty transparent in alluding to the fact that Estupinan had no interest in being here. If the same is true of Suarez, I would expect a similar kind of statement. If they don’t, then there will be question marks over this...

I have my own thoughts on it. But I’m gonna hold off until it’s confirmed as that should tell us more one way or the other. No point getting stressed about it yet.

 

Do you think money grows on trees or something? We need cash, and unfortunately this is real life and not football manager, we can't flog Dawson for £30m

 

Suarez is the equivalent of a 27 year old who has had a couple of decent seasons in League 1 and was previously released by Southend at age 25?

There is no limit to the mental gymnastics people will perform to defend Pozzo’s inadequacies.

 

€15mil does seem low; I can only hope he was 5hite in training.

 

There’s a bit of truth in that. It’s a really bad time to have to sell players we wouldn't otherwise have had to sell. Lack of clubs wanting to spend and our obvious need to sell pushes prices down.

 

We could have given him to Luton for free and some would defend the move.

A Spanish Europa League level club gets a player of ours on the cheap and we say he would never have been good enough for the Championship anyway.

Nuttiest fans out there.

 

I'm not defending the Pozzos here, their incompetence is one of the reasons why we're here in the first place, but Covid has hit clubs in Europe harder, €20m+ would be unusual for a good Segunda striker at the best of times, let alone with Covid. Just have to bite the bullet I suppose, the sales are starting to add up now, hopefully this means we can make some actual buys rather than just go for freebies from Udinese

 

You may be right, but the problem with Cucho is either the failure to obtain a work permit or a delay in obtaining a Spanish passport. I think that there is a greater possibility that he will play for Watford (instead of refusing to do so like Estupinan and Suarez) if he can obtain a work permit. He did tweet earlier in the year that he expected to play for Watford this season, although relegation may have changed his attitude. It is possible that Cucho has a stronger affiliation to the club than Estupinan and Suarez because he spent time at the training ground on two occasions while he was recovering from an operation last season whereas I doubt that the other two players had ever visited Watford's training ground before this summer.

 

Honest question, where did people think the money was going to coming from? Who were you expecting to leave and for how much?

 

I don't think anyone ia arguing it's a bad deal for us. What people are justifying though is the current COVID Financial market and our own club's potential immediate survival. The reality is we have lost our biggest draw for a lot of prospective signings and current signings and have to spend in accordance. We can see in the currently known financial state we are in we were continually loaning more each year to maintain our PL status and this has ultimately caught up to us, ironically by not following the model that has been established already.

Also, we have seen a lot of arguments to form team unity given our previous Season or two. We will only achieve this with players who are commited to the cause. Ngakia has said there have been players who haven't treated training seriously (Presumably those who didn't want to stay or were not commited, so likely Estupinan, Suarez, Pereyra etc) which would undermine Ivic's work and our promotion chances. You can't demand unity for a whole group while others aren't willing to buy into it, whether it's actively or passively. To me, it appears you're blind to the issue that we aren't in the same position of power currently whilst also trying to give Ivic the best chance of success and doing what he wants which we have been asking us to do for a few years now.

You seem to want your cake and eat it here which is surprising as you make very good and rational contributions which I normally agree with. Not to say our recent recruitment and decisions have been good; Janmaat's and Success' contracts being obvious recent choices.

Losing Doucoure, Estupinan, Suarez etc are dissapointing for sure and I like you and not happy with this particular deal which isn't mutually exclusive to also accepting that it's for a net greater good if we can get that mostly up front that will help us reinvest now into talents who do want to help us succeed such as Sarr, Hughes, Pedro etc. Sure we could loan him out and bring him back later, but what message does that send to the squad? That you can down tools and cherry pick when you want to be at the club at a later date when it suits them? It's better to cut out a playter who has this attitude as they will down tools when things go against them, but you also can't begrudge him wanting a move to a Europa league playing club either when interest in him is high and material as well, not just rumours which will inevitably boost his career than playing a year in the Championship.

We have Gray, Perica, Pedro, Deeney, (Unfit) Murray, (Poor) Welbeck (Likely to leave) and Pussetto (He has generaly been a striker) but we need a clinical, proven striker who has some pace. Loan Vydra from Burnley for example?

 

Excellent business. Gray, Deeney and Minty are all double figure strikers. Happy days.

 

Quite. There have been very few bids for our players, and the club needs money. I also think the club deserve credit for finding players like Suraez and Pervis and selling at a profit. If you don’t sell anyone because valuations aren’t met, you end up in massive debt and starring down the barrel of a administration with a points deduction. Simples. Leeds took 16 years to recover from the financial mess that their owners caused by over-committing. No thanks

 

The Segunda striker Suarez outscored went for already went for 20m though.

That was a clear marker we should have told other clubs to meet.

Can't imagine mega club Almeria are in a better financial situation than us.

 

Doucoure and Estupinan have gone for what I expected. Suarez is about €5-10m below what I expected. Pereyra I'm guessing is €8m but that's purely my own guess which is a low but feasible figure.

I expect:

Femenia for £3m
Dawson for £3m
Capoue for £3m (Wages seem bigger problem than cost)
Pussetto for £7m
Deulofeu for £22m (Loan with obligation)
Welbeck for £5m

Oh yeah, Foulquier was sold for something like £3m too.

 

Think it will just be a straight up swap with Troost Ekong

 

There have been lists before that read something like;

Gray £15m
Deeney £10m
Doucoure £35m
Capoue £10m
GD £30m.
Etc

 

Think you can easily discard any suggesting we would get money for Deeney.

We are going to have to pay someone to take him off our hands (at least in the form of subsidising his wages)

 

I think they all would have been here this season had we stayed up. Now none of them will. One of the most very frustrating things about relegation is that it happened right at the point where he had three exciting talents to add to the squad but the harsh reality is that Championship football holds no attraction to these players. Pedro will be off at the end of the season if we don't get promoted, might get one more season if we do.

I doubt Cucho is attached to us at all. He's probably quite attached to getting in the Colombia team and playing top flight football and he's not going to get any of that with us. Shame as he looked quite well suited to English football

 

Pereyra? It's already announced as an undisclosed fee. Or Pussetto?

 

They’ve are all unrealistic in the current market - that’s the point.

 

And the Troost Ekong transfer will be undisclosed, as were the Sierralta and Perica ones.

The club just structure the deals in whatever way suits them.

 

Details of new FIFA regulations on loans: https://en.as.com/en/2020/02/27/football/1582834723_128641.html

and: https://www.bbc.com/sport/amp/football/51665904

New regulations on loans confirmed by FIFA Council: https://www.sportco.io/article/fifa-loan-july-134166

 

From what I've seen they didn't need to sell though. We've been relegated, leading to a hole in our income, added with the loss of income from Covid, and by the looks of it, we have borrowed up to the max. Almeria are probably more sustainable than us at the current time.

 

True, so far. I think Quina, Sema, Hughes and Garner could get a few. Cleverley scored a few goals last time he was at this level, too (10 years ago!)

 

Welbeck is probably less than £5m, and Pussetto I think will be less than £7m unless its Udinese.

 

Despite only scoring 11 non penalty goals last season, that Darwin fella has a Uruguay cap, so it's not directly comparable with Suarez, and Benfica are splashing the cash in a way few others are. Apart from loan deals agreed pre-Covid that were made permanent, and Arthur and Pjanic's swap deal for €65m each, the €15m for Suarez and Estupinan is more than any Spanish club have spent on a single player all summer I believe

 

Several people have made the case the club have done well and it's a good deal, in their clamber to protect Mr Pozzo. This is just blind loyalty which clouds their opinion. I try to see it for what it is. If it's something I consider good I will say it, if it's bad I will say that too.....but this is without prejudice, on the merits of the particular thing I'm making comment on at the time. Quite a few cannot compartmentalise this. It's like they have to back their man, right or wrong.

Covid has of course had an impact, but plenty of clubs have made very good sales in this market. Ake (£41m), Watkins (£33m), Cash (£16m), Eze (£20m), Ramsdale (£18.5m). These are all players who have gone from the Championship to the Premier League. All for more money than we've received for either Estupinan or Suarez.

I've seen a lot of Suarez and Estupinan and I happen to think they'd have done very well with Watford and had they stayed they would be worth a lot of money, even in one year from now. It's all opinion of course, but if Estupinan continues his progress, he'll be a £50m player before long and if Suarez turns out to be prolific, then his price could be very high too.

The only thing I can think, which could possibly justify the low deals is if they have a significant sell-on clause, but that's not been mentioned, so I can only assume not.

 

We need the money and we have a player another club wants. It’s not that difficult to understand surely?

 

Sarr to villa for £10m then?

Noone is debating the need to sell - they are debating the finances on the deal to sell.

 

Imagine having come down after 5 years in the PL and need the money that much that you have to sell a player for £15m.

We'd laugh if it was another club.

 

Not saying we got a good price for Suarez, but it’s a bit disingenuous to compare against the sales of homegrown, English (bar Ake) youngsters to clubs in the wealthiest league in the world.

 

Did the Pozzos totally exit when the Chinese bought in? I think the Chinese only have a controlling stake.

 

Can't really compare a Uruguay cap to a Spain / Colombia cap and say it adds 5m to his price.

Uraguay have a good side, but it is a miniscule country with a relatively small pool of players compared to those two.