Group B - AUS, CHI, HOL, SPA

Discussion in 'General Football & Other Sport' started by Smudger, May 26, 2014.

  1. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member


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    Last edited: May 26, 2014
  2. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member


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    FIFA Ranking: 1

    Most Caps: Iker Casillas 153
    Most Goals: David Villa 56/94 games

    Coach: Vicente del Bosque

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    This has been an undoubted golden age for Spanish football as Spain looks to defend it's world crown. And that golden era is set to continue when one looks at the player coming through at age group level. However from 2008 to the present instead of a fine wine maturing with each year the wine seems to be going off. From the more vertical style and two forward set up of Aragones in 2008, del Bosque seems to be building a team that excels at ball retention but one without the sort of threat that the equally brilliant Argentina team of 2005-6 had. There almost seems a palpable fear of playing to win at the risk of losing or conceding.

    Age is also a factor as some of the key components in the previous title successes show it's effects in their form, as long season after long season takes it's toll (as witnessed last summer) and del Bosque like many coaches before him unwilling to make bold changes.

    That said qualification was a cake walk although as mentioned without any real sparkle. The ability to control the ball has become the defensive weapon of choice but the lack of incision with the ball was apparent in the home matches were sides sat back and defended in depth content to give the ball to Spain. It was easier to score away when more space was afforded by the need for the home teams to show some character by attacking.

    This lack of threat could be quickly glossed over. After all in the European Championships after a lacklustre series of games where Portugual as Chile and Paraguay before them pressed with discipline on the Spanish midfield and almost forced the Spaniards out of the tournament, the 'real' potential of the team was unleashed in the final with pace, quick movement of the ball and a vice like grip on midfield.

    Perhaps del Bosque has been lulling his opponents into a false sense of security. However he will be more than aware of the need to change the routine this time around if Spain are to acheive their goal. Undoubtedly he will go with a 4-3-3 with the configuration of the front trio of most interest. In goal he can call upon the tried and trusted despite some evidence age is starting to dull the thinking and reflexes of Saint Iker. de Gea is the heir apparent although Sergio Asenjo can count himself unlucky along with Diego Lopez in not shifting him or Pepe Reina from the posts.

    It's a pretty straightforward selection at the back as well. Pique alongside Ramos with Alba down the left and Juan Belen aka Juanfran down the right or if needs be Azpilicueta. Spain has a wealth of options but Azpilicueta's ability to cover both flanks as opposed to Dani Carvajal and Alberto Moreno and his defensive reliability got him the nod. Alba is more of a weakness but all three are potent going forward and withtheir pace a valuable weapon to stretch the game vertically and across the pitch. The question is will del Bosque let them do so ? Pique is far from his best and deputies like Albiol and Martinez are only serviceable. Given that Spain will try and press high (perhaps a mistake given the climate and long season) they will leave space in behind.

    Brazil exploited this last year and Argentina similarly embarrassed the Spaniards in Buenos Aires. The full potential of the fullbacks would be their ability to combine with Iniesta and Silva as they cut into midfield to open up the flanks and create overlaps. Alba and Iniesta form a tremendous unit with Xavi or Alonso able to hit long diagonals into the vacated space. It will be a viable and perhaps the only route if the expected congested midfield battle emerges against Chile and Holland.

    In front of the defence Busquets will be expected to perform a stay at home role coming deep to pick the ball up and initiate the passing and try to work Xabi or Xavi into space. Xabi lacks the legs to go box to box nowadays and this lack of drive along with the ageing Xavi is a worry. Alonso will expected to perform a regista role but the non selection of Iturraspe and Soriano instead of Alonso could well be a mistake. His lack of mobility may also prove costly in disciplinary terms.

    Ahead of them Xavi is also on his last legs and ideally del Bosque should be bold enough to use him only as an impact player with Koke playing his role. One can see the similarities given the way Koke turns away from the opposition and the around players ball he can provide. Of the attacking trio Iniesta is expected to play out on the left with Silva down the right providing service to the attacking fullbacks and the striker/false nine while being able to attack the box on their own down the channels using their great close control and trickery. Their deputies would be Mata and Cazorla if they are needed.

    Iniesta and Silva can also drop deep should they need to leaving Koke/Xavi as the sole attacking midfielder to defend with Alonso and Busquets to cover any fullback runs and the defence. This will require intense physical effort and the question is can these ageing players do that in the climate they experienced last summer with most of the team once again having played a long tiring season.

    del Bosque may go for Fabregas as a false nine. This may engender sighs of disappointment and the fear of yet more passing around in aimless triangles without any real desire to play penetrating through balls to a natural finisher. However that may depend on Cesc who is not a bad finisher and can play the role of striker in terms of his runs and movement beyond an opposing defensive line as at the Euro 2012 final.

    As sides are likely to be compact as possible against Spain space between midfield and defence is going to be at a premium so using the fullbacks or a striker with pace in behind the opposition who can pull out wide is a necessary option and perhaps why Torres was chosen along with Villa. It would be nice to see the two or one with Costa played upfront but a remote prospect. del Bosque will remain true to his policies. However with Costa's injury concerns he may prove a useful plan B as opposing teams tire in the heat to get in behind defences or hold the ball up (his absence late on in the CL final proving costly to Atletico) and bring respite to his own midfield.

    This need to stretch the pitch late on despite a poorish season see Pedro come on late in games down either flank ahead of the rather unlucky Navas whose pace would have been a real asset as he has shown in some important games for Spain in recent tournaments. Spain should despite some issues go deep into the tournament with their technical ability to hold onto the ball. However teams that are well disciplined in harrying their midfield and forcing turnovers high up the pitch would be able to expose their defence which while decent going forward aside from Azpilicueta is prone to errors and committing indiscretions. However I think age and the climate and a lack of a razor sharp cutting edge will cost them dear in the end.

    Star player ? For me it has to be Andres Iniesta with his close control, slide rule passes and ability to create the one chance that decides a game. He too may be on the slippery slope but he is still the best player in his role in the game today and a treat to watch.

    [video=youtube;IBzO_kZ54m8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBzO_kZ54m8[/video]

    FIFA Team Profile:

    National Anthem:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WNaHuAHKFU
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  3. Marc17

    Marc17 Academy Graduate

    Spain & Chile I reckon.
     
  4. Jellyman

    Jellyman Squad Player

    Expecting Netherlands to do well. A solid team and they have a point to prove after their disasterous Euro 2012.

    Van Gaal will make sure they prove it.
     
  5. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

    Netherlands and Spain.
     
  6. reids

    reids First Team

    Been saying this for a while, glad i'm not alone!
     
  7. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member



    FIFA Ranking: 14

    Most Caps: Carlos Sanchez 84
    Most Goals: Marcelo Salas 37/71 games

    Coach: Jorge Sampaoli

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    Last edited: Jun 7, 2014
  8. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member



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    FIFA Ranking: 15

    Most Caps: Edwin van der Sar 130
    Most Goals: Robin van Persie 43/84 games

    Coach: Louis van Gaal

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    Holland made it to Brazil with an impressive win of nine wins and a solitary draw with RVP rattling in eleven goals although one has to remember that some of the opposition such as Andorra and Estonia are hardly footballing giants. Nonetheless an 8-1 demolition of Hungary made people sit up and wonder if Holland were a genuine candidate to pick up their first World Cup.

    Personally I think this current edition is vastly overrated as is the case with many Dutch footballers. The mystique of Dutch football seems to hold like a basilisk many English football fans as if the Dutch hold some sort of magic recipe in which they churn out footballers of endless quality year in year out. Every year new wunderkinds are trumpeted to the heavens who then fall flat on their face when they travel abroad to more competitive leagues. This team for example is not a patch on the sides of the seventies in the capabilities of the players from back to front or the last real great flowering of Dutch football in the late eighties.Nowhere is there the craft and ability to read the game of a Suurbier or Krol, the wiles of a van Haneghem or the Kerkofs in midfield indeed a playmaker of the level of a Gullit. Upfront van Persie is not as two footed a finisher as a Rensenbrink or van Basten.

    Somehow this shambles managed to get itself to the 2010 final courtesy of a Japanese goalkeeper, Danish idiocy and a Brazilian losing his head and a Uruguay shorn of it;s best players. Where they were embarrassed by Spain and continued to embarrass themselves in the 2012 European Championships.

    And despite the hype, despite the coaching of van Gaal I fully expect them to struggle again. The loss of Kevin Strootman has forced van Gaal to ditch the normal 4-3-3 he used in the qualifiers where Strootman acted as a sole defensive midfielder given his ability to cover the whole of the back line.

    It may well prove a wise decision to go to a 5-3-2 given the lack of experience in defence, a lack of express pace and the fact that several of the starting back five have played with the system in Feyenoord's prolific end of season form.

    All three keepers van Gaal has chosen lack experience as no one keeper has been able to make the position his own since the retirement of Edwin van der Simulator. Cillessen has played in the most recent matches and therefore is the likely choice to start. His distribution skills are the best of the three , whereas Vorm is the best at his positioning in and around the area and claiming crosses. Krul is probably the best shot stopper of the three but as van Gaal prefers to play from the back and requires accurate passers he will stay with Jasper.

    Of the starting back three all of whom are by no means gazelles or agile either Ron Vlaar is expected to take the central role given his relative experience and aerial ability and stay at home as opposed to carrying the ball out of defence to supplement numbers in midfield. On his right the likely starter is Stefan de Vrij also equally capable aerially and like Bruno Indi who will play on the left of Vlaar in the three comfortable at carrying the ball out of defence.Their deputies are Joel Veltman and the brute physique of Kongolo who if needs be can also fill in at left back. An issue remains with their experience and a tendency to misplace passes or overdo this in dangerous areas something the high press of Spain and Chile can exploit.

    Paul Verhaegh will also have to sit on the bench as the second right back behind first choice Daryl Janmaat. Janmaat is like a bigger version of Alba. Speedy with stamina to match he is a prolific crosser of the ball but often gets caught out of position for which he then has to rely on his pace to try and make up for. On the other side Daley Blind son of Danny also has a willingness to attack and cross but is slower and more defensively minded. Thus the main axis of attack is likely to come down the right for the Dutch given that the midfield matches between them, Spain and Chile will be highly compressed.

    To cover his defence van Gaal will select a combination of two with de Jong expected to be the destroyer and young Jordy Clasie the regista playmaker who can hit accurate long range passes at will. If the attack is failing the coach could prefer a more box to box player such as de Guzman or Fer. Fer is an unlikely candidate given his poor club form. Both are also profligate in front of goal when chances do present themselves and to be honest are pretty average.

    The responsibility on creating chances will fall once again on the shoulders of Wesley Sneijder. After some relatively poor seasons since 2010 the sniff of a World Cup seems to have perked his form up again. Overall he is on the decline in sharpness and physically and playing in the heat of Brazil may affect him adversely. If this is the case the more physically robust (despite an injury hit season) Georginio Wijnaldum and more capable dribbler will take over and the set piece taking.

    To support the sole striker Arjen Robben will inevitably be weaving across from right to left in a free role along with RVP as the extra space a 5-3-2 affords upfront with Blind and Janmaat expected to make the overlaps for both. Little needs to be said about these two who can still pull the rabbit out of the hat aside from their propensity to cut in on their left feet which can be defended by those with brains.

    If chasing a goal van Gaal may revert to a 4-3-3 using young Memphis Depay as a wide forward out on the left. whose pace and strength provide a useful option as well late on. In a desperate case Huntelaar whose mobility and ability to contribute overall will lead to a life on the bench, may deputize late on for RVP or be thrown on as a target man. His impressive scoring record last year prior to knee surgery saw him take his spot and fight off competition from Quincy Promes who has been knocking them in for the Dutch u21 albeit he is more of a replacement for Depay and given that Depay is fit there was little chance of his being selected.

    Kuty offers some experience should it be needed as an impact player as he will struggle to play full matches and Lens does highlight a paucity of striking talent. His record with Dinamo Kiev is nothing to write home about and perhaps Promes a player with more Promesse should have been taken.

    I can see the Oranje clogging their way out of the group stages given the technical skills of Spain and Chile and their ability to get in behind the back three Holland will field and the spaces both wingbacks afford. Star player and creator is not Sneijder on a downward trajectory but still Arjen Robben, ripe for a hair transplant.

    [video=youtube;haqgTTpjtt8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haqgTTpjtt8[/video]

    FIFA Team Profile:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJt7Bm_xiRg

    National Anthem:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwBrR_G70RE
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2014
  9. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member



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    FIFA Ranking: 62

    Most Caps: Mark Schwarzer 104
    Most Goals: Tim Cahill 32

    Coach: Ange Postecoglou

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    The Socceroos will see the forthcoming tournament as a chance to develop a side for 2018. The lowest ranked team at the finals the side is now packed with A-League youngsters as opposed to the veteran heavy side that started qualification and stuttered and spluttered it's way to Brazil.During that period 6-0 thrashings at the hands of France and Brazil led tothe removal of dour, defensively minded Holgier Osieck by Ante Postecoglu.

    His appointment saw the removal of the old guard including players like Lucas Neill and the retirements of a host of others of the so called Golden Generation such as Harry Kewell and Mark Schwarzer. While Postecoglu uses the same 4-2-3-1 formation as Osieck he uses attacking fullbacks, outside forwards with pace and trickery and an attacking playmaker tucked in behind the solitary forward. All the centrebacks are expected to get forward and make an extra midfielder when on the attack.

    In net Postecoglu dispensed with the services of more experienced keepers such as Brad Jones in favour of two youngsters. Matthew Ryan has been in superb form with Club Brugge demonstrating a control of his area, an aptitude to anticipate danger, come for crosses and outstanding reflexes. It is more than likely several of the elite clubs in Europe will come in for him and it may well be he that prevents Australia's group opponents running up a cricket score.

    Mitchell Langerak might have thought the spot would have been his but a lack of games understandable with Weidenfeller the first choice has relegated him to reserve. Both fullbacks love to get forward and provide plenty of ammunition into the box. Down the left Postecoglu prefers a player he coached in Brisbane Ivan Franjic with Jason Davison more technically accomplished down the right.

    All three centrebacks are every inexperienced aside from Matthew Spiranovic who has European experience. All have potential to improve and the players they will face will prove a stern test. Curtis Good who has been impressive with Dundee United and a likely component of Newcastle United next season was ruled out with injury just before the final selection.

    Mark Milligan and Mile Jedinak will anchor the midfield. Jedinak is expected to play the same role he does at Crystal Palace staying at home and spreading the play with Milligan given more license to roam forward.

    At the apex of the midfield trio hopes were pinned on Tom Rogic a rather lumbering due to his physique playmaker but one who had relatively decent dribbling skills and strength to hold off defenders. Unfortunately for him his sojourn at Celtic was a failure and his return to Oz has been plagued by niggling injuries and a lack of any form forcing Postecoglu into selecting Vidosic.

    Out wide Tommy Oar's pace and speed is a vital outlet on the left, with Matthew Leckie or James Troisi although nominal strikers pulling out wide to provide service into the box. Such are the issues with strikers the coach has resorted to sticking Tim Cahill into the role as a false forward who will use his experience to drop into midfield and try and create combinations with Leckie/Troisi and Oar. Adam Taggart provides a hard working runner who battles to get his space to try and find the net.

    Overall this is a very inexperienced squad and one short of technical ability in key areas and they will be lucky to avoid losing all three games though the margins should not be great as some are forecasting. Star man has to be Matthew Ryan a worthy successor to Mark Schwarzer and who should be on the radar of those looking for a top class keeper of the future.

    [video=youtube;c1Emol3m-mk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1Emol3m-mk[/video]

    FIFA Team Profile:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gn6VWRWkzY

    National Anthem:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rErvPnd-2E
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2014
  10. feliuk

    feliuk First Year Pro

    Spain and someone else :)
     
  11. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    Excellent group. Gone for Spain and Chile
     
  12. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard First Team

    Spain and Holland, easily!
     
  13. andrew2209

    andrew2209 First Year Pro

    Netherlands and Chile.

    Yes, I genuinely think Spain could be knocked out in the group stage.
     
  14. With A Smile

    With A Smile First Team

    If Chile get a draw against Spain then the Champions are in real real trouble.

    Never saw a thumping like that coming
     
  15. CarlosKickaballs

    CarlosKickaballs Forum Picarso

    I wouldn't make anything of it, Holland had a point to prove after losing in the last final to Spain in the same way Leicester did.

    The Dutch probably went onto the Spain forum and talked of "#JusticeForDeJong and #karma"
     
  16. Pozzo Out

    Pozzo Out Squad Player

    Tika Taka is pretty much dead :doom:
     
  17. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Good. It's shiite.
     
  18. Douglas Rinaldi

    Douglas Rinaldi Reservist

    Tika taka at its finest involves tonnes of movement and intense pressing high up the pitch. Spain did neither of these things well at all, so it is arguably not tika taka.

    Spain actually reminded me a bit of us last season. Intent on possession. but without a real offensive strategy.
     
  19. MellowYellow

    MellowYellow Academy Graduate

    :sign15:
     
  20. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Did you put a bet on that Andrew.

    End of an era.
     
  21. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    I was thinking exactly the same thing myself as I watched the Chile game.
     
  22. El distraído

    El distraído Johnny Foreigner

    Diego Costa must be ruing the day he chose Spain over Brazil.
     
  23. miked2006

    miked2006 Premiership Prediction League Proprietor

    I've been really impressed with Charles Aránguiz for Chile. Apparently signed for Udinese for a couple of million not long ago, and really looks quality.

    Don't think we really have a chance though ;)
     
  24. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Has already left Udinese I'm afraid.
     
  25. miked2006

    miked2006 Premiership Prediction League Proprietor

    Don't they still own his rights??
     
  26. Prentice

    Prentice Administrator

    Nope, he was loaned to Internacional who've chosen to take up the buyout clause in the loan.

    Something like €8M Sherlock said.
     
  27. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Pass and move football is never dead. When the players are unable to execute it is when it is a problem.

    People may label it tiki taka but pass and move football in all it's guises from River Plates maquina, the Magyars of the fifties, sides like Tottenham labelling it push and pull , to Bielsa's reinvention and it's use by his disciples like Guardiola and Sampaoli will always be there.

    These Spanish players were tired, lacking hunger and the ability to execute it effectively and also lacking the speed to get in behind given the absence of Navas, the inability of Alba to get forward along with Azpilicueta to make the pitch as big as possible.

    del Bosque like many managers before him and no doubt after him continued with the tried and trusted. Xavi ? No Koke ? Alonso ? Soriano and Iturraspe were not even picked. You need mobility in these systems for them to be effective. Even Costa hardly made any of the clever runs in behind that someone like Villa does. And he like the other Atleti players were omitted until the Australia game.

    Spain will be back without any shadow of a doubt. What England would give for some of the talent that is coming through. del Bosque also needs to go a man out of ideas and impetus exemplified when replacing a forward with a forward against Chile when needing a positive result.
     
  28. CarlosKickaballs

    CarlosKickaballs Forum Picarso

  29. reids

    reids First Team

    As I said to my friends who also said tiki taka is dead, it's not dead, it's just the end of the current era and the beginning of a new one, tiki taka is a constant evolution, the players available define it's success and the little details that go into it and make it successful. Bringing in the new breed of quality Spanish youngsters (Munian, Koke, Isco, Morata, Moreno, etc etc) will see tiki-taka rise again very soon I imagine.
     

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