Debt Free In 12 Months (15 June 2024)

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Jumbolina, Jun 15, 2023.

  1. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Starting the countdown to see if Scott it correct!

    I for one am amazed we paid down £90m of external debt in a post relegation season from the June 2022 accounts to arrive at Scott's £29m current figure. Outstanding work - must be a record.
  2. J.B

    J.B First Team

    Worth noting that Pozzo also went on record to say that we will be debt free by the end of next season (May 2024). A proper 'hell or high water' moment for the pair of them.
    CarlosKickaballs and Jumbolina like this.
  3. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Does ‘in liquidation’ count as ‘debt free’?
    Since63 and Leighton Buzzer like this.
  4. davisp2

    davisp2 Reservist

    Was any detail shared about how that would be achieved
  5. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Duxbury said we were down to £29m (?) already! A massive paydown since the last accounts. And Pozzo said we everything will be paid off by end of season (vague mention to making money from player sales). And then the finance director lady said don't worry about a snapshot in time like the official audited accounts (lol).
    CarlosKickaballs likes this.
  6. We're going to sell the whole squad to udinese for £180m and loan them all back for 20 quid.

  7. Carpster

    Carpster Squad Player

    So who am I to believe? People on here or the club accountant?
    I've said before I know nothing of the financial side of the club and it's obvious that either club or forum is giving it plenty of BS.
    wfc4ever likes this.
  8. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Well we have the club reps talking about fantasy numbers given the published accounts in 2022. You can make your own mind up.
  9. Halfwayline

    Halfwayline Reservist

    The full transcript doesn’t show the detail that was discussed. It was quoted by Scott, Gino and the club accountant that current debt outside of Ginos loan is 29m which will be fully paid back by 2024 when Watford will be debt free
  10. Carpster

    Carpster Squad Player

    I can't because I don't understand finances!
  11. a19tgg

    a19tgg First Team

    The transcript said exactly that.
    Halfwayline likes this.
  12. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Which is about £90m paydown in the 12 months to June 2023?
  13. IRB

    IRB THe artist formally know as ImRonBurgundy?

    Why would we want to be debt free? I've been assured multiple times that taking on external debt is good business practice?
    wfcmoog likes this.
  14. Halfwayline

    Halfwayline Reservist

    my take was the debt was 120m of which 50m is owed to Gino. There will be 29m ex ginos debt at year end and this will be paid off by June 2024 so 41m in 12 months
  15. Halfwayline

    Halfwayline Reservist

    Having debt is fine as long as it’s controllable. Tonight the assertion was made that it’s currently very very manageable
    iamofwfc likes this.
  16. hjw

    hjw Reservist

    it was just debt owed to other party's, right? we will still have loans owed to Gino
    dynamo380 likes this.
  17. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Don't think so - at last count:

    -£54m owed on transfer fees
    -£46m owed to Gino
    -£77m in secured loans

    So are they just ignoring transfer fees owed here and just assuming they are paid off £54m no drama with our cashflow!? That would be deceitful considering they have borrowed against all incoming transfers not included in the debt above.

    Even then getting the 77m down to £29m is some going in a post relegation season. None of it stacks up.
  18. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Yes - but see figures in my post above
  19. LeedsOrn

    LeedsOrn Reservist

    Yes. Duxbury said we’ll have no external debt by then. My read is that for some reason that excludes transfer debt (future instalments owed due to players purchased - although we won’t have much of that left by then given that we haven’t really shelled out much lately). That leaves, per @We hate 48 £112m in external debt, £35m secured against future transfer fees and £77m in more traditional borrowing. I could imagine Scott somehow excluding the former to come up with the big statement, but that means that in two years (I.e June 2022-June 2024), we’ll have paid down either £112m or £77m in external debt. Well only find out in a little under 2 years if that’s the case though.

    I believe I saw somewhere that Gino’s loans are interest bearing. I wonder if rather than pay the debts down whether we’ve paid them by borrowing extra cash from Gino though I did not that Duxbury said we were not running an operating loss any more which is a good sign.
  20. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    “We’ll be technically debt free by the end of the season “ was the quote from SD.

    By that I’m assuming all external debt will be paid off and only debt will be owner debt.
  21. LeedsOrn

    LeedsOrn Reservist

    I think you’ve left off the money secured against future transfer fees.

    And I think I’ve seen arguments made (either by Watford or other clubs somewhere) that football transfer debt should not be counted since it is self-liquidating (not sure if that’s the correct term but basically it just gets paid back in the ordinary course or something). Not sure I agree with it but I’d bet that Duxbury’s either excluded that from the total or netted it against income transfer fees to magic it away.
  22. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Yep that is why I left it out. The money we are owed in transfer instalments we have borrowed against already. So I left out the self liquidating loans on receivables, but we still need to pay the fees we owe.
    LeedsOrn likes this.
  23. LaClusazSki

    LaClusazSki Reservist

    It sounds like Bayat is our accountant.
    It is that or Pozzo and Duxbury are just giving BS to all the fans.
    Creative accountancy is the known term.
    We will see, administration, debt free* or sold.

    *pozzo style
  24. Robert Peel

    Robert Peel Squad Player

    The best bit was when a member of the audience broke down the £200m+ figure that's been discussed here into specific parts like Macquarie loans, debt to Pozzo etc. and asked if we had somehow paid it all off or not - proper "yes / no" question.

    Pozzo panics, passes it over to his obese, smarmy accountant, who basically said "let's not talk specifics, everything is in great shape". I said "well that's a no then", but don't think I was heard.
  25. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    LMAO. How can anybody give any credibility whatsoever to an accountant who says “let’s not talk specifics. Things are in great shape”. It’s simply laughable.
  26. Robert Peel

    Robert Peel Squad Player

    There was an audible groan when he said it. A proper red flag that things are not good, whatever Pozzo said.

    I'm awful at finances, but I imagine Pozzo is indeed going to get us debt free in some technical aspect by next year, but there will be huge amounts of debt elsewhere.

    When someone asked if debt free meant across all accounts, holding companies etc. there was a pause before saying yes, like ("can I be held to account legally for saying this? Oh f-ck it") "yes*.
    Halfwayline likes this.
  27. CarlosKickaballs

    CarlosKickaballs Forum Picarso

    Gino is now an evangelical christian has been listening to the Dave Ramsey Christian finance podcast

  28. a19tgg

    a19tgg First Team

    Accountants famously not one for “specifics”.
  29. VR94

    VR94 Academy Graduate

    I know nothing about this stuff but assumed it means all the debt becomes owner debt, which may be preferable but also doesn’t make us any more attractive for an investor.
  30. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    I guess that is one option. If Pozzo is genuinely going to convert all external debt to owner debt then fair play to him. But otherwise I simply don’t see how it is possible to meet Duxbury’s statement from where we were June 22.
    VR94 likes this.
  31. Robert Peel

    Robert Peel Squad Player

    It was directly asked how they'd manage to shift £90m debt in a year. It wasn't answered.
  32. wfcwarehouse

    wfcwarehouse First Team Captain

    It’s like a mortgage m8, nothing to worry about.
    BeersThen likes this.
  33. BeersThen

    BeersThen Reservist

    My accountant sh1t herself when two invoices were 60p out in my company accounts. Sounds like I need the same accountant as Gink.
  34. a19tgg

    a19tgg First Team

    Yep mine is awful, you’d think they’re working for you, but mine just wants to tell me off all the time.
  35. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    Is that what we owe? I presume that we are also owed money from players we've sold so maybe this counteracts this? If that is the case that still leaves the £77m in secured loans being reduced to £29m which is either BS or we've done blooming well

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