Don’t disagree at all - the caveat is, as I said, if the player himself feels like he has done his time in the lower division and his agent touts him around etc…then we become pretty powerless even if he does have a long term deal. Hopefully doesn’t happen though and he seems to have a decent head on his shoulders.
But I suppose the choice then for him (and his agent) if we flat out refuse any bids below £50m, is waste a year throwing your toys out the pram and watching your development and value slow down, or knuckle down and have a season that could attract bids closer to the amount we'd want.
I would be gutted to see Pedro leave as I think he is just starting to show us the player he could be. Dennis will go as will Sarr but actually thing Pedro will be better than both of them
Again, don’t disagree - hopefully he’s more of a ‘Sarr’ in the situation as opposed to a ‘Suarez’, ‘Capoue’ or ‘Estupinan’. But if he wants to go, I’m not sure us ‘flat out refusing to sell him’ is wise given our track record of having players downing tools etc.
Good to see both JP and Cucho getting minutes as I was crying out for weeks ago. Both proving their worth. They're still both young and hopefully stay if relegated. But it would be very odd if clubs weren't looking at both of them. Sarr and Dennis will both leave whether we stay up or not and hopefully this will fund a good window and give the youngsters more opportunities.
I don't think that's too crazy of a price for JP - he scored 9 goals at 19 years old in the Championship last season. That's not something that often happens, if we look back at previous seasons there's only a few people who have done that: Fabio Carvalho - On 7 for this season at 19 years old - Liverpool bid £8m in January despite him being available on a free in the summer, so not crazy to think if he had 5 years or so on his contract still that he'd be worth over double what Liverpool bid. Daryl Dike - Was sold to WBA 6 months after scoring 9 goals for Barnsley - Transfermarkt has the value down as being just under £8m (+20% of the next fee) from a league which often doesn't get huge fees for their players. Mbeumo - Hard to gauge his value but JP beats him stats wise for everything other than xG per 90 and Mbeumo is 2 years older, transfermarkt has his value down at £14.4m (although transfermarkt isn't a great gauge!) Brewster - Was bought for £20m. Tyrese Campbell - Not a clue how much he's worth, wouldn't be surprised if he leaves in the summer though and only has 2 years left on his deal, will be a good way to gauge JPs value - although JP has played in the PL and is 2 years younger. Mason Mount - Worth considerably more than £20m Ryan Sessegnon - Was sold for £25m. Tammy Abraham - Worth considerably more than £20m Moussa Dembele - Left on a free transfer, was sold to Lyon 2 years later for £20m. and that's as far back as I can be bothered going, obviously it's not a perfect methodology as every player + circumstances around the transfer differ, but with 5 years left on his deal and having a decent season in the PL, alongside what he did in the Championship last season I can deffo see him going for >£20m. Agree with Cucho though, no chance we'll be getting £20m for him.
I don’t expect JP or Cucho to leave Neither has developed enough to get offers anywhere near their value, Sarr and Dennis are more sellable imo, and combined with offloading Sissoku etc I’d expect the gap in budget to be covered But none of us know, and I’m sure there will be surprises
The fact that Pedro doesn't yet look anything like a goalscorer at this level may give us a glimmer of hope for keeping him in the Championship.
In fairness, those players are English and/or scored at a better rate than Pedro, as talented as he is, I don't see us getting mega money at all for him, I'd say £15m tops if we're lucky. That said, he's played fairly well, but hasn't exactly been outstanding in the Prem, and hasn't even established himself as a regular in a team battling relegation (albeit with some very good forwards for such a level), there is a chance we can keep him
If we can keep JP and Cucho next year if we do go down then we will be in for an exciting season, especially if we can keep Louza and integrate new Colombian bloke and new keeper. Rest of team can then be filled with Mogi tat and Cathcart types.
Scenes when we score 100 goals, only to let in 99 because Cathcart and Kabasele are still at the back
Don't think I've seen that much discussion of this specific thing, but I kind of feel like Louza will end up being one of the first to go, in the eventuality - I think he'll both see himself and be seen as on too much of an upward trajectory to spend a season outside top-flight football as a 23-year-old, especially leading up (briefly) to a potential World Cup appearance. That may very well just be to Udinese, but he's clearly starting to show he belongs at this level, so I'd be concerned, myself.
To be fair, playing in The Championship AND being total shyte never hurt Adam Masina's Morocco call ups. Louza would only be one of those things and he's a key part of the Morocco side, I don't see it hurting his World Cup chances. Agree with the rest though, the longer he continues to play in this last third of the season, the higher the chance he leaves.
I also thinks JP wants to play as often as he can and I doubt he'd be a guaranteed starter for any EPL club, even a newly-promoted one; whilst I'm certain he'd be one of the first names on the teamsheet in the Championship, so maybe, hopefully he'll be willing to give us another season in the Championship, feeling confident in himself to become first choice should we back in EPL for season 2023/4.
Whilst I think this is true, I doubt he has grand illusions about staying at Watford any longer than he has to. Yes he signed a long-term deal…but I doubt another season in the Championship was in the career plan. Regular football is all well and good - but if it’s at a lower level, under no doubt another short-term coach, he may see a path for better progression at a higher level club with a quality coach and learning from better players in training etc and building minutes at a bigger/better club. That could well be a big consideration for all our quality young players - I doubt Joao Pedro will be any different.
To be fair it’s not the usual bargain bin Bayat player processing. At £9 million you’d expect him to be a decent talent (although admittedly the crackerjack deal for Sven Kums has showed this isn’t a certainty).
With the way we churn through managers, there is something to be said for sitting on the bench of a more stable PL club, learning from better players and a better manager. At the moment Pedro is neither one thing or the other and he’s in and out if the side, is it any wonder when our managers average 10 games each? He’d likely develop more elsewhere playing less compared to another season in the championship most likely under multiple managers.
A bit less. £8.5m I think. According the transfer market we managed to get half of that back for him at least when moving him on.
According to transfermarkt... 2014/15: Gent sign him for £1.35m 2016/17: Watford sign him for £8.1m 2016/17: Watford loan him to Udinese 2017/18 Watford sell him to Anderlecht for £5.85m 2019/20: Gent sign him on loan 2020/21: Gent sign him for...£1.35m Absolutely bizarre
Don't think it's been mentioned yet that Kums is also 34 now - he was therefore 28 when we decided it was a proper business to sign him for the best part of £10m. And, indeed, 29 when a team in the potless Belgian league decided to spend £6m on him. Now, obviously, that becomes less of an issue/contradiction to most of our transfer policy when you take into account the whole 'weird fake transfer never designed to see the pitch for us' aspect, but it is just another soup*on adding to the uniquely inexplicable flavour of the whole affair.
Yeah I thought that was baffling too but it’s possible that the comments were taken out of context in some way. I think it’s not impossible that at some point in their careers - without contracts running down and playing well for a more established side - they could garner fees totalling that amount but that doesn’t make it their valuation now does it. I think the club having an internal valuation of about £85m seems reasonable. Sarr £40m; Pedro £30m (v long contract) and Cucho £15m. Don’t know where he’s getting the other £65m from.
I’d imagine the same inconceivable, magical cosmos from which our general club strategy came from. Imagination, done properly.
Another overrated player. I really don't get the hype about him. Yes, he's got potential but he shouldn't be starting games for us. King doesn't score much, but he is still the better option. At least his hold up play helps us to keep the ball when we are under pressure. I can't recall any game Pedro has started for us and played well, but he has had lots of good games when introduced in the second half. We have a bad manager in Roy, so I expect him and Sarr to keep on starting the remaining games till the end of the season. Sent from my TECNO P701 using Tapatalk
The problem is he doesn’t actually do anything. He’s also clueless when it comes to breaking an offside trap, but then our whole forward like look like they’ve had a lobotomy when they get beyond the halfway line.
