That’s possible for Hughes. But I know it’s not true that Chalobah wanted to negotiate - he wanted to leave. And again, I’ve been told by more than one well-placed party that Hughes, Chalobah and Wilmot had reservations about Xisco. Now whether they were key factors in the players wanting out or not, or more minor ones, we will likely never know. But it’s hardly beyond the realms of possibility that the players just didn’t enjoy being at the club any longer and saw this summer as their chance to get out - and if that cost them in terms of contract length, financially and what league they were in, then they simply may have willing to accept that. I think all the talk of there being some hidden, deeper reasoning and/or their plans backfiring is a bit of a reach personally. Of course if things don’t work out for them down the line, they may look back with regret. But I suspect they are all happy with the decision they made right now.
Guess Willmott didn’t play much so wouldn’t be a fan of Munoz but the other 2 played key roles in the team. Maybe Chalobah wanted to have the chance to work with Silva again ? I think Hughes wanted a better deal or to prove himself elsewhere but it hasn’t worked yet due to the form of Palace and their midfield.
Gray (approx £18m) was competing with Deeney (approx. £20m-25m and undroppable) and Delefeo (approx. £15m) for a starting spot under Gracia. That is fair enough, whereas Success as an example and his £13 odd million is one player that did pretty much zilch for us. Others from our past did zilch for us. Some of these others have been mentioned by other forum members. Both Deeney and Gray regressed after Gracia left. And saying pound and pound worst, when comparing players of our history from different eras is a flawed argument as well, due to increasing values of players through the decades. Feel free to read all my posts again, you'll learn plenty
What has that got to do with anything? The whole point is what the player cost and what they contributed.
Even if you take out the Deeney cost v value out of it, then he was competing with Delefeo, contributed, and the rest of my post is still applicable.
Gray could not have been valued at £18m at any point while he was at Watford, except perhaps before he played his first game.
Wilmot probably, but are Chalobah with his three starts for a Championship side, and Hughes with no minutes at all, really happy? This is purely speculating, but you could say they are happy just to be out after seeing how things have unfolded this season, but who’s to say we wouldn’t have more points from better performances with them in the team with a more positive vibe at the club?
All very good goal scorers in their time ( even Andre himself got a few for other teams ) but just not for us !
Are they happy in the short term with their lack of game time? I’d say clearly no. But I doubt either of them left thinking they would be immediate regulars where they were going. I think if you gave Chalobah and Hughes the chance to go back in time and stay, they’d still walk right now, As I say, if they are in the same boat come the end of the season, they will maybe look back with regret. But I suspect they are happy enough with their choice right now with plenty of time ahead. And there’s not much about our season that is currently making them look foolish either. Yes, we offered more money and longer deals. But ultimately look at our club and the current state we are in…I love the club - but I don’t blame them one bit for taking less money and shorter deals to get out. Ranieri is a massive positive - but when they left it was still Gino, Duxbury and Xisco. Would you stay?! I think their departures are a massive sign of the state of the club behind the scenes. Too many fans want to brush it aside and say ‘good riddance, we now have better’ - well, IMO, Sissoko aside, I don’t think we do. I’m not a big Hughes fan - but I’d have him every time over Kucka. And like Chalobah or not, he’d offer far more protection to the back 4 than any CM we have now. (This is in no way a defence of the behaviour of the two players in the summer either. I just think a well run club has the situation under control and we never did.)
I think the Hughes predicament kind of shows our issue though, he can’t get in the Palace team and rightly so. They’ve not necessarily been getting fantastic results but they’ve been getting excellent feedback on their performances, now the results have started to come after beating City, something we can only dream of. Contrast that with us, we’ve picked up the odd results but our performances have been largely woeful, at no point could you say we’ve ever strung two decent performances together worthy of anything more than what we actually got from the games. If Hughes was here he’d probably be a starter, which really highlights the issue, we’re a long way behind a team like palace who themselves aren’t necessarily picking up loads of points but are playing well. Hughes might be slightly better than Kucka, but not by enough that it would make any meaningful difference, meanwhile he can’t get near the Palace midfield. The long and the short of it is having Hughes and Chalobah would make a negligible difference to us, Chalobah can’t get in a championship side so what makes him capable of improving a PL one? They’ve both really found their level, and it’s more the case that Kucka isn’t really good enough either, not that Hughes or Chalobah would somehow be transformative. It’s not either or, it’s none.
Sorry, but I'm just not buying that an injury-prone 26 year old with aspirations of playing for England, would turn down the opportunity to play in the Premier League, to go back to the Championship, purely due to how much he hated his promotion-winning manager who was always unlikely to last the season anyway. Or because of how much he hated Gino and Duxbury, despite the fact they stuck by him through long term injuries and poor form. Just doesn't make any logical sense. If Chalobah knew what he knows now and was given the option to turn back time and said no, he's a moron.
How often does it need to be repeated - the fee for Success was just Pozzo money-shuffling. He does not enter in to the equation for worst value signings.
I think we need a bigger depth of evidence on Etebo before we categorically say he's better. I'm not saying he isn't mind you.
Just remember that comment when the moron blows hard about players who can’t do it in the Championship.
Just picking up the narrative you seem to be implying that Watford is a bit of a toxic place? Well, if that was really the case would Sierralta have just signed a new 5-year deal? After all, he's got a lot of potential and I think a lot of clubs would have been interested in him if he was out of contract. He's clearly happy at the club. No, I think it's a simple case of the club holding firm on the contracts and these two players thought they would be more highly sought after and would walk into a better club on better terms. That just did not happen, and when the penny finally dropped for them, the door was firmly shut as Watford had moved on to new targets. They had to take what they could. It may work out for Hughes and Palace in the long term, but for now, he's only got a 3-year deal and Chalobah had to drop down a division just to get a 2-year deal from a club on a free. Whatever the reason why they decided to go, it certainly wasn't a smart move for either of them financially. In Chalobah's case, with his injury record, to walk away from a 5-year on Premier League wages, to a 2-year deal at a Championship club is sheer lunacy. No one would take that deal, but that's what happened because he was left high and dry by his own decision to stall on the contract.
I keep coming back to this active thread, fearing that QPR have returned him under the sales of goods act.
