Wfc Finances

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by We hate 48, Sep 1, 2020.

  1. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    No doubt people will claim that this is for a spending spree in January. Probably the same people who said the dodgy Kamara deal was for an end of window spending spree during the summer.
    wfcmoog, DaveWFC, Jumbolina and 2 others like this.
  2. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Cristiano Ronaldo incoming…
    RS2 likes this.
  3. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

  4. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    The loan with Macquarie Bank must be at least £84m now. We’ve also receiving that £16m from Udinese over the sale of Kamara, making that a nice round figure of £100m.
  5. LeedsOrn

    LeedsOrn Reservist

    Don’t these loans essentially pay themselves off via the assignment of the future instalments? I’m not sure this is really us saddled with £100m of new debt as opposed to paying Macquarie a fee to have an early realisation of this transfer money. Still doesn’t speak too well to the state of the club’s finances (especially as we’re paying 6-9% for this early realisation), but I don’t think it results in an incurrence of additional debt/obligations.
  6. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

  7. Still too young.
  8. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Yes they are all guaranteed against future earnings, but it’s like asking your company for an advance of 2 year’s salary. Great, you can get all the money now and pay off debts and buy nice things, but then what do you do for the next two years for income, when it’s effectively all been spent?
  9. hjw

    hjw Reservist

    We are getting promated, that will increase our income!
  10. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    You are correct. But the problem is Duxbury considers this BAU (which it is) but he then ignores the fact we owe instalments to other clubs on incoming transfers. So we take cash flow boost on the incoming, and the future outgoings are swept under carpet and ignored when he talks to fans.

    And that is before the ludicrous £16m Kamara transfer because we can’t meet cashflow obligations.

    Duxbury is a snake.
    wfcmoog and RS2 like this.
  11. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    So we've taken loans out for £29m in the last two months against future transfer instalments to get the money now, as well as selling Kamara for £16m (which was all reportedly paid upfront) and we've also extended our overdraft facility by £3.6m.

    That's over £45m into the club in the last three months. And not forgetting we borrowed against our parachute payments in the summer too.

    It seems that every month we need more money right now, despite us not having the same high earners as we did last time we were in the Championship.

    Can anyone make a case for everything being fine?
    DaveWFC, RS2, Jumbolina and 1 other person like this.
  12. wfcwarehouse

    wfcwarehouse First Team Captain

    Find it genuinely baffling that some people still seem to be on the fence following the years of lies, broken promises, grubby deals and half truths we’ve been fed by the idiots in charge.
    cyaninternetdog, DaveWFC and RS2 like this.
  13. Scott says it’s all fine, so no need to worry.
  14. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Thanks. That's the reassurance I needed!
    The undeniable truth likes this.
  15. You're welcome. Looking forward to some big name signings in January.
    Steve Leo Beleck likes this.
  16. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    We're only going one way under Pozzo, it's been coming for years but people have had their head up his arse so are completely oblivious.
    wfcmoog and DaveWFC like this.
  17. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    Do other clubs do this? No guessing. I'm presuming they do as a lot of companies take out loans in respect of future income. Not saying we're not deep in the brown stuff but not sure the taking of loans is that unusual.
  18. I'm sure they do but as a prudent FD I'd be nervous about paying interest to bring forward future receipts in order to spend today, leaving transfer instalment payments due out there, presumably reduced day to day costs still exceeding reduced income (which we've probably brought forward and spent anyway), given the likely dramatically reduced future revenue which will be needed to cover cost base and repay loans, unless we get spectacular fees for Pedro and Sarr or promotion. Feels like an expensive gamble on promotion to me and I'd want to see how future costs, transfer instalments and loans are covered if we don't go up this year or next, or get significant investment.
    Knight GT likes this.
  19. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    They definitely do, but this plus Kamara deal indicates cash flow struggles. Given that the amount owed to other clubs was in the tens of millions on outgoing instalments where is that money coming from if we have already used transfer receivables and parachute payments up with these bridging loans?

    It’s one thing Leicester bringing forward some cash safe in the knowledge they have another TV wedge in the summer. For us things look a lot bleaker if we don’t go up. Try as sell JP for £40m to plug the holes I suppose but will it be enough? Sarr is only going to get us £15m with his contract length,
    RS2 and Knight GT like this.
  20. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Seems we’re relying on promotion, or selling Sarr and Pedro to cover future liabilities. Promotion will enable us to kick the can down the road for another year, selling Sarr and Pedro if we don’t go up, even if it somehow covers all our future liabilities, will leave our squad in an utterly disgusting state and without a penny to spend. Fun times ahead either way.
    wfcmoog and RS2 like this.
  21. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    If we don’t go up next year’s squad doesn’t bear thinking about!! The usual defensive clowns, with Bayo and Manaj up top! Kayembe pulling the strings.
    RS2 and a19tgg like this.
  22. hjw

    hjw Reservist

    Some of you have clearly forgotten, or were not around, when Simpson (and his side kick Ashton) were in charge. That really was lies, broken promises, grubby deals and half truths
  23. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Be careful what you wish for!
    RS2 likes this.
  24. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Seem comments like that elsewhere.

    Again people might be a bit disappointed...
  25. Very true given we then ended up with Bassini. We’ve been pretty lucky since then.
    hjw and Phnom Penh Horn like this.
  26. Norwayhornet

    Norwayhornet Squad Player

    Afc Watford you heard it first here!
  27. Oscar calling

    Oscar calling Squad Player

    If we dont go up this season then another Derby County is on the cards.
  28. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    A quick glance at our squad for the 23/24 season if we don't go up and sell Sarr/JP and have to return Davis and Choudhury with Kamara being sold to Udinese. FYI: Players not in correct positions, just a general formation.


    Cathcart - ext. one year
    Kabasele - ditto
    WTE - ditto



    Possible subs: Hamer, Gaspar, old git, new freebie, new loan, Big Jeff from the chip shop
  29. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

  30. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Louza will be sold
    RS2 likes this.
  31. HMS PTL II
  32. davisp2

    davisp2 Reservist

    The loan is to give some short term headroom for a Jan transfer budget, and any loans will be paid off when Gino comes in the money with the sale of Udinese and part share in WFC. People should stop worrying there pretty heads.
  33. cyaninternetdog

    cyaninternetdog Forum Hippie

    Simpson is small fry compared to what Gino and co are doing.
    RS2 likes this.
  34. BeersThen

    BeersThen First Year Pro

    I'd start Big Jeff and put Manaj on the bench.
    SkylaRose likes this.
  35. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Yep. Just like the £16m injection from Udinese was to fund August transfers for Edwards like him having a right wing back.

    Nothing at all to do with us being unable to service cashflow needs after failing to sell Sarr or JP. No sir. People need to give their pretty heads a wobble.
    RS2 likes this.

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