Discussion in 'Old Games' started by Optimistichornet, Aug 25, 2016.
When the villagers burnt the pub down it seems Opti was still in there.
Depends how the wolves picked their kills. If done well evil wins.
We are just waiting to find out. I'm sure Opti will let us know it due course.
I hope the wolves fell for a plan I put in place, although Opti tried to ruin it.
Either way, I don't fancy your chances.
I fell for the trap that 352 set.
This wait is killing me.
Err... call it a tie?
Coming soon. Been a busy few days sorry all. Will update shortly.
Day 5 up now. Sorry for the delay.
Thanks for the game Opti, your write ups were some of the best I've ever seen.
Thanks, sorry for the delay in posting. I think this game has shown me that in future I will just have to be a participant. I have run 3 or 4 games now, and although it is a lot of fun it does take up quite a bit of time that I dont always have.
Cheers to all the players, you made the game enjoyable to watch and mod as you were all active. Apart from the initial day when 2 were killed for not voting Im very happy with how things went in this respect.
Congratulations to team evil. After the 1st day I really thought this was team goods to lose, hence the full moon to give evil a chance. Team Good though succeeded in imploding impressively, particularly in the lynching of happyhornet. I selected happyhornet as the replacement seer as she was an active player whom i felt was under relatively little suspicion. I could not believe when she got lynched after only one day as seer, and felt pretty sorry for her really.
At this point i communicated with both Moog and With A Smile, possibly the most experienced dead players to decide whether or not I should choose a third seer. Both differed in opinion, but helped me to make mine. The day with no seer was very fun to watch and I think all parties debated well. By this time evil was well in control and an evil win was almost inevitable unless there was a bizarre change in circumstances.
Once again I hope you enjoyed the game, and look forward to taking part in the next one.
Thanks very much for running the game, Opti. Great write ups.
Well played, miked and Meh!
And, as for Diamond. :rant:
Yeah sorry Happy. At the outset I told Opti not to make me anything but a villager as I may not have time to be around much, and in return I promised to liven things up when I could, (even thought the git made me Guardian), (Mike I hate you). I think it got a bit too lively that day!
hehe I thought the guardian was a nice minor role for you.
How you got lynched on that day is still beyond me!
I thought it was a good day with some great arguments. I'll post a synopsis on my thoughts each day on here and who I killed in a bit although it's likely to be a little rambly.
Anyone know the last time that evil won?
I told you guys that Mike was evil. Knew it.
Well done though to both of you. I guess you chose to eat me on the last night Mike? Wouldnt be surprising!
Cheers for the game Opti. Next time, ladies and gents, listen to me!
Oh just read it, yes, you killed me! Last laugh I guess!
I should have said well played you too. You nailed it re mike and it was you who made me think about him as a wolf. I was barking up the wrong tree before that (scuse the pun), especially re CB, who I was very suspicious of.
I tried (& failed) to leave a clue that I was the Seer by using exactly the same turn of phrase in post #100 on day 3 as I had in the message saying Diamond was good.
It was fun - & frustrating - watching day 4 from the sidelines. I couldn't understand how Diamond was in the spotlight, even though it was pretty obvious I had been the seer and I had said I thought he was good!
I really wanted to out the wolves by getting Diamond in the spotlight on that last day and seeing who latched onto it. I didn't think it was a wise move by Diamond to out himself but I thought it presented an opportunity to get debate going. In the end it didn't work out but hey!
What an awful tactic!
It almost worked! I voted coincidentally at the same time as 352. I thought I finally had a majority support (due to 352's bluff). I felt I had to go for it. It was Friday night, so I had no idea how many would vote, and thought I needed to kick it off.
If I had voted seconds before, I think 352 would have voted for me instead.
At that stage in the game though, voting for a known good player was ludicrous and too risky. We were crying out for facts and when we finally had one, that Diamond was good, we used it against us! Diamond would have been killed by one of you anyway that evening, so there was no point in lynching him.
Oh well. Looking forward to the next one. Would love a bigger role. I've rarely been anything other than a villager!
Full Moon Wolf checking in!
Well done team EVIL! Good work Mike. You are my hero!
This was only my second game, and the first one I was out on day 2 or something so forgive any naivety during this game.
I posted a lot and accused a lot on the first day, so much so that I thought I may be wolfed that night for being seemingly obviously good. Made Full Moon Wolf, I decided that I couldn’t suddenly change my posting habits so continued to speak out a lot, but kept in mind not to go for anyone that I thought may be the other wolf. I had Ashdon, Mike and 352 as the other wolf after day one, and had I not been converted would have put Ashdon in my firing line on day 2 for the lynching.
I played a very risky game once converted in openly accusing people a few times, but I thought that in the absence of knowing any other wolves, my best option was to stay in plain sight but name a few people who I felt were clearly good – the more obvious I was, the more under the radar I seemed to stay. As Proximo said in Gladiator: “Win the crowd and you'll win your freedom.” I was attempting to win over team good.
On the final day, I thought 352 was clearly stupid naming Diamond as a wolf. No idea he was attempting to set a trap, but I leapt on this immediately trying to use nativity that I was blindly following them. This was a really risky strategy and the first time I’d opened myself up to any form of doubt, but with the players left, I felt it was the right time to push it a little. I’d decided the game needed spicing up anyway.
It was quiet all day, no votes were being made and it was pretty tense. No one had followed up on Diamond clearly naming me earlier so thought I was getting away with it – I probably wasn’t! I was out Friday night but I did have pretty good access up until about 7.30 when I got on the tube. And my phone wouldn’t log me in to wfcforums in the bar I was in at about 8.40pm. Was thinking “crap crap crap, I’m not gonna get to vote”!!! Finally got in just in time but was “hairy” for a minute. Still 1 vote to go and the last time I looked at my phone until the next morning. Couldn’t believe our luck when I logged in on Saturday morning and 3 votes were for Diamond!
I couldn’t see who voted for who after the vote closed – could anyone else? I assume Ashdon as the last vote was the good villager who finally killed off Diamond - Cheers Ashdon. If it’s any consolation, I washed you down with a lovely bottle of cab sauv.
First: Otter – Was clearly good in my opinion so no risk.
Second: Hornetgags – this was THE most obvious good player after the previous 2 days. I wanted the 2 wolves to see each other so I picked HG in the hope that the other wolf would apply the same tactic of choosing the most non-wolf player and we could then see each other, and start working together to pick off players over the next few days but Mike didn’t so my play didn’t work. Still, 2 wolf kills that night so no complaints!
Third: 352 - Easy one! Not voting for anyone that went for Diamond obviously and went for the one that clearly picked me out as a wolf so wouldn’t have voted for me if they were too. My only slight concern was that if we both killed 352 then it would be 2v2 and Opti said we had to outnumber the good. I thought we only had to equal team good to win? So 2v2 wouldn’t have been enough in this game, but I did expect Mike to go for whoever went for him so I still thought we’d be ok – just a small doubt in the back of my mind!
Day 1 ( AS GOOD): Watfordtalk – I jumped on the bandwagon – happy with the kill. Never realised it was at the expense of my own soul.
Day 2 (AS EVIL): WAS – In my opinion was clearly good from the posts they were making. As soon as Moog went for them I openly followed up on his theory as I wanted them ‘good’ as gone. By the time I got back from the gym they were all but out so my vote was all but irrelevant and went under the radar hopefully.
Day 3: (AS EVIL): HH24 – Good work Moog! Easy to follow you on that one too. I genuinely thought she may be the Seer before from her first post on day 1, so funny that she got made the replacement seer! Left my vote late and when I did posted: “My vote is pretty pointless, as only 2 voters left and I’m not voting for Miked, so doesn’t matter. I have little else to go on than anyone else so will reluctantly go with hh24”. I hoped that when HH24 was revealed as good, people would look at this post and confirm me as good in their eyes for the time being, keeping me off the radar.
Day 4: (AS EVIL): Simple one. It was so clear Diamond was good. HH24s post the previous day saying she believed the second message clearing Diamond, and then being revealed as the Seer was 100% proof Diamond was good. Only needed someone to move first so good work Mike. After Mike went for Diamond, Harrow went for Mike, and 352 went for me, I felt like we would at least get it to a tie break and so followed up on Diamond in the hope that the 4.45pm at Kempton was Wolf friendly!
Anyway, a good game and a cracking final day! Cheers Opti for running it and for the great write ups!
Until next time my furry friends...
This is what the game does to you!
Great game Meh, you timed the Diamond pressure to perfection. I have to admit that it was only at this point that I knew you were the wolf.
Wil explain more in my full write up, but I knew that gags would be the obvious kill and that the other wolf might go for them.
However, Moog was very obviously good, and in his reaction to my messages I thought that he might be the seer, so opted for him. Also, he had a band of followers, so I realised I needed to disband this ASAP.
My second night was your third so you opted for CB when I went for Hornetgags. Still a good kill though.
It was only my second game too, first game I was eaten on night 1, this time night 2. Diamond was suspicious of me in day 2 so I was surprised that I was eaten and "obviously good" but then I was suspicious of HH24 and Diamond.
Sorry Otter, please don't take offence x
You were on my list as the least Wolf-like rather than the most good-like! Most others were showing signs of inactivity, suspicious over activity, or loaded posts. Yours always seemed pretty genuine. Not a bad thing as you wouldn't be lynched, but just felt like an easy target in the absence of anything concrete and the odds seemed to be in my favour.
The only reason I lasted so long was because I was gunning for Mike so much. Had I been killed overnight Mike would have been instantly made number 1 suspect.
Shame. I had no idea who the other wolf was out of Ashdon, Meh and 352 though.
I worked out the wolves on the last day to be fair. But the other votes for Diamond screwed us haha. Will read through the above a bit later when I have time.
Was a good game in the end, but a shame we lost.
So, this was the first time I was an Evil character (after being a Witness and a Martyr respectively).
I was the Beta wolf from the start. My only real plan was to take out the experienced players quickly, that were obviously helping 'good'.
...didn't quite go to plan (one of the worst ever?). It was all very hard to decipher. I noticed that Moog very strongly did not believe that Grrwood was evil, but he could have been any character at that point. Going on how difficult it would be to find an evil on the first day and that WatfordTalk was just an unfortunate random, I thought that it would be better to keep Grrwood alive, and I voted for WatfordTalk. In hindsight, I really should have seen that WatfordTalk's behaviour was far more suspicious than Grrwood, but at the time I couldn't see it.
Once WatfordTalk was good, I looked back to see if there were any clues. I saw that Cthulu mentioned that WatfordTalk as suspicious, which I didn't think he would do as the traitor, and was pointing too many fingers to be a wolf. So I send a message to Opti to kill Cthulu. Oops.
Well it couldn't get much worse from here. I kept repeating, as I did the first day, that the wolves would be hiding in the low posters, but this was starting to wear thin. I wanted to limit the exposure of those named, to try and minimise the number people could say were definitely innocent, but the full moon helped in this respect, as did Grrwood getting killed for inactivity.
The 1st message (seer) was clever at threading who the seer had voted for, so I suspected either Moog or Diamond. Moog was my number 1 target already: - "someone on a mobile device, due to the typos. Also should be "whom" rather than who" - was a bit too perceptive and certain and sounded staged. Especially as he was then adamant that the (good) message was from the seer.
Moog instantly rubbished the second message as very different to the one on the first day, and I didn't think it was THAT obvious (it did look like a copy, and more wolflike overall, but it could have been seen as 'the seer is trying to remain constant). It was then that I noticed Moog's constant use of 'suspicious'.
I wanted to not post a message at all and notice whether the village would turn on somebody, and whether some were following others. Almost had a heart attack when Harrow said: "Because you haven't PM'd Opti yet, Mr Wolf."
I knew that WAS and Happy were out all day, and the village had been too boring, so decided to send my second message around 5pm. This actually worked far better than I imagined, and this topic remained a suspicion amongst the village for the next couple of days. WAS said: "I think it is an inexperienced wolf . Someone more experienced would have named myself or HH24 knowing that we weren't going to be about for most of the day to defend ourselves." I didn't need to be that explicit it turned out.
I thought at this point that 352 might be the full moon wolf.
Everyone had voted with Moog and a clique had started to form (CB, Harrow, Moog, Gags, Diamond) which I knew I needed to break up. There was nothing to do but to go with WAS, and I wasn't sure if he was evil: Cthulu's (voice from the dead) message then worried me!
I knew I should kill the experienced players who strongly believed that Gags couldn't be evil, which left Moog and Diamond, or Gags because he was the only confirmed innocent. Moog had been guarded, so it should have been an easy decision, but I did think that he was a little too 'obviously good' to be the seer, and that he might have just latched on to somebody else. After a bit of pondering, I killed Moog, and decided to try and get Diamond the next day. Good choice.
Message to Opti
I'm having a bit of a debate in my head.
I want to kill Moog, I think.
It's between him, CB, Gags or Diamond today.
There is a chance Moog is secretly misleading the group as an evil, but he keeps being too logical. Surely he's good. I'm pretty sure some of the others think he is the seer, but he's probably being too loud for that.
I might be able to view him tomorrow and turn the others on him. I could definitely raise the stakes for him to be viewed. It comes down to whether I could get the majority to turn on him.
I briefly changed my mind to CB, but I'm switching back again. I want Moog dead.
Moog final answer.
I didn't know whether there was going to be a second seer, as I didn't see it in Opti's retro rules. I sent a fairly early message about Diamond, but it only got picked up later by Opti, who posted both messages together. I felt pretty hard done by, as this told everybody that the second message could not have been a reaction to the first.
How people didn't get that the second message was from Happy was a miracle, especially as it was the one excusing Diamond of being good.
I laid a few traps: I added a bit of poor grammar, as in previous games I have seen people latch on to these ideas and then accusations start to fly; I also used 'They' instead of he and she, just for fun. Funnily enough, these claims were all thrown at Happy. Beautiful. Such a great feeling when you set a subtle trap and without even suggesting it yourself, somebody just falls headfirst into it.
The only problem is that Harrow was now pointing the finger at me for the first time. It was a very astute spot: I had also noticed that wolves do often contribute semi-regularly, but do not point fingers, in previous games.
Luckily however I had Diamond on my side. I played on this as many posts as I could get away with and spent many posts speaking about how I didn't think he was evil. The village mood seemed very pro Diamond (I knew Diamond was good after the second message) and anti HH (who was pretty earnestly saying that Diamond and her were both innocent). I thought I'd let it be and try and join Diamonds party (as others seemed to trust him), whilst simultaneously taking out his closest supporters.
I knew that the seer message was HH, and really hoped that Diamond would still take her out. He did.
The second seer was dead (and Diamond, who I thought was VERY GOOD, was close). I wanted to get Diamond that night, but I thought that Diamond could guard himself.
I killed Casetti instead, as he jumped in to defend Diamond. I probably should have gone for Gags (I did suspect that the other wolf might do this), but I thought that we were behind in the game and I wanted to break up the little voting block quickly, before they turned on me or the other wolf.
So, like with Escobar (I've just finished S2 Narcos), I had taken out Diamond's supporters (bar Harrow). I didn't even consider that there might be a third seer, so I didn't even post. I wanted to know who people would turn on. Why give anything away when nobody was really troubling me?
People were suspicious of Diamond, despite it being almost impossible: HH basically proved Diamonds innocence. But I sensed blood, as I knew at least half were turning on Diamond. Obviously it was a delicate balance between getting support and seeming suspicious.
However, it got to around 7/8pm on a Friday night and I didn't know if people would forget to vote, and I had the most votes (1) so my hand was forced a little.
I actually voted the second 352 posted their vote, and I wonder which way 352's vote would have gone if he had seen my vote first. At the time, before he admitted the trap I thought it was another piece of bad luck, but now I think he might have voted for me.
I came up with some statistics which I thought I could hide behind, but were obviously rubbish, and I knew Diamond would instantly give me a second vote. Ashton and Meh's absence really made it tense.
Diamond played his fantastic Mr Guardian hand, and I thought I was screwed. Genius move. After ten minutes of fretting, I came up with a passable excuse that he could have hidden many messages (ignoring the fact that it was way more authentic being at the very beginning). Meh played fantastically at this point (the first time I actually knew he was the Beta). Ashton came in and saved the day, when I thought it would go to a betting event.
I'm not sure how much Meh read (as he was 'out out'), but at the end of the day I admitted I was the alpha and that I was going for Harrow. Opti deleted it, and this suddenly made the event much more stressful.
I was holding the following message for after the vote, but I didn't have enough time to send it as Opti closed the game too soon at the end of the day. This was a shame, as it would be a legitimate way of finishing the game off. I instead left a more subtle message about killing Harrow, if I was the wolf instead.
Mr Wolf here. Well, aren't I looking forward to some tasty treats tonight!
Well done for killing Diamond off, I have been planting the seed for a while now...
You should have listened to Harrow. He's mine tonight, other wolf, in case you get tempted. I've been hungry to get rid of him for days, but I've held off the temptation. Winning is more important at the end of the day and killing him would only invoke suspicion.
Beta, if you avoid taking yourself, Harrow or I out tonight, then Evil will have the spoils.
*ahem* Ster Wolf
I then finalised Harrow's kill with Opti
I posted today that 'I hoped my plan would work' in the other group, in case I needed to explain my comments from last night, today. If Meh killed Harrow also, I'd explain that I was trying to get one wolf to kill the other, or at the very least, one (non-helpful) villager to minimise damage, whilst sparing my life as 'I knew I was innocent'. I composed this message to Opti, to be released as I was protesting my innocence to the group, but luckily I didn't need it:
Hello Tasty Villagers.
Mr Wolf here.
As you might have already read (before Opti deleted the posts), Ashton and myself are EVIL. As you cannot kill both of us, we have won, whether you like it or not.
I wonder who we get to feast on tonight... delicious!
Sorry that was a ramble. It was a great game (filled with some awful, but also some very smart, decisions on both sides) and I learnt a lot as a wolf. I definitely think we should do these more regularly, and would be happy to run one in October, but only if Meh! promises to runs one too shortly after.
Let's discuss plans shortly.
Outstanding write up Mike and a good read. Evil played a blinder. Both sides made errors but even though Harrow eventually got you Meh was simply invisible.
Good write up Mike and some good insights into alpha wolf messaging. It's good to get some other perspectives about how other roles are played in the game for us novices as they really help to give me and hopefully other players an idea on how to play each role better, ultimately helping us play better more technical games in future. Would be interesting to hear and see how the Seer, replacement Seer, Guardian and Traitor played the game too, especially the Seers as viewing players and deciding messages based on those would be particularly difficult for me had I been selected.
And I think more regular games would also help us be better players as I forgot a lot of what happened last year so definitely up for Mikes in October, plus happy to run an additional one in November. Would be good to get a structure in place for the cemetery, tavern, and main game for all new games so would be easier to create each game rather than setting each one up individually on the fly?
I really was 'out out' on Friday night so saw no messages from other than what I quickly glanced at around about 8.40pm, so missed your messages Mike. I guess they were against the rules if Opti removed them. Guess you are a wolf though so dem rulez are for braking!!!
Guardian role in a small game such as this is easy enough, look at who you think the Wolves will go for and protect them. Moog on night 1 was easy enough as he looked a bit too good to me and had experience on his side, something that Wolves hate. Night 2 was HG who was proven good and night 3 the only absolutely proven villager was me, so I took a punt on Mike as I really was shaken when HH was shown to be good, (doh), and the blinkers were well and truly on.
One thing I saw from this game was that previous experience on wolf like behaviour went out of the window, so experienced players don't always make good players. When I read back on my hunt for HH I am genuinely worried for my own sanity.
Next game the Guardian role needs to be confirmed as to whether they can protect themselves or not.