Transfer List

Discussion in 'The Transfer List' started by hornmeister, Jan 31, 2017.

  1. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Well we’re leveraged up to our eye balls in debt and have a £50m+ gap on our finances that I would assume selling at the very least one of Sarr and Dennis was supposed to try and bridge. Our parachute payments schedule after this year is £35m then £0. If we don’t sell Sarr now he’ll be worth virtually nothing in a year with a year left on his deal and what other saleable assets will we have? Given that it’s been made clear Gino wants out, then a Derby/Mel Morris situation is hardly beyond the realms of possibility is it?
     
    RS2 likes this.
  2. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    I don't think we are anywhere near going under, the problem is our club is run like Harrods, the problem is that most of the stock is more like Poundstretcher's!
     
  3. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    But Derby still exist.

    What I think is stretching a point is the idea the club disappears altogether. Certainly that this is “probable” as you suggested.
     
  4. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Derby are much bigger club with more potential interest in buying them to keep the administrator happy though.
     
  5. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    You don’t think there would be any interest in a near London club which has consistently been in the top 30 of English football over the past 25 years?

    I’m not trying to belittle the financial problems but I think the idea that the club will “probably” cease to exist is far too pessimistic.
     
    UEA_Hornet likes this.
  6. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Well considering we struggled to exist as a PL club, If our income has over halved and yet we only sell £10m worth of players, I can’t see how we end up in anything other than a disastrous situation?
     
  7. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    If Sarr and Dennis were to go down to £20m the pair, hard to see that we have enough saleable assets to cover our debt. Might be able to muddle through but it wouldn’t be pretty and I’m sure all budgeting was done on us getting £40m plus for these guys.
     
  8. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    I think if you’re a 15 year old who likes playing FIFA and still has posters of players on their wall I can see the attraction of keeping Dennis & Sarr, I think most of the adults can see the reality of the situation though.
     
  9. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    But that's not what you said. You said the club "probably won't exist in a year".

    There's surely a difference between the two situations. Many clubs have ended up in disatstrous financial situations. Not many have ceased to exist, certainly in the last few decades.
     
  10. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    Not existing in a year is a disastrous situation, is it not?
     
    miserableoldgit likes this.
  11. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    Are you being deliberately obtuse?

    I agree we may end up in a disastrous situation. I do not agree that the club will probably cease to exist. Plenty of clubs have ended up in the former position, very few in the latter.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2022
    Burnsy likes this.
  12. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    Sorry but this is nonsense.

    We come from a similar starting point with our pessimism around the club but your posts are getting increasingly hyperbolic in their nature.

    You can be an adult and not have the same opinions as you all the time. I think there is a realistic, if unlikely, scenario where we keep Sarr or Dennis (or even both) and we they knuckle down. We may go up and we may not. We may suffer as a result, we may not. But the OTT nature that you must be a child to not think it’s a doomsday outcome is a bit unnecessary.

    ‘You must be a child to think this…’
    ‘We won’t exist as a club if…’

    Just take a breath!
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2022
    WatfordTalk likes this.
  13. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    I just don’t understand how the maths of keeping both Sarr and Dennis stack up, we’d get away with it if we went up, but if we didn’t, it just doesn’t add up in any way based on the information we have to hand about the clubs finances, and what we know our income will be this year and next. I just don’t understand how anybody would willingly want them to stay based on the risks involved.

    I’m sorry that “well it hasn’t happened to any other club so we’ll be fine” isn’t a good enough rationale for me.
     
  14. miserableoldgit

    miserableoldgit Reservist

    The way you are attempting to explain leverage, balance sheet, liquidity and debt in accessible language, without using any of those words as they turn people off is great

    There is a temptation to put your fingers in your ears and try to ignore reality and you are right - in future forecasting the board and lenders will have plugged a value on Hernandez/Sarr and Dennis and the likely way that cash would flow - I cannot believe that the rock bottom expectation wasn't over 50m - probably 60m + with something like half coming in in the next 12 months, then i would be astonished - I suspect is will be under 50m now and the Giaretta "bluff" just ain't plausible as the Pozzo's have no history of plugging huge cash holes, even short term - i suspect that if we don't sell one of the 2 left on the table for good upfront money, then we will be in the poop quickly - If that is not Sarr then it could even be worse as his value plummets unless he plays a starring role pre Xmas and gets sold in January
     
    The undeniable truth and a19tgg like this.
  15. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    I didn't say we would be fine. We clearly won't. But I don't think we will cease to exist. I may be wrong, but I think that is extreme pessimism.
     
  16. Carpster

    Carpster Squad Player

    Where would Sarr play? In a front two? No thanks. Dennis ok if he wants to be a team player. He and Pedro would worry any defenders in the Championship.
     
    NathWFC likes this.
  17. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    Which is why no one has used that rationale.

    Others are saying we may not be ‘fine’ and could well head south. But that doesn’t equate to going out of business. It’s not binary.
     
    onion8837 likes this.
  18. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    I've said it before and I'll say it again, Dennis would absolutely destroy the Championship even if he can barely be arsed.

    If no one's paying over £15m minimum then make him stay. Sarr can **** off.
     
    wfcmoog likes this.
  19. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    If you’re happy to keep Dennis even if he can’t be arsed, surely you’d keep Sarr on the same basis given his history in this league?
     
    onion8837 likes this.
  20. Carpster

    Carpster Squad Player

    Then we need to play a system that has not been implemented so far under Rob. I can't see either here come the Sheff Utd game so it doesn't really matter.
     
  21. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    I honestly don't even think Sarr was that good last time. Just bored of him and will be happy to see the back of him.
     
    RS2 likes this.
  22. LeedsOrn

    LeedsOrn Reservist

    Don’t think Sarr was that impressive and wouldn’t fit as well in the current system as he did under Munoz. His contract is a ticking time bomb too unlike Dennis.
     
    wfcmoog, Bubble and RS2 like this.
  23. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    We wouldn’t have gone up without him, that’s as good as he needed to be surely?

    And I know you don’t rate him as high as others and that’s fair - but he’s not crap and certainly not crap in this league. So given you don’t like that we keep ageing wasters like Cathcart and Cleverley, I can’t understand why you want to actively see the back of one of our best players who isn’t old!
     
    Heidar and onion8837 like this.
  24. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    I can't think of a role for Sarr in the team.

    Perhaps wing-back, but that could be a disaster.

    We could try and use him as one of the front two but he also tends to look lost there on the few occasions it's been tried.
     
  25. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    Oh come on, at the time there was plenty of clamour for him to get in the Team of the Season and he was only kept out by Buendia. I think some are allowing his performances last season to cloud what he did the year before.
     
    Bubble and onion8837 like this.
  26. onion8837

    onion8837 Reservist

    You are a seriously strange person. Unless it is all for effect, which I am beginning to think is the case
     
  27. LeedsOrn

    LeedsOrn Reservist

    He was our best player certainly but if you look at his overall goal contribution it was underwhelming. I think he performed at par or even below par for what we expected given his performances in 19/20. For context, he got fewer non penalty goals than Harry Cornick got last year. I think if Dennis stuck around I’d expect him to get more than 11 non penalty goals.
     
    NathWFC likes this.
  28. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    And Harry Cornick has a much nicer voice
     
  29. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    I don't disagree that he did well last time in the Championship and would likely do well again this time, I just don't think he was absolutely sensational.

    23 goal contributions - a few being penalities - isn't exactly incredible. It's a good return, and yes we wouldn't have gone up without him, but if it were him or Dennis to stay then I'd choose Dennis every time. I just find him more enjoyable to watch.
     
  30. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    A number of players in the last few years have better numbers than Sarr had in the Championship, and none of them cost anywhere near £40m, or even half that.

    There's nothing for effect in saying he wasn't "that" good. He wasn't. He did well but it wasn't a season of mind blowing performances week in, week out where he bagged 25 goals and 20 assists. He still had a number of no shows/non-performances and the numbers just weren't that impressive for a player of his supposed quality and a player that cost what he did.

    He had a good 20/21 season, not an incredible one. Simple.
     
  31. davisp2

    davisp2 Reservist

    If either Dennis and Sarr arent sold this window, the best option for them is to either stay and help get us promoted, or play well and get a transfer in January. I dont buy into the view that players always down tools. Surely that could be counter-productive, and reduce the chances of a future move? Of course things can change and they may start pushing for a move, as we get closer to the transfer deadline. Just not seen anything yet to suggest that its a given they will sulk if they stay
     
  32. I think if you swap ".....cease to exist" to ".....end up in adminstration" you'd have many more in full agreement.
     
    Keighley and davisp2 like this.
  33. tonycotonstache

    tonycotonstache Reservist

    I have the game worn Sarr shirt from our promotion season where he scored the winning penalty against Coventry. I keep hoping that he gets a big move to a big club so the value of it rises from the current £7.
    50 it's likely worth now.
     
  34. tonycotonstache

    tonycotonstache Reservist

    That could apply to soooooo many on this forum these days
     
  35. It's only worth £5.80 if you use the correct ex rate :)
     

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