Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by The Voice of Reason, Apr 26, 2021.
Anyone of his integrity would never walk out on Leicester.
Agreed; that would be ROI in itself.
It's good but I prefer our one with the Gino game vs all our ex-managers.
Did that one end with some kids being blown up?
No, but the Xisco "Kid" along with every other manager got eliminated one by one. Take the term 'eliminated' for what you will. It's in the media thread.
Despicable behaviour. I’ll add Watford to the list of clubs I’ll boycott by never going to watch live or acknowledging their existence as a football club…. Along with Newcastle and Manchester City.
This might be his finest work, and I'm a fan in general.
There's no chance of him walking out! Brendan, Brendan...come back will you, there's still loads of work to be done here!!
See I'm not entirely convinced, I understand your point and it may well be a factor but the PIF is more than just a pot of money. Saudi Arabia is oil rich, but demand for oil is depreciating and over the next few decades will be a fraction of what it is now. Initially the PIF was set up as a way to manage and invest the funds Saudi Arabia made from its oil industry, however now they have recognised that without forward-thinking their days as a financial superpower are numbered.
Now the aim of PIF is to maintain the wealth of the country through well managed, strategic investments and using their returns abroad to stimulate their own economy. Essentially the long-term aim is to replace oil money with investment returns. Sure, there may well be a PR strategy at play (good PR means more likely to get foreign investment) but their strategy so far has been the opposite - they invest abroad, rather than relying on foreign investment in their country. This would be a complete reversal. Also, this isn't just any old pot of money to build, this is the future of their country. I'm not sure they'd invest in a vanity project and risk their future.
For example, their other 'sport-washing' project the F1 track, is part of the Qiddiya project. Their initial $8bn investment is expected to generate $5.86bn per year. Rather than a vanity project, that is actually part of a legitimate business plan. I expect similar from their Newcastle investment, they'll spend up front but expect returns - I don't expect it to be a bottomless pit running at a loss.
But we'll see, it's all speculation.
He's in love with Watford, and just doing a bit of career development at clubs he quite likes.
Once we've got Kim Jong-Un in to do a spot of sportswashing and Brendan to get us playing the right way, the sky's the limit.
Love the line about returning Newcastle to their rightful place (14th).
But what makes Qatar’s situation any different to Saudi Arabia in that respect? Other than being significantly smaller relatively speaking, in terms of wealth and the ability to throw billions at a football club.
Really good point, but I would come back to the point about it being a football club. How many footballs clubs have you ever come across where it generates a return for the investor? At best you can make them self-sustaining. If you accept that taking a dividend from the club is impossible, the only real investment opportunity here is to see an appreciation in the capital value of the asset. The Saudis have stumped up about £250m for their stake in Newcastle - the club needs considerable investment in the training ground, playing staff etc etc and we are talking hundreds of millions here. If you look at the valuations of the biggest clubs (Man Utd being £3bn now or whatever it is), it's hard to see how you build a club to that sort of value without massive investment. The Saudis aren't stupid, so perhaps they're seeing something I'm not, but it isn't immediately obvious to me how they make money from this, hence why I keep coming back to it being an investment in another form of the word.
Just qualifying for the CL is worth a minimum £20m, each group stage win is worth £3m so qualifying for the knockout stage is worth £40m and winning it is worth about £80m, then the super cup is an additional £5m.
So if they want to extract maximum revenue from the club they really need to get into the CL and be capable of winning it, and to do that will require significant investment.
There is also the speculative aspect of what TV deals might look like in the future, if the ESL (or a variation of) rears it’s head again and they want to be part of that conversation they have to be a top four club in this country to be able to benefit from all that would bring.
So if you ignore any sports washing element, for it to provide any chance of being a meaningful investment they need to be a CL club and that won’t happen without an awful lot of money being spent. That money won’t necessarily disappear into the ether though, as you say the investment would grow the value of the club.
If you buy a house and spend £200k adding an extension, you might be able to rent it out for an extra £500 a month compared to if you didn’t bother. It would take decades to recoup the extra outlay you spent extending the house through the extra rent, but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t worth spending the extra £200k and that it won’t benefit you in the long run.
And all of that is looking at it purely from an investment point of view and not factoring in the PR aspect, which is highly likely to be part of it, because as you’ve stated buying a football club for investment purposes is illogical.
And the bit of Geordie whataboutery stating 'you all breathe the same air as people from.....Saudi Arabia!"
There's a very long 'Slicker' article about this in today's Private Eye. It's such a kosher deal that Ashley loaned Staveley 'some' money during negotiations for the first Saudi bid for the club...
Excellent video on the hot topic of the moment.
Very interesting - thanks for that.
Are these owners trying to get out of the 8 million pounds Bruce would be entitled to if they get rid of him hence the hold up of the predictable..?
Oh I agree, football clubs aren't big money makers - only a few clubs run at a profit, although once assets and commercial value are added in I'd guess that number grows a bit. I'd expect they will want to invest to that top-end level to maximise commercial revenue and increase the overall club value, but I don't see it being an endless supply.
As for the PR side of it, surely they've had significantly more scrutiny and criticism since their takeover bid was made public than if they'd have carried on doing what Saudi do? Maybe it's the long game, but short term it certainly does the opposite. The outrage at their crimes in Yemen and suppression of journalists was fairly quiet, with a few incidents bringing it back to the surface in short bursts, but now everybody is talking about it. Seems an odd strategy to me. But I'm no PR manager!
We’ve seen this sort of comment before !
That being said, it's moon man logic - Brendan probably has the best set-up for any manager in the league who isn't Pep Guardiola - they regularly challenge for the Champions League, he's broadly loved there, they have mega-rich owners who actually care about and love the club and also somehow manage to not even be that problematic, plus they've just opened an incredible new training ground that will genuinely attract players and improve their youth ranks. Why on earth would he swap that for nowhere near as much transfer cash as lots of idiots are claiming initially, the newly-minted most hated/controversial owners in world football, and a baying set of astonishingly entitled Mags in the stadium?
It is strange, thought they would have got rid of him by now. Maybe doing a Gino and have someone lined up to announce the same day?
Probably something like that.
Guy on Sky (spending all day outside the training ground ready for that breaking news) just keeps saying he expects a sacking soon because the owners (well one of them) have been seen at the training ground twice.
Would be quite funny to see how the Geordies react if Bruce did stay on for a bit.
And I can quite a lot of the media criticising them actually as a lot like Bruce.
I presume the Wednesday ?
We (Watford) play Man City the Saturday after who have to play then as they are in Champions league action the Tuesday after .
Because a) Leicester might struggle to challenge for the CL again (Newcastle's money won't make it easier), and b) well, it's Rodgers isn't it? He's not exactly immune to ******* off fan bases by leaving clubs abruptly!
Hilarious they’re keeping Bruce on at least for the Spurs game, especially as it’s at home.
I assume 'sacked in the morning' will be the song of choice then?
Shall we all just go to the Newcastle game? I'd love to be a fly on the wall.
Ben White getting stick for the "outrageous" revelation than as a footballer he doesn't go home and watch endless games on TV..
I mean he certainly won't be the first to do that - quite a few high profile players aren't necessarily the biggest football fans generally who'd watch any game going.
Capoue said throughout his time here that he had no real interest in football beyond playing it.
The only judgement on him I make as a result of that is on the basis of preferring to watch basketball, because basketball absolutely sucks.