Hull City 1-1 Watford Fc 11/12/24

Discussion in 'Match Day' started by SkylaRose, Dec 9, 2024.

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Result Poll

  1. Tigers Roar (Dr. Watford is in the office)

    7 vote(s)
    25.0%
  2. Hornets Buzzing

    12 vote(s)
    42.9%
  3. Point Seems Fair

    9 vote(s)
    32.1%
  1. Heidar

    Heidar Squad Player

    I wish I had a power cut
     
    HornM25, SkylaRose, Vanhorn17 and 4 others like this.
  2. Clive_ofthe_Kremlin

    Clive_ofthe_Kremlin Squad Player

    If we'd have lost, I would have said we got exactly what we deserved.

    As it was, we got something we didn't much deserve.

    If you can play **** and still get something, that's the mark of a winning team they always say on match of the day.

    A terrible scrappy match of a 1000 throw ins. Their goal was both lucky a handball - don't know why we didn't protest. Our goal was a bit fortunate too, but well done Rocky B getting off the mark. Ngakia was poor - hardly surprising after so long out. Porteous and Pollock both had very good games. Bayo was OK - he didn't really get much service, but did OK with some layoffs and defensive work. Larouci also lethargic and I would perhaps have had Morris on at HT in his place.

    Best moments:-

    The Hull player taking a massive swipe at the ball on the edge of the area, missing it completely and kicking his own standing leg away.

    Louza and Palmer shoving each other around.
     
    CYHSYF, Robert Peel, WFC123 and 2 others like this.
  3. Burnsy

    Burnsy Guest

    Objectively, it’s very funny that we haven’t seen one ‘we come, we slap, we go home’ video from an away game this season.

    (I don’t think it’s funny when we do it at home just for reference)
     
    wfcwarehouse likes this.
  4. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    I think playing in purple melts our player's brains.

    That performance was worse than most of what we have witnessed since we got relegated from the PL in 2020. Dreadful, no pattern of play, no confidence on the ball (and we had a lot of early possession). Bayo truly back to his best of being the worst striker in this division and if it wasn't for Bachmann we could of conceded more than one goal. Speaking of their goal what a total farce that was, from build up to somehow scoring with his elbow. At that point, I was reduced to conceding defeat to the bottom side in true Watfordy style.

    Credit where it's due though, Baah and Vata combine well and actually do something will the ball in their half. A great run and Vata provides the finish. His first league goal for us and I hope that does his confidence the world of good. We were lucky tonight, even more so than we were against QPR last time out. Hull were just a poor if not worse than us for 80mins then didn't even deserve to go in front but still we made it happen. Not really sure what that first XI was - absolutely no attacking flair on the pitch and as poor as we are first half's that took the mickey.

    TC needs to work out what his best XI is and quickly. When Baah and Vata came on we clicked a little bit at least. Bayo offers nothing, Kayemebe and Ince offer nothing. Ngakia, well... he didn't get injured at least. Porteous had a good game, but we looked like we were 23rd not them. WBA will be a much tougher game on Sunday, and I do not expect TC to pick such a toothless side. Or, I hope he doesn't.

    I would call that two points dropped, but considering how it turned out it's a point gained because we deserved less than nothing.
     
    Irishorn likes this.
  5. lowerrous

    lowerrous Guest

    Absolutely pathetic tbh. We have had some extra days rest yet still looked so lethargic. But also when four of your starters are Ngakia, Sierralta, Louza and Ince then it’s not a surprise when your play is overly ponderous and lacking in intensity.

    It was as if we were playing for a draw but forgot you still have to put in some effort for that. In the end we were lucky to get away with a point, even though Hull were also terrible.

    Louza was back to mostly jogging around. Ince was unsurprisingly useless. Bachmann’s passing poor. Sierralta has been bad 3 games in a row now, plus he received more of the ball than anyone - which is a shame as he can't do anything with it than play 6 yard passes (and he even sometimes struggled with those).

    Chakvetadze today managed to somehow underhit every cross, while putting every shot over the bar. Chak’s dribbling today was still decent, but his positive influence on the season has been waning. Is he anaemic, shattered, both?! Give that man some steak, a red bull, some rest, something. And take him off crossing set-pieces ffs! As I’ve mentioned a few weeks ago increasingly our key danger man is not Chak but Baah.

    Our performance levels have been poor for weeks now. We’ve been limping through games and it’s amazing we still are where we are, but if this standard continues we won’t be staying there and will slowly slide down the table.

    The decline in the fluidity in our play seems to have coincided with Javier Pereira leaving and Robbo taking his place. Robbo looks very involved on the sidelines as well. Is Clevs starting to get blinded by favourites in the same was as him playing Ince too much by giving more responsibility to Robbo while sidelining our slick Spanish contingent including the Real Madrid guy? Our decline has also I think coincided with TDB getting injured - when you see Sierralta and Louza constantly exchanging 6 yard passes it shows we do miss someone more confident on the ball in deep areas to get us out of defence and through the lines.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 11, 2024
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  6. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    UEA said it but a worrying look that we seemed to be passive and lacking energy in both halves.

    Usually look half decent after the break.

    We do need to work out how to play a game of football for 90 minutes as Sheffield United, West Brom and Burnley probably won't be so unlucky to not be 2/3 -0 up.
     
  7. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    That’s all on Cleverley today; what on earth possessed him to start with Ngakia and Ince?

    We have real electricity on the bench in Baah, Ebosele and Andrews. There was a fragile opponent in Hull. Yet, he goes for the static since and half-fit Ngakia? Appalling decisions.

    Kayembe has done very little for a few weeks now.

    Bayo could have had slippers on tonight, okay yes the service isn’t great but he’s not good. He doesn’t give his all and he’s just not threatening enough in small doses.

    Thought the centre-backs played well, thought Louza, Larouci and Chakvetadze did ok.

    First time Cleverley has got it very wrong today, lucky to get a point, win at home and draw away will usually set you up for a decent season but he needs to stop setting us wrong to start with.
     
  8. lowerrous

    lowerrous Guest

    You only needed the first three words.
     
    Steve Leo Beleck likes this.
  9. Irishorn

    Irishorn Gael Force

    Uninspiring performance from Watford. I thought Louza was trying to push things for us.

    Happy with the draw in the circumstances. I felt we were curtailed by playing Ince and Ngakia. Hull are very poor and we made them look the better team.

    Bachmann had his wobbly moment, but pulled off some good saves. Our subs were effective.

    Kayembe, Chak, Bayo and Larouchi not good nights for them (aside from Chak’s great effort in the 2nd half).

    Centre halves were fine.

    Can’t complain about the result with the chances they had, notwithstanding the hand ball goal.
     
  10. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Well, he described Ngakia as a "high-class player" who can "bring something different to the squad"...
     
  11. lowerrous

    lowerrous Guest

    If you look at our effort levels out there you can count today as well... so it will have basically been 2 weeks by the time we play West Brom.
     
    Chumlax likes this.
  12. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Poor poor performances all over the pitch. It is frustrating that every front 3 combination Cleverly can think of must seemingly include the dreadful Bayo up top. Even when he does nothing he never gets hooked.

    Pleased for Vata to get a goal. Pleased for Ngakia to get a decent game under his belt. Didn’t cost us but at one point Bayo headed away an inswinging corner on about the 2 yard line with Bachman having retreated with both feet behind the goal line in panic! Awful stuff.

    Lucky point in my view.
     
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  13. lutonh8a

    lutonh8a Squad Player

    Pathetic performance against a pony team. I thought the starting line up was a shambles. Playing bottom of the league with a fresher squad and we play Ngakia instead of Ebosele and drop Baah. Genuine question did Bayo play second half? He is utterly useless and we .ay as well be playing with 10 men most of the time when he starts. It felt like we had to try and play out from tricky situations because we didn't have anyone who could hold the ball up, run in behind or actually do anything. Surely it's time to just try someone else as the central forward. I would take Bond at this stage.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2024
  14. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Seems our subs often do better !

    Suppose it’s good they take their chances but really need more from the start .
     
    Irishorn likes this.
  15. Draws v Hull, QPR and Plymouth in the last couple of weeks. Bottom 2 teams and 19th.

    That should be at least 7 points.

    Awful.
     
    domthehornet likes this.
  16. Hornpete

    Hornpete Squad Player

    Also poor decision making, poor passing, poor cohesion, poor clearances.

    When the ball is bouncing about outside your box but you'll easily get to it before the forward. Do you;

    A - turn and play a hospital pass back to keeper,
    B - hoof it directly out of play, or
    C - play the ball down the line behind the defence so Baah or Bayo can run on to it pressuring the defender.

    You have a throw in on the half way line, do you;

    A - take 20 seconds to think about passing the ball back to the keeper?
    B - take this golden opportunity to quickly pass it back the the keeper?
    C - look to get the ball further up the pitch into an area you can attack the opposition box?


    You are playing up front and the opposition poorly gift our midfield the ball. Do you;

    A - hang about offside for a little longer.
    B - encourage our midfield to reset by quickly giving the ball to our keeper. Or
    C - try and make a diagonal run into the channel whilst the defence are trying to recover

    If you said C for any of the above, then you have failed the Watford FC players quiz. Better luck next time.

    Bachmann credit, some good saves and didn't really put a foot wrong.
     
  17. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    Interestingly the only game have started well in all season was Plymouth. We were at them all game and only our ex-rule breaker saved their blushes with a wonder goal in the dying seconds. We've shown, in that game alone, starting out the blocks with some intent can put a lot of sides in this division under the cosh. Why can TC not see that even in rotating the side as much as he does, we need to up our intensity?
     
    WillisWasTheWorst likes this.
  18. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    A couple of really good saves but in the second half definitely as guilty as others of the poor decision making, passing and clearances you mentioned at the start.
     
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  19. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Classic Bachmann.

    Baah and Vata will probably start Sunday - be ineffective against a strong defensive side and be taken off after an hour as we struggle along.
     
  20. lowerrous

    lowerrous Guest

    Baah yes, but no chance Vata starts (who would it be in place of?!).
     
  21. Burnsy

    Burnsy Guest

    Sliced clearance (because he really can’t kick) also started the calamity of errors towards their goal.

    That said, he was definitely more positive than negative tonight - and that’s been the case for a month or so in fairness to him.

    Think he’s proving himself to be what most of us thought he was - great shot-stopper, occasionally brain-dead, bang average distributor…serviceable for the team we are right now.
     
  22. YellowHornets

    YellowHornets Reservist

    Really poor performance this evening. Starting with Ngakia & Ince was never going to work… they’re both poor & shouldn’t be near the starting 11. How Ebosele is continually on the bench at the expense of Ngakia/Andrews/Larouci is just crazy.

    We’ve had our 2nd half performances savings us in games for most of the season, but our last 3 matches against Bristol City, QPR & tonight have all been poor for most of the match. And with the next few games being against some top teams, I think we may continue to see a slide down the table (down to 8th now).

    Goals are starting to dry up too.
     
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  23. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    True but people will want him to after today.

    Baah for Kayembe I guess.

    Maybe play 4 at the back which happened in the second half v QPR.
     
  24. Burnsy

    Burnsy Guest

    In my opinion, I wouldn’t mind Ince so much if we could see the signs and moved him further back into CM and took advantage of his passing range and cool temperament. (Not saying I’d start him or even have kept him - but at least I’d see a use)

    TC seems intent on employing him as an attacking player and he just isn’t that anymore. Just one more thing that TC seems wedded to and refuses to change despite the evidence before his eyes.
     
  25. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    I think the very fact that we are even in 8th after tonight shows how poor this division is in general. We were discussing in the SB how the table is a massive lie to how we have performed over the season. Even our really good home form results wise we have played some stinkers even in the victories. What we have had, up to this point is a massive slice of luck with other sides who cannot score more than one goal most of the time against us. That's either us being good defensive or them having as poor strikers as we do.

    I do think we will eventually sink into midtable misery as the season closes out, but the very fact most had us down for relegation fodder pre season is a testiment to how well or lucky we have been playing so far. I wouldn't of even thought of us being anywhere near the playoffs with almost half the season gone, but here we are. Do I expect us to challenge for them, no because we are not consisent enough to put up the sort of winning streaks a side needs. Do I see us in any danger of slipping into a relegation fight? At this point, no as long as our "luck" holds out. Eventually we will lose at home and it could well be Sunday, but if you look at the season overall purely on results when the whistle blows after each game, most Watford fans would be very pleased where we are in the table, even if it is indeed rather fortunate. But in football you either make your own luck or other teams do it for you.
     
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  26. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! First Team

    The problem with picking players with a view to a more difficult game at the weekend is that the players on the pitch for the supposedly easier game aren't up to it...
     
    põder, wfc4ever and YellowHornets like this.
  27. hjw

    hjw Reservist

    Tonight the inexperience of our manager showed, the starting 11 was very wrong. I don't think our squad is that bad, I just don't think Tom is getting the best out of them. I'm not blaming Tom, and i'm not saying get rid of him either. We just have to accept his inexperience sometimes shows and hopefully he can learn quickly. Need a performance Sunday
     
  28. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    I’m sure I’m just remembering him fondly but another game where I feel Rajovic coming on around the hour could have swung it for us..

    A lovely Larouci cross first-half I recall that fell to Ngakia, Bayo is nowhere near even reading it, Rajovic throws himself at it and probably toes it goalwards. It was his office after all, Bayo’s office is 40 yards from goal, controlling it and bringing it down successfully 27% of the time.

    I would understand if Bayo was an all action centre forward but he’s not and he’s no threat from any set-piece (when they are rarely delivered successfully).

    I feel as if we’re set up perfectly for a centre-forward of Rajovic’s ilk but TC seems to think different.
     
    Jumbolina likes this.
  29. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    That was awful, it was a performance we were all expecting every week before a ball was kicked this season. We are so slow in the build up that the opposition have the opportunity to get back and defend, which they do hence we don’t have any room in front of us to break quickly! The one time we break at speed we score!

    That’s 5 games without defeat which isn’t to be sniffed at, just shows the quality of the league this season!
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2024
  30. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    Absolutely terrible.
     
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  31. Burnsy

    Burnsy Guest

    I don’t think the table is a massive lie - I think the vast majority of teams are bang average, and we are included in that. Burnley, Leeds and Sheff Utd haven’t really been very good but will eventually sleepwalk out of touching distance as those behind them scrabble around winning games and then slipping up. I don’t think we have been worse than those teams we are in and around so it’s not a false position. It’s just a poor league in terms of ability (as you yourself have said, I agree).
     
    SkylaRose likes this.
  32. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Think you'll find Sierralta is contracted until 2027 (at least that's what most websites seem to think)... sorry to be the bearer of bad news for you!
     
  33. Burnsy

    Burnsy Guest

    Info I was given was that he was coming to the end of his deal. Accept that could be wrong though (sadly)
     
    Steve Leo Beleck likes this.
  34. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Quite.

    Burnley keep being booed off at home it seems after a goaless draw usually.

    Leeds great at home but so are so many as you say and lose a few away I think.

    Sheffield United seem to be the most solid but then look at how rubbish they were in the Premier league last season!

    Boro are probably the best side really but not very consistent.

    I noted what you said about a couple of players during the game and Cleverley in his BBC comments (presumably lifted from 3cr) does suggest Baah and Vata needed to work hard to get starts but was happy they got him out of a big hole tonight.

    Trouble is we don't have many other players with pace who can run with the ball and cause problems.

    It almost felt a bit Gareth Southgate like with England in a way.

    Least the defence seems better or maybe we are just getting more lucky in that regaard?

    And against QPR 4 at the back looked a bit better after half time.
     
    SkylaRose likes this.
  35. Heidar

    Heidar Squad Player

    One of the CBs hopefully.

    We look like Ivic/Edwards the last few games. 3 at the back only seems effective when Morris is playing. I mean, today we had 3 right-footed defenders playing to 3 left-footed midfielders - no wonder we could only go sideways.
     
    põder likes this.

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