Give Gino A Break?

Hodgson was the worst ever but looked a decent appointment at the start

 

Couldn't sleep last night so trawled through this entire thread.

As much as BBB must be on a wind up, his approach is a diluted version of so many of our current fanbase (particularly those on that nauseating Enjooooythegame site)

Anybody who understands financials must be alarmed by the current financial situation (which is a snapshot from the past so will only have deteriorated)
Anybody who goes to be entertained must be alarmed by the current entertainment value on the pitch
Anybody who wants a club that we can "identify with" (whatever that means to the individual) must be alarmed by the current club they support

Most of us started supporting Watford and not Spuds, Man U, Pool, Arse etc etc as they were our local side and, depending on when you started supporting the club, was a well run club, with players, managers and owners that cared. Those values do not hold true at all anymore

And the blame lies with our owners.....

 

On a side note, even that podcast FTRE who historically would back the owner over hell or high water and even ridicule fans that were questioning the owner's methods are now onside with the change is very much needed mentality

 

I dont disagree with some of what you say. I have never said that some of isnt Ginos fault. All I am saying is that if I had paid that vast amount of money out and invested a huge chunk I would be really annoyed if I was Gino.

Sometimes you have to remember there is another human being on the end of the vitriol.

 

I'm sure the owners of Blockbuster were annoyed after turning down the offer to purchase Netflix
I'm sure the owners of Excite were annoyed after turning down the offer to buy Google
I'm sure the owners of Quaker Oats were annoyed, after buying Snapple for $1.7b, and it sold two years later at a $1.4b loss

The original two businesses don't exist any longer because of bad decisions....however annoyed the owners may have been at the time

 

Following on from the post by @Halfwayline, the history of business is littered with bad decisions (and presumably annoyed senior managers and owners). I've found an article which lists some of the lessons that can be learnt from these bad decisions. I quote:

Lessons from history’s worst CEOs
Lesson: Listen to those around you. Fiorina [HP CEO] antagonised workers and investors alike while apparently never doubting her own rightness.
Lesson: Anderson [Union Carbide] was apparently devastated by the [Bhopal] disaster, but the fact remains that the buck stops at the top.
Lesson: Don’t let your emotions lead you into making poor decisions. [John Sculley forcing Steve Jobs out of Apple.]
Lesson: Make sure you aren’t incentivising a lack of ethics. Enron’s corporate culture was focused on increasing revenue at all costs. Ken Lay [CEO] gave free rein to a couple of distinctly dodgy subordinates.
Lesson: Always treat your customers with respect. [Gerald Ratner of Ratners Group. "Total crap" comment on what people bought from his shops.]
Lesson: Don’t gamble with your company’s assets; it always ends in tears. Speculative oil price trading nearly brought the company [China Aviation Oil] down and Chen [CEO] tried to hide what had happened... he was sentenced to four years and three months in jail after failing to disclose a US$550 million trading loss.

Now, if I were teaching at Harvard Business School, I would want my students to learn these lessons.

Source: https://www.theceomagazine.com/business/management-leadership/lessons-from-historys-worst-ceos/
Accessed: 8/6/23

 

I never thought I'd see the day TVOR pulled off a troll-con like this; spectacular work from him, to give credit where it's due, but this comment has lifted the veil. The jig is up, as they say.

 

Sorry I may have missed something, i don't understand who TVOR is and what is wrong with a suggestion that rather than sack a manager they give him support, I would love to have had a more motivated side and if a manager needs support give it to him.

 

just because my opinion is clearly different to most on this forum, it doesnt make me a troll.

You keep quoting "facts" that in reality are opinions.

it appears that most people here, think Gino is some evili genius or fool.

I think the guy has made mistakes, but has been badly let down by players, coaches and management team.

In reality we dont know all the details of exactly what has gone on behind closed doors and we probably never will. We are left to speculate, impose our opinions etc.

I want to see the stromgest team out on the field. If that means a team of less skill but more drive and enthusiasm I can live with that.

Having done another deep dive on our accounts they only show part of the story. This years accounts will show a more relevant story as there has clearly been an attempt to reduce costs.. There are other holding companies involved and I think you would have to understand those to get a full picture.

Given the investment, the salaries to players and the coaching and management team and the vitriol from the fans if I was Gino I would be angry and want and need change to happen.

We don't know how much outside influence is imposed on Gino, which may explain Gairetta.

 

Saying we don’t know the details behind the scenes is like saying it doesn’t matter that my car is on fire because I don’t know what’s happening under the bonnet.

There is more than enough stuff we DO know, which has been listed ad Infinitum. Most of the important stuff at a football club is visible to the public for 90+ minutes twice per week, and handily our performance is viewable in league table format, it’s not kept a secret.

 

yes i get that league table and results are clear facts. How we seem them play on a saturday is subjective.

I agree the players have been uninterested in my opinion but not a fact just an opinion

 

Judging by the spelling I think it's Skyla

 

'Bigbadbear is a troll' yet the same posters calling him that continue to engage the most.

 

Why am I troll if I have a different opinion to you.

I have an opinion that I am happy to debate. I have been told that I dont answer proven facts. None of can argue about actual facts. You can interoret them differently.

So many of the "irrefutable facts" are opinions and however times you repeat it to each other its still not a fact.

I am a long time supporter of our club and just hate the angst and vitriol. Have an opinion, debate it discuss it.

For what it's worth of course mistakes have been made, things we dont like have happened. We never know the full story which makes it harder.

I would be angry if I was Gino, probably including at himself.

 

Loled.

 

I’ve found big bad bear

 

The most amazing part of this is probably the idea that in England in 2023, kids require an ambassador to ‘get them into’ playing football, and that Troy deserves credit for that as a result.

 

Big Bad Bear is alive and well, while I stand by the fact that we have paid a fortune for a pile of players that dont give a toss and If I was Gino I would be cross.

However, with the Deeney interview, it does show a management structure that were too weak and should have got rid of him at the sytage that he was threatening to hurt players.

I always enjoyed Deeneys goals and for many he was the on the field leader. For me he has done a lot of damage to his own reputation and surely he will struggle to get a role in football.

The club should withraw all the Deeney merchandise.

I sort of want the club come out and condem what he has said but they can't because they pandered to him.

Deeney should never be an ambassador for our club or someone that kids look up to.


Clearly too much player power.

 

I’m so disappointed to hear TD say that he threatened to injure his own teammates to get what he wanted.
What the hell can you do when your star striker threatens to do that ? You or I would simply be immediately fired, but that would deliver him exactly what he wanted and see the club kiss goodbye to £20m+. Haven’t listed to the podcast, and don’t plan to now, but if this was to force a move away while at his peak, it clearly didn’t work so how did the club react ? A better contract ?
I had a lot of respect for Troy, the way he had come back from prison, loyalty to the club and delivering on the pitch with performance and leadership. All that has gone for good. The guy is just trash.

 

I thought Gino did well tonight said all the right things, debt coming down is good,

interesting line about Sarr ,Something like everybody wants to be here (putting Sarr aside)

I thought Gino deserves his break, I hope he gets it.

Anybody else go,

 

I did and I won't be giving him a break.

It was very much "we know best" from Pozzo and Duxbury, somehow ignoring the mess of the last few seasons.

There was some breathtaking arrogance in saying that basically all the managers turned out to not be the "right fit" and because they couldn't get a tune out of this squad, they had to go.

Nothing about building something, nothing about poor recruitment.

The word "stability" was used around 50 times and it got all Orwellian when they talked about this great set up and how we have everything, that just doesn't square with the horrible reality.

We are apparently just one good coach away from greatness. All the coaches we've employed were great, but turned out to not be the "right fit" and had to go, sooner rather than later. Each coach basically a pantomime villain.

Breathing down the manager's neck is a good thing as it helps to get perfection, sadly not acknowledging that this "perfection" has been a mess for years.

 

Tonight confirmed to me that I will be seeing the number of those banners increasing by October.

 

I would say that Pete hosting it was excellent and didn't shy away from anything awkward. More than once he fired some really awkward stuff their way - can't remember what, but was the sort of stuff the most anti Pozzo posters here would have applauded.

Pozzo refers to Bayat as "Mr Mogi", pronounced "Modge-ee". Says he's just an agent and it's nice to keep agents onside.

Information from Companies House was brought up but dismissed as incorrect around the company that Mr Mogi and Watford were together on - just standard stuff for an agent arriving in another country and trying to make an honest living.

My view was that Pozzo and Duxbury were uncomfortable with the level of research and detail that was put in front of them. Well done to those that raised it, one more as called Paul.

Also a bloke near the end who stood up and said that he'd heard all night about great it all was, but that differed from reality and that Pozzo and Duxbury should perhaps have some introspection as actually the facts point to the fact that they are the problem.

 

I thought they came over well, I sort of get it with Edwards for example if he not doing it day in day out on the training grounds and results not what you want I can see why you would lose patience.

We never have the full facts or the inside track I have heard that there were real ruptions internally with Edwards, but I cant prove it.

 

They came over just about as badly as is humanly possible.

People who were actually there have just told you this, do you not think you should listen to them on this one? How can you judge how well they came across better than someone who was there?

 

You clearly assume I wasn't there

 

Well if you were actually there then I think you may need urgent medical attention if you genuinely think they came across well.

 

I presume that change of heart doesn’t come with any admission that their devoted obnoxious arrogant defence of the club historically was misguided?