Cleverley Out?

The contrast in manager couldn't have been more stark last night.

From cerebral Silva to thicko Tom. How far we've fallen.

 

Quite. Looks at Pozzo squad building. If you drop Sissoko for being dreadful, you have to bring in Kayembe or Ince. We have a clown in goal on a long contract with no competition. Porteous and Sierralta as key centre back options. The abysmal Bayo up front with no competition. Crocked Ngakia and unreliable Larouci at full back. What is a manager supposed to do with that garbage?

On the bright side Vata, Baah, Chalvetadze, Louza and Pollock but that can’t cover the holes and some can’t be expected to play most games as they are in their breakthrough seasons.

 

In that case Pozzo is an imbecile. 12th with this squad would be overachieving. Would Pozzo sack the Forest boss if he went 10 without a win from here - probably!

 

Do you really and honestly think Gino reads opinions from people on Twitter or any form of media? He doesn’t even listen to reasoned journos or employees close to him when he wants to make a decision or do something.

The fact that TC played for us and fans would (by-and-large) be angry won’t faze him. He’s made a ton of bad calls over the years and he’s realised most fans will simply nod along. As much as people want to frame sacking TC would be different, I’d bet my last dollar that Gino is right and not a lot would happen within the fanbase beyond people saying they aren’t happy for a few weeks.

 

Probably. I think they are over-sensitive to trend and direction. I expect the QSF v1.0 and Mazz sackings were mainly due to the team taking their foot off the accelerator having secured safety early in the season by out-performing expectations.

 

I’m not even sure that would happen. For example the vibe from a certain podcast unit after QPR was “disappointing performance but overall TC has done an outstanding job”. (Fair take)

That was 2 defeats on the bounce, if it turned to 7 (currently at 4) and Pozzo pulls the trigger I’d wager decent money on the vibe from same people being “TC will always remain a legend, but this tough decision was ultimately the right one. Go well Tom!”

Ultimately the majority of our fanbase will always side with the godawful Pozzo, led by the podcasters.

 

It’s far more likely someone advised him TC should be appointed - he’s hardly a typical Pozzo appointment.

And he will now act and not listen.

All in my opinion of course.

 

Ownership is pretty much completely out of touch with the fanbase, and has been for several years, perhaps the best part of a decade. The disaffection and disillusion stemmed from the arrogance and impetuous impatience of the Roman Emperor-style owner, haphazard and piecemeal recruitment, weird extravagance (five year contract for Bachmann, two for a clearly over several hills Sissoko), who then turns his thumb down and condemns the coach to carry the can.

Certainly for me it's been tiring and tedious to watch a club run on whim rather than any identifiable strategy.

But, my sense this season – especially from away games – is that Cleverley, despite the obvious flaws in the squad, some of the team selections, some of the in-game decisions, has shaped a group of players who are at least committed to the cause. The connection between the players and supporters has been repaired to an extent and that manifested itself in, what, close to 4,000 Watford supporters making a trip on a freezing cold Thursday night to see a half-strength side take on a strong – or at least fairly strong – comfortably mid-table Premier League side in a competition some on here would like to see consigned to the bin.

It was nice to be in a big, noisy away following that was (by and large) fully behind the team (obvious flaws and all), despite it resembling an attack v defence training drill for Fulham's front four for 90% of the match. Vata's goal was lovely and for half an hour (including half-time) we could dream of a possible upset.

Unfortunately, the pox that Pep has unleashed on the English game - convincing coaches and average players they should try to tippy-tap their way out of defence – led to the penalty.

The words of Graham Taylor after the 1982 World Cup ring in my ears time and time again. "Everyone had watched the World Cup, played in the heat of a Spanish summer, and thought the way to play was passing out from the goalkeeper to the edge of the penalty box. I thought, 'we're going to shock a few by closing them down hard and early and see if they're as good as they think they are'."

 

Presumably depends on how well him and Duxbury are getting on? I get the sense Duxbury's generally in the Cleverley camp (as he was behind the Edwards appointment previously).

 

Correct.

It would be unwise to go into it publicly on here - but there’s a story I was told from the back end of last season that tells me that Gino isn’t as attached to TC as fans are. And he’s more Duxbury’s man.

 

Will be interesting to see what happens in the remaining 3 weeks of this window. TC has asked for the squad to be strengthened, and with players who are familiar with the champ. Remains to see what happens, but I think we fear we already know the answer....

 

Good post. It is undoubtedly the best season following Watford since pre 2020, however the level of moaning is off the scale. I don't think that is a Watford thing, I think that is a general football thing and fandom has changed as much as the game has. Maybe not just even football but a population thing - since Covid the level of negativity in people in day to day life is remarkable. I was talking to a Cov fan yesterday and he said the same thing about their fanbase - tetchy, impatient, demanding and can't enjoy what is in front of them.

I would also say, and this is at risk of prodding the nest of some of the most vitriolic Pozzo out brigade, I think the way Watford is run isn't unique. I think it is more of a case that football is broken rather than the club. The way football clubs are run is beyond belief and wouldn't be allowed nor accepted in the real world.

 

The final paragraph is nonsense. If you are going to prod the nest you better be wearing your protective suit Tut!

 

The squad is rank and the winter fixture congestion was always going to highlight a lack of depth. I really hope fans don't let Pozzo pull the wool over their eyes again. Cleverley isn't the main culprit. Yet again that is Gino Pozzo. I for one would make my dissatisfaction known from the stands.

 

And that’s fine - but in your heart of hearts, do you think many would be with you in being very vocal?

And it would need to be prolonged etc.

We have already seen Gino’s colours with stewards removing banners etc.

I just don’t see much happening.

 

Agree with this post-i would add that the stewarding was quite relaxed which helped the atmosphere which continued to be positive despite being almost totally outplayed. Maybe helped by the away fans totalling nearly half the actual attendance.

 

Edwards is available again. Be good to build a new team around him.

 

Nothing will happen. The vast majority of the fan base (myself included) really don't care enough about TC (and the club in general) to do anything other than have a grumble on the internet, we'll still have 95% of season tickets renewed each season no matter how bad it gets.

The main singing group won't rock the boat as the club have given them access to a part of the ground before/after games.

Social media commentators, specifically podcasters, are mainly (not all of course) more interested in clicks and views and keeping the club happy so they can land an exclusive interview etc.

 

I always liked him.

 

Call him Rob.

 

No, that's why he failed before. Call him Mr Edwards and we fly.

 

Dangerous from him last night being 3-1 down and bringing Baah and Chak on. To me it was absolutely pointless and would of deserved the criticism if either were injured.

 

Yeah, I agree nothing will happen and Pozzo can do what he wants. But if only to help convince myself I'm not complicit, I feel obligated to direct some vitriol his way.

 

They were stripped off and waiting to come on at 2-1, so were clearly coming on in the hope of changing the game. Sadly we conceded before the ball went out of play again. Also, someone had to come on to replace Vata as there was no point him playing any more minutes at 3-1. Our squad isn't that big that we're spoilt for choice with players to rotate.

 

May I introduce you to a certain GP?

 

I keep waking up in cold sweats and then realise exactly what nightmare I was having…

 

I'm aligned here. I see it as bring players in and they're backing TC, if they don't his days are numbered

 

Absolutely, the club/Pozzo has got all the potentially vocal support Absolutely tied up. 1881 will loose "the bunker" (believe it's on land owned by the club, podcasts (specifically WD18 and FTRE) seem very pally pally . . Really the only ones I can see who will speak out are the DNSYE chaps (although sure the Pozzo party spin officer in Wendover will have something positive to say) and potentially the Buzz guys