Cleverley & Cathcart - Enough Is Enough

We should flog Cathcart to PSG, he’d immeasurably improve their defence.

 

Totally normal behaviour, this

 

Yeah, a couple of crying GIF's and a bit of tongue in cheek sarcasm based on some of the hypocritical posts in this thread is pretty deep stuff.

Sorry if that's not quite the bite you were hoping for. Maybe you could trudge back through some of my old posts and try again? That definitely is normal behaviour.

 

There is a clear difference between the acknowledgement of certain players not being good enough for the standard of the division and constantly berating them each time they play on here. Your post is clearly disingenuous.

The fault is with the owners and not the players. We should have strengthened at the back years ago but we didn't.

The named players do put in 100% each week, have been good to us over a number of years and can't do much beyond that. I think it's unreasonable to consistently slag them off.

 

Neither is calling players 'rats' or 'cowards' each time we lose. It's embarrassing.

See my above post - you can have a pop at the owners, that's fine. It's their fault we are going back down for a number of failings on their end.

I don't agree with the persistent abuse of certain players despite their best efforts. The worst critism I have of them are that they model professionals who fall short on ability. I can't blame them for that.

 

What are your thoughts on Cathcart’s comment on Fosters video when he said “the crying is tomorrow isn’t it?” Before our next important game?

Is that a model professional in your eyes?

 

Please, save the anger for tonight

 

It’s the same viewpoint. Some people are angry at the owners. Some people get angry with the players. Some do both.

The point is you decide to call some fans spoiled brats when they have exactly the same viewpoint as you, just showing their frustrations in a different way. It makes zero sense unless you think you are a spoiled brat yourself.

 

Surely the way we express our frustrations is quite important though? We can both think Wilf Zaha is a knobber, but if I threw a 50p at his head when he's taking a corner, I'd be a d1ck, even though we have the same viewpoint.

 

Agree but not comparable. The concept of “spoiled” as it’s been used over the last 5 years is that we should be thankful for Pozzo because we have less resources therefore the non spoiled person will accept the fact we should be mid table championship and smile like an unthinking baboon So in that respect whether you get angry with Pozzo or angry with the duffer in midfield you are still spoiled?

If Pukey had said “it’s no wonder some people think our fans are d1cks” then it would make sense.

Not that I am insinuating Comrade Nath is a d1ck of course, but if pukey had that viewpoint it would at least be consistent.

 

It was literally a joke between to two mates. I really don't find that upsetting at all.

Perhaps Foster (or his editor) should have edited that part out given how some of our fans would have taken it.

As far as I am aware, Cathcart is a model professional and there is no evidence to suggest otherwise.

 

It’s only a joke because that’s the only way it supports your view.

These are professional athletes paid the national average yearly salary for a weeks ‘work’ and they go into games expecting to lose and laughing about it.

It’s symptomatic of the rotten attitude throughout the club.

 

Just ignore the spoilt brats comment then. I'll edit it and delete that last bit out. Just read the rest of my original post.

The point is call the owners whatever you like. I draw the line at the anger being directed at Cathcart and Cleverly. I think it's got personal and out of order. They give 100% on the pitch, it's just the simple fact that it won't keep us up.

 

I really think you are reading way to much into it but if that's your viewpoint then fair enough.

I can't say I agree though. To me, it was just a joke. We all make them, some appropriate some in appropriate at the time.

I don't think it can be used as evidence of as a notch against his unprofessional.

 

I’ve worked at plenty of companies where it would be unacceptable to joke about expected poor performance, I’ve also worked at some where it would be ok.

Guess which ones are the more successful.

Equally it isn’t an isolated incident either.

 

Okay. Well to me, it was just a joke made by one human to another. It's really not that deep. I'm sure there are far more inappropriate jokes we don't hear about it. I'm sure there will be others who agree.

You found that joke upsetting, which you are rightly entitled to do. I'm sure others will agree with you.

 

I didn’t find it upsetting, it’s just unprofessional and reflective of a losers mentality that’s rife throughout our club.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you. My point is that it's utterly pointless and wrong to consistently go after the players who despite their best efforts, are not good enough for this division anymore. To the best of our knowledge they are model professional who do try to keep us up, it's just sometimes their best ain't goof enough but that's okay.

All the anger, name calling, personal attacks should be directed upstairs to Gino and Scott who have fundamentally failed in all aspects of recruitment since 2019.

 

Name me a better, proven defender in our current squad than Cathcart. Don't give me Kabasele or Sierralta who we've barely seen in the Prem. There will be reasons for that under successive managers.

Cathcart is reliable, last 90 mins, is good in the air, tackles well and is useful in that he can also fill in competently at full back.

Where he does lose out is obviously pace, reactions and I wouldn't say his distribution is anything other than utilitarian. He's not great and this ought to be his last season at the top level I think, but just the same he's not nearly as awful as some make out.

Who are you going to play instead? Barnacle Billy Ekong and his erratic decision making and opposition-seeking passing? N'Koulu and Etebo haven't been available and must be severely lacking match fitness. So who?

I know if I were picking the team for tonight and Sunday, then Cathcart would be one of the first names on the teamsheet.

 

Yeah I don’t disagree. Owners are responsible primarily.

I do think players need to be accountable for their own performance levels though to a certain extent. Gray wasn’t up to the level required but I doubt he would get much sympathy despite always trying his best.

The two players in question have been at times this season below their own low ceilings. Cleverly’s lack of alertness changes the game last week and he should take criticism for that despite his limitations. They shouldn’t get a free pass.

 

Cathcart turns his back every time he faces a shot. Never puts his body on the line. He is poor.

I’d play Sierralta and Kaba all day long. But as you say ideally a replacement which isn’t Cathcart’s fault.

 

Cowardly. It’s a mindset. Risk aversion. I’m the same at 5 a side. People can throw their hands up at the word being used hitting their sensitivities but they don’t claim that it’s wrong.

 

Yes. Agree with everything you have said here.

Especially last Sunday when Cleverly lost the ball to Saka - that was inexplicably bad.

 

So what was the reason Sierralta outperformed Cathcart in a lower division against lower quality opposition last season? He often kept him out the team. There was a reason for that too.

Leaning on "successive managers" who haven't played him so he must be rubbish is a weak excuse when said managers have both underperformed in their roles, in fact, one got sacked.

 

**** off grandad.

 

62% aerial win percentage isn’t good for a centre back, neither is winning 45% or your tackles

 

Of all the things to get worked up about when it comes to the current state of Watford Football Club, I find it incredible some have got so upset by their interpretation of an off the cuff remark from one friend to another in a hotel corridor. Mind boggling

 

On this one I suspect Cathcart suffered because Foster has been an unprofessional idiot all season, so he got tarred with the same brush for one innocent comment.

 

What's more frustrating, a player who has obvious natural quality but looks lazy on the pitch (Pereyra in his later days) or a player who has limited quality but gives it all (Cathcart)? I would be irate with the former and feel sympathy for the latter

The blame solely lies with our owners....

 

Sucked into the immense power of the Cycling GK tractor beam of d1ckheadedness

 

"I thought maybe he was looking a little bit tired, so I pulled him out of the warm up, with the upcoming games in mind."