Any runners on here; advice needed.

This 100%. Was talking to a mate coming away from a 20mi race last month. As we were leaving there were still people going past the start/finish to start a final 8mi lap. Gotta be mentally so tough to keep going for that long!

 

Absolute kiss of death this post was. I had a fitness class about ten days ago and obliterated my back. Nerve damage so whilst it feels just about ok now, and I can gently jog, it feels like one wrong move or lift will make it ping again.

 

Decided to have a crack at another sub 3 yesterday in Manchester but was obvious from early on I was still feeling the marathon from 2 weeks back. The last 12 miles was a tough old slog & finished in 3.06 so still good enough for Boston & Chicago next year. About 5 minutes too slow for London unfortunately

 

Awesome effort. Plenty of people I know who ran London or Manchester ended up a few minutes down due to the heat tax, so you did well to get that time. Hope the recovery goes well. I've got Birmingham half at the weekend, which feels like it's a week too soon

London GFA times for men have gone a bit crazy! I'll be 40 next year, so going up an age cat, but for now I'd have to get 2:52. That ain't happening!

 

About 20 years ago I 'ran' the London Marathon 3 years in a row to raise funds for RBL. I quite enjoyed it the first time, the second time I felt lousy but still enjoyed the occasion, the third time I felt like someone had banged nails into my knee caps and after about an hour the whole bloody thing really started getting on my t1ts - but I managed to get round by repeating the mantra 'What The F*ck Am I Doing This For?' So, my advice is do it once only

 

My daughter did the London Marathon yesterday, first ever time running more than a half marathon and she did it in a little over 5 hours. First time visiting the London Marathon and it was awesome and crazy at the same time. Meticulous planning went out of the window after our first spotting at mile 3. The DLR, Jubilee and district lines were well over capacity. We still managed to see her 3 times during the 5 hours which we thought was pretty good considering.

Loved it despite the mad crowds.

 

I hit the over 50 category next year so get an extra 5 minutes but some of the qualifying times are crazily quick.

 

Was Manchester good? I've signed up for next year.

 

Crowds were not bad with a few quiet parts. Very well organised at start & finish. Not as flat as it used to be with about 335ft elevation. Bottled water every 5k & plenty with a few gel stations. Nice t- shirt & medal this year also.
Only thing was it was lacking any real sights on course. A bit of the canal or round footy/cricket stadium would have made it a little more interesting

 

Thanks, that's good to know. Newport had 300m around a running track about 3mi in. Not sure if that was interesting or off putting!

 

congrats to your daughter. Mine ran it too. Managed to drop her at the start line, walk and see her at cutty sark, footbridge through to city and saw her at miles 15 and 18, jubilee to Westminster for mile 25 and then at the finish. Was a great day but seeing her that many times meant I had no food, no time to stop for a drink and no toilet stop. All worth it though

I’m in awe of anybody that trains that hard and then completes the run. Let alone the stories that drives each runner to participate

 

Great respect for anyone running a marathon. I simply can’t understand how anyone can physically do that. Crazy heroes the lot of you.

 

More enjoyable than the football I think is my reason

 

Whenever on the few occasions in my past I have got up and thought, I’ll go for a run this morning, I’ve enjoyed the first minute and a half and then wondered “What was I thinking” ! It’s too much like hard work for me !

 

Where is good nowadays for gait analysis? I used to go to Sweat Shop in Milton Keynes which was good but they have since closed. I've used Runners Need in Milton Keynes as well but they seemed less thorough. Anywhere in Beds/Herts/London would be useful.

 

What do you want it for? Shoe buying advice or getting to the bottom of an injury? Can't help you with a specific place as I'm 50 miles up the road, but one tip is to search for a uni lab that do this sort of thing. Often a bit cheaper and they've no interesting in selling you anything.

 

I always used to get gait analysis and then make a purchase, but my last few purchases have been bought on the basis of buying similar support levels. Buying without gait analysis has also coincided with general aches and niggles in knee/ankle hence thinking it was worth getting my gait analysed again.

 

I know a lot of the experienced club runners I run with are pretty dubious about it. Though obviously it's not helped as a concept when places like Runners Need get a teenage weekend sales assistant overseeing it and then hey presto, you needs Brooks stability shoes for everything!

Have you explored buying a neutral shoe (or even the same as your previous recommendation from gait analysis) and then putting orthotics in? Might be worth a go as an alternative. Could just be you need a little more cushioning or support for your arches.

 

I hadn't but I will - cheers.

 

I’d say, a year and a half on, that I’m fit again now.

Still not as fit as I was pre injury in terms of speed over long distances, but have prioritised endurance and now run 2 hours each Sunday fairly comfortably and up to 2.5 if I grit my teeth a bit.

I’ve only started adding speed intervals as I’ve been much more cautious since my injury, but they definitely help build fitness much more quickly. I probably should have reintegrated them earlier. Definitely also helps that I’ve lost 5kg or so.

No races booked in yet, but I’ll probably try to do a marathon later in the year. If so, I’ll likely target a 3.30 marathon to get used to the pacing/ nutrition etc and curtail my competitive side, but I reckon I could beat that today, given I’m just outside that pace on hilly mixed terrain, listening to audiobooks, wearing cushioned shoes etc.

Has anyone done any European autumn/ winter marathons? I’m considering San Sebastián or Helsinki.

 

Can you tell me a bit more about speed intervals please? And by a bit more, I really mean 'talk to me like a toddler' as I need to mix up my training. I've heard of speed intervals but without ever really having an example to follow. I'm an experienced runner but a bit of a one trick pony - I lace up and go - and the only thing I vary is my pace depending on distance.

 

Personally speaking I have a couple of options. Firstly a track session were ill do 4 laps warm up slow then either 1 lap quick then 1 lap slow for about 12 reps. The fast speed is my aim for 3k to 5k pace then slow is just steady getting heart rate down. Secondly I have a session on road which is 1 mile warm up then 12 x 2 mins reps with 60 second recovery in-between each rep. That's set on my watch so easy to follow.
It's not easy or pleasant but certainly helps with increasing your pace

 

Running at a constant pace works primarily on one type of fitness, aerobic capacity. Which is great, but a lot slower to build and definitely doesn’t help you smash PBs after a certain point, as you’re limited by remaining distance in getting your legs used to running at a faster pace.

Bursts of energy, where your heart rate goes much higher and your muscles get more stressed, works on more. Anaerobic capacity, where your muscles learn to keep functioning when they don’t have as much oxygen, allowing you to run faster for longer. Twitch muscles, which increase your power and speed. VO2 max, which means you process oxygen more efficiently.

You put a lot more load through your legs when you accelerate and move quickly, so you can get the same outcomes in a quarter of the time as a normal run. However it also puts more strain on your system, so you need to recover properly between bursts of energy (and before and after interval sessions) to ensure you don’t get injured.

There are lots of different types of interval training. Hill sprints, where you jog downhill to recover. Normal intervals, where you’d do a distance or a time at about 80-90% of your max heart rate (220-age) and then stand, walk or slow jog recover. Or pyramids, where you’d do something like 100,200,400,800, 800,400 etc.

I’d start off with one session a week, with no running on the days before or after. The Norwegian 4x4 method (4min 85%, 3 min recovery) is quite vogue at the moment, but also free to have fun with it (sprint to the tree, jog to the corner etc).

Ideally you’d recover for less time than your sprints during your interval period, but make sure you warm up and down (at least 10 mins each), get your heart rate up to about 85% and down between each interval by at least 30-40bpm before going again.

 

As an example, last night we did 4 sets of:

400m, 80s standing recovery, 400m, 80s standing recovery, 800m
3 mins rest between sets.

We did that at the track but you could easily find a flat-ish bit of road near you. Or of course add in some hillier bits as they're normally more about high effort over exact pace. In our club sessions we tend to aim for 4-5mi of 'on' efforts in a session. But that's probably too much to start out with.

@miked2006 has covered the physiological benefits and is absolutely right to highlight load management as the biggest thing to think about, especially if you're new to it and have a bit of injury history.

Another option is fartlek (speed play), where you go out for a run and throw in random surges. I might do a 7mi steady run and my watch has a function that tees up faster stints anywhere from 20-90s. Trains your body in accelerating on demand.

My favourite is a double mona fartlek. Slightly chaotic:

• Warm-up: 10-15 minutes of easy running.
• Main set (do twice, with ~5 mins standing recovery between sets)
  • 2 x 90 seconds of hard running, followed by 90 seconds of recovery.
  • 4 x 60 seconds of hard running, followed by 60 seconds of recovery.
  • 4 x 30 seconds of hard running, followed by 30 seconds of recovery.
  • 4 x 15 seconds of hard running, followed by 15 seconds of recovery.
• Cool-down: 10-15 minutes of easy running.

We typically run the recoveries in our sessions, but you can also jog or stand if needed.

 

Really useful - thank you.

 

This is good interesting stuff to read. It might sound crazy, but I've been using ChatGPT to prepare, modify and adjust a training plan for me as I build up to a 10K race in July. I have actually found it's quite useful (with a bit of human input), and it can analyse a lot of data and provide some interesting insights. I wouldn't fully rely on it, but it certainly has given me a good base and has been useful recently when I was set back a week through illness in making sure I built back up correctly.

I have got to a point where I think I need to start doing some strength training as well to help with further improvements, so that's on my list to sort out. I'll also need to join a running club too I think, as there's only so much solo training you can do in a year!

 

Strength training is very important. It turns running from something which can be damaging for joints, bones etc, especially if form isn’t perfect, to something that’s hugely positive for them.

 

Further - Nuremberg half marathon on Sunday, currently seeing how much water I can get down me today and tomorrow...

 

Try buying something like this to mix in:

https://amzn.eu/d/2nnnb3R

And to be honest today's possibly a day too soon.

What's the temperature looking like there?

 

Yes I've got some of those. In truth I'm dreadful at staying hydrated and drinking water at the best of times. Temperature is looking like early 30's for Sunday morning, it's an 0930 start so should be in a cold bath by lunchtime.

 

Good luck & don't over hydrate as daft as it sounds. Let us know what's its like as due to family relocation i might have the option of doing a few events over there

 

Good luck!

 

Is there a temperature cut off? My one and only marathon was Vienna in 2018 and it was 27 degrees. It said in the pack that 30 was the cut off - over that and it would be cancelled.

I drank so much water that I was absolutely dying for a pi$$ by the time I got to the start and me and the wife had top stop and go in a car park in the first mile.

Good luck!

 

Cheers. I did this event last year - the two towns alternate the start & finish so last year it started in Furth, this year it starts Nuremberg. The event last year was excellent and very well organised, so much so I immediately signed up to do it again this year. I should be in a German pub by mid afternoon on Sunday with some hearty food and a few pints.