Academy And Under-23s

Discussion in 'The Team Bus' started by wfc78, Aug 14, 2012.

Tags:
  1. GoingDown

    GoingDown "The Stability"

    It must be awful to be as wrong as you on a daily basis when it's just so so so important to look like you're right.

    Which is why you love a personal insult and love a row with Burnsy and LouOrns. They are ITK, something you'll never be. It must really hurt.
     
  2. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    As academy players?
     
  3. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    I've never claimed to be "ITK" about Galvez or anyone else. Plenty of things can also be obvious, speculated upon, or evaluated without any need for proclaimed insider knowledge.

    Any "rows" I have don't have anything to do with the other person's supposed "ITK" status either - for instance, the amount of contradictions in your posts suggest you wouldn't even know your ar5e from your elbow, yet I'll still highlight the occasions when you're clearly chatting nonsense.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
    WatfordTalk likes this.
  4. Markoa$

    Markoa$ Squad Player

    Who cares. Shove him on the bench.
     
  5. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    These independent academies are being created abroad much to the consternation of clubs in those countries who would normally pick up those youngsters. So Abu Dhabi have 18 of these now. So their greed extends to denying clubs in those countries from also earning any fees which are still often paltry.

    Something has to be done. 86 clubs need to sit down and demand action. As for Southgate I hope England crash out as he was one of those in favour of this garbage agreement supposedly to create a better England team when we all knew it was to satisfy the greed of the so called big six. That England youth players have improved has little to do with this but better coaching from a younger age, an emphasis on technique and the accumulation of expertise from overseas coaches.

    We could have had Sancho, Galvez and Forde as first teamers. All eventually leaving as we cannot expect for a club of our size to hold onto them but at least for a hefty sum of money which benefits the club. Now we get nothing. We get criticized by some in the media for not bringing through youth players and of course when these players do make it we never get a mention. Have you ever heard Sancho being connected to Watford for instance ? It makes my blood boil. We had this debacle and climbdown over the ESL but for the 86 less entitled sides it is time to demand an end to this and exert pressure on the FA, FL, PL and others to reverse these changes. If the big shi ts don't like they can lump it.

    The vultures have had a look at Lo Everton, Abbott and Lawal as well so we are still lucky we still have them as all three with Langston could become first teamers.

    What a pleasure it would be to see then as before our academy products in the first eleven. Not only that but it means we save money in not having to go out and buy a player.
     
    Captain Mandibles and RMT79 like this.
  6. PowerJugs

    PowerJugs Doyley Fanatic

    Luke "478 tennis ball keepy uppy expert" O'Nien deserves to be in that list, maybe more so than Byers.



    He's actually had a very respectable career at Wycombe and Sunderland where he's been a fan's favourite for both sides and could step up to Championship level.
     
    wfc4ever likes this.
  7. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    O'Nien hasn't made a Championship appearance since leaving us, Byers has made over 50. O'Nien has carved out a decent career, but was never good enough for us, and still isn't
     
  8. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    Players signed under a B Team system are signed on actual pro contracts, so they can't be poached.

    Essentially, you don't spent time and money on a player unless they're under contract, so they can't be poached against your consent.

    Brentford have been using it to great effect. They have no academy. It's worth reading up on their system if you haven't already - they've had good results with it and it would work much better for us than the current system.
     
  9. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    Players can not sign pro contracts in the UK until they are 17, whether it's for a B team or to still be playing in the youth teams, so it would literally make no difference in helping us to keep players like Galvez and Sancho.
     
  10. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    Out of interest, did you hear a whooshing noise when the point sailed way over your head?
     
    GoingDown likes this.
  11. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    No I didn't, because a19tgg specifically asked whether having a B Team would stop our top youth players like Galvez getting poached.

    I was pointing out that you weren't really answering the question as we couldn't have even got Galvez to begin with.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2021
  12. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    Even when our youth system churned out first teamers left, right and centre when we were skint, we've had few who were genuinely good enough for Championship level, and even those few players who were ended up fizzling out for various reasons. The last youth product we've had who's had any kind of longevity at Prem/Champ level is Mariappa
     
  13. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    It's a romantic idea to try and bring through the youth, but on the off chance we have players that are talented enough, that we can keep, it's hard to give them minutes when we're in the Prem/fighting at the top of the Championship. Even when we sign talented players like Wilmot and Quina, the hard bit is to give them a proper platform to develop
     
  14. DrewH

    DrewH Administrator Staff Member

  15. Markoa$

    Markoa$ Squad Player

    Literally no point in having an academy. Such a waste of money.
     
    Steve Leo Beleck, RS2 and wfc4ever like this.
  16. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    George Abbott is highly rated isn't he? His departure should be any day now.
     
  17. GoingDown

    GoingDown "The Stability"

  18. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Bloody disgrace. There are several others who have been called up to talent identification camps also known as poaching playtime for a few clubs. Begs the question of why we bother. The rules need to change. Imagine all of these players turning out for us and one earning large transfer sums and two saving money by not having to buy someone. Not to mention how warm any fans feel when a club product makes it. Hope he ends up playing for Frickley Town.
     
    Name likes this.
  19. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    It's not the player's fault at all. If that report is correct he is moving because Leeds have offered him a path to the first team. Tells you everything you need to know about our set up, kids don't want to be at a club where you aren't given opportunities and spend your first years as a professional playing in the U23s.
     
    luke_golden, Markoa$ and GoingDown like this.
  20. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Maybe in this case that is true as he has gone to a club who have fielded a few young players but will that carry on if Leeds stay in the Premier league ?
     
  21. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    Yes well done, it seems the point is finally starting to sink in.
     
  22. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    It makes little sense from that perspective though as Leeds have a much better side than us so it could be tougher to break in to. They also only have one academy graduate in their first team in Kalvin Phillips.

    That's still one more than us, but that's never going to change while all our best prospects keep getting nicked just before they're ready.
     
  23. GoingDown

    GoingDown "The Stability"

    Keep trying Often-Wrong. I notice you're getting ripped to shreds in other threads so my effort isn't really needed. Still rooting for you though.
     
    RS2 likes this.
  24. Markoa$

    Markoa$ Squad Player

  25. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    16 year olds all across the country have heard about Richard Johnson's appointment and know Watford is the place to be.

    Let the influx begin.
     
  26. GoingDown

    GoingDown "The Stability"

    Another one gone to the big boys.

    Wait, what?
     
  27. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    Give it a year and he'll realise his mistake.
     
  28. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    He was released by Arsenal, just like Bayli Spencer-Adams.

    Nothing to get excited about.
     
  29. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Lose our best ones, replace them with rejects from elsewhere. Perfect!
     
    Markoa$ likes this.
  30. RS2

    RS2 Squad Player

    The Watford way.
     
  31. hornetmaster

    hornetmaster Reservist

    With the expected £2.19 million proceeds from the Sancho Manchester United deal. it presents an opportunity to re-grade the academy to invest in player development in the future. It is amazing that two or three members of the current England squad were developed by Watford, at a time when we were in the lower divisions.
     
  32. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    I doubt that’s enough to either achieve or maintain Cat 1 status.

    Swansea dropped from Cat 1 to Cat 2 during the season just gone and reckon it’ll save them £4m per annum!

    https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport...ull-extent-swansea-citys-substantial-19913950
     
  33. a19tgg

    a19tgg First Team

    From what I understand, it doesn’t give you any protection from players being poached it just means you get more compensation when they do. That said it’s not hugely significant so you’d still be chucking good money after bad with the same result. Having a better academy may just help us bring through the odd extra prospect once in a blue moon, but they’ll be stolen if they’re any good so it’s pretty futile either way, it would just cost a lot more to get there.

    B teams seem the way to go in terms of giving players competitive games to play, which would help their development a lot more but not bring with it some huge arbitrary cost just to hit certain criteria.
     
  34. lowerrous

    lowerrous First Team

    Sancho, and?

    Kane doesn't count as he was only here on trial for a few weeks.
     
  35. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    The costs of qualifying for Cat 1 status are significant, and the main reason for doing so would be to get a higher price for players stolen from you.

    That increased price won't cover the delta you spend qualifying as a Cat 1 academy, though, which makes it largely pointless.
     

Share This Page