10 Games Gone... Review Time

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by SkylaRose, Sep 17, 2022.

  1. EnjoytheGame

    EnjoytheGame Reservist

    Perfectly possible to believe that being in the top 10 in the Premier League and the late stages of the FA Cup represents a high water mark (because it does), while also recognising that there's currently a yawning void where the club's heart should be. Personally speaking, I am glad I enjoyed every moment of that season to the full – even the bit where the wheels fell off a bit in the final six weeks – because it's clear it'll be a while before we're in that position again.

    I remember walking to the Arsenal game shortly after the semi-final with the feeling that it was the most important league match of the season, and a winnable one at that. The atmosphere and anticipation crackled, the sense of injustice when Deeney was sent off burned and even though we lost, the feeling that we'd given it a really good go as I walked out after the final whistle seems like an alien experience now.

    I was out of the country when we played Southampton and Wolves at home and watched both games on glitchy feeds. Just the sense of importance surrounding those games, even if the results weren't great, is what football is all about. We were within touching distance of something historic and although it proved out of reach it was still a magical time.
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2022
  2. AndrewH63

    AndrewH63 Reservist

    Only five teams have won few games than ourselves after ten games. We need to win 24 out if the next 36 - i doubt we will 12.
  3. Since63

    Since63 Squad Player

    I am sure some have expressed the view that accepting that we should not be expecting to be regularly challenging for Europa League is in some way tantamount to 'snowflake defeatism', but so be it.

    I think ETG was implying that the 2018-9 is the pinnacle of what we could reasonably expect and I was suggesting that to expect that to be a regularly-achievable performance is unrealistic. Even the great GT only managed to guide us to the top 10 twice, and that in an era when a good youth scheme was feasible for such as Watford, and before the arrival of the EPL and the appearance of petrodollar state ownership totally skewed the landscape.

    The 'squandered opportunity' is actually the brain-dead effort to try to make us the 'best of the rest' which led GP to jettison the strategy of 'sell at the height of value & reinvest properly' which probably would have seen us in the sort of position Brighton now are and on a sustainable basis, from which we could have hoped for some gradual, organic development.

    But I doubt that an occasional 8th place in the league & a cup final every decade would have been more than achievable.
  4. a19tgg

    a19tgg Squad Player

    After 10 games, I’m just pleased the results only merchants from the first few games can now understand what those of us who asses what they see with their eyes over 95+ minutes were talking about.
  5. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    The results from the first three games flattered us greatly. Now we’re seeing our true level. 7 points from 7 games is about where we’re at. Nowhere near good enough basically. More like a relegation avoidance side than a promotion candidate.

    Pozzo won’t tolerate that. I doubt things will improve before the World Cup break and Edwards will be gone during that time. Rinse and repeat.
  6. Cude>2<

    Cude>2< First Team Captain

    100% with you - I'd rather we keep our crap defence and go attacking with the attitude of we'll concede, but we'll score more than you - but can't see it happening sadly.
  7. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    "The excellent Kiko"

    I see the revisionism has started already.

    You and the rest of our fanbase couldn't wait to see the back of him.
    Knight GT likes this.
  8. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Squad Player

    It's all relative tbf. Remember that Cathcart is still widely considered to be our most reliable center back. Doesn't mean he's not ****.
  9. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    Are you suggesting that our next manager should be a bottle of Shampoo? :) Actually, players might take more notice of that.
  10. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Probably would encourage Choudhury to sign permanently.
    HornM25 and SkylaRose like this.
  11. Johnny Todd Sings

    Johnny Todd Sings First Year Pro

    There are going to be a lot of changes in the Championship by Christmas. This season strikes me as being one of the most unpredictable for years. From what I've seen there are no teams that would be able to hold there own in the EPL should they get promoted.
    That isn't an excuse for our performances but I expect us to be around the play-off places more due to the poor quality of the other teams than us getting better.
    For us the problem will be too many draws. I suspect that we could mirror the season in League One (or whatever it was called then) when Kenny Jackett was in charge.
    SkylaRose likes this.
  12. Manatleisure

    Manatleisure Squad Player

    Probably expected to be a few more points better off and a better defencing display in this division. One point off a play-off spot so all to play for.
    dynamo380 likes this.
  13. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    We've got Stoke, Swansea and Blackpool in our next three. I expect about 3-4 points from those going on current performances. It could be cold and wet Sunday afternoon in Stoke... you know the saying.
  14. So Sheffield United need to win 21, Burnley need to win 23, Norwich need to win 22?
  15. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    Burnley and Norwich were (in all fairness) more equipped for this season than we are. Sure, they don't have Davis, Sarr and Pedro but one thing they do have is team morale and togetherness. Look at the run Norwich are on now - not playing that well but they are winning games, same goes for Burnley. Sheff Utd have had a wonderful start to their campaign, despite us beating them day one they look very good. We are nowhere near ready for promotion based on these ten games. Let's see how we do at Stoke after the break - with a few weeks rest and (hopefully) a more with it squad with a few returning players. There are six sides better than us right now in this division, and if we continue to play as poorly as we have, (only real good performance was Birmingham) we will slide into midtable or lower well before January.
  16. Klein Lust

    Klein Lust Uber Keine

    You've given us all an honest yet bleak assessment of our season so far. I honestly think we missed Cleverley when he got injured.

    I know most of you know much more about our play than I do, and most thought/think Cleverley was/is dogturd, but I thought he was the best player to play as someone able to feed our attack.
  17. Supertommymooney

    Supertommymooney Reservist

    Worked wonders for Quina :eek:
    Hogg-DEENEY!!! likes this.
  18. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    Dare I say this is better for his development than if he were reduced to cameos here and there? It's also not like he's playing every minute of every game, even if the end of the game at the weekend did suggest he's probably playing a bit too much right now
    Supertommymooney likes this.
  19. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Absolutely bang on the money. Most people on here do know more about our play than you and Cleverley is dogturd.
  20. Supertommymooney

    Supertommymooney Reservist

    You dare.

    And you're right.

    A bit more than Quina had but a bit less than right now sounds like a good thing.

    It's the reliance on him that's the concern.
    Hogg-DEENEY!!! likes this.
  21. Hornpete

    Hornpete Squad Player

    I hoped we would get over the bad form and pick up more 1-0 wins with a bit of class from Sarr or Pedro to turn the game. All whilst still finding our feet in a new league with a new manager with a new squad. It's been prevented from improving by an all number of things, Edwards tactics, some injuries, some transfer policy and some pisspoor performances from a number of our team.

    I don't think we're going to win a dozen game on the bounce and get on track for winning the league but it's also too early to write us off just yet. And it is more exciting than the premier League, certainly compared to playing 9 defenders v man city and getting tonked anyway.(if you take an end to end 2-2 at home to Sunderland for example for what it is, rather than what we wanted it to be.)
  22. I Blame Bassett

    I Blame Bassett First Team

    "Wretched ".
  23. Robert Peel

    Robert Peel Reservist

    This supposed to be the great reset. A new, honest approach. Back to basics. More fun. A team that was fully committed.

    I thought I might shift the malaise of the last few years and start enjoying it again. Maybe see a team that went for it and was at the very least committed.

    But I still feel disillusioned and that we are doing nothing more than getting by, with an absolute mess of a squad. On the one had we have Hause, Choudhary and Davis, which are great, but on the other we have absolute dross that arrived in weird, random, murky deals, like Bayo, Manaj, Gaspar and Okoye.

    I like Edwards but I'm not sure what he's trying to do. That said, I'd rather he stayed to break the cycle of endless coaches. If he's prepared to go to Gino and get Giaretta the boot, in unison with the players, that puts him up in my estimation. If he can unshackle us from Bayat, he can have the freedom of Watford.
  24. Klein Lust

    Klein Lust Uber Keine

    That's why I hardly post an opinion, it's nice reading about what's occurring though, even if sometimes it can be like bullying banter. There are some people I like more than others, I won't name names;
  25. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Sorry mate. Was just an obvious joke. Not intended to bully. I respect and appreciate you.
  26. Klein Lust

    Klein Lust Uber Keine

    Sorry Moog, I didn't mean you were being a bully, in fact, you are one of the people I respect the most. You were simply saying the truth regarding my lack of team knowledge etc. I love you Moogy :)
  27. Dorset-Orn

    Dorset-Orn First Year Pro

    We've all touched on this before but there's just something toxic about our club (for about 4 years and building) which affects players and then newcomers can never seem to break the mould.?
    No real clue why but we really are a sh'fest and I have no clue how well ever get out of it. If RE is given 2 years then maybe he gradually clear out the poison and build something..... Hmm
  28. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    Problem is, the toxicity is just one worry, abeit it is a big one. Here are my personal points this club need to rectify within the next few seasons to prevent us going under.

    ** Old/aging players moved on (Cathcart/Kabesele/Sema/Gosling/Cleverly/WTE/Ngakia)

    ** Get rid of the corrupt used car dealer Mogi Bayat

    ** Get Duxbury out the club and hire a CEO who knows the game of football and understands the needs and goals of the club

    ** Clear as much off the debt as possible (could be very hard to do - especially if we don't get new owners in this time period)

    ** Engage with the fans' a hell of a lot more than they do now. This includes being OPEN and HONEST with things like Debt and overall player morale (maybe bring back the fans' forum?)

    ** Keep Edwards in charge (he seems to want to be here) and support him as much as possible. Even if that means getting youth from the U23's who could play his system.

    ** Sort out the squad mentality and fitness. It's inexcusable the amount of injuries we have with just ten games gone. Hire a sports psychologist.

    Wow... we need a miracle.
  29. Since63

    Since63 Squad Player

    'a few seasons' may be too long!
  30. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Yet a lot of fans seem to want him out now ,

    Cannot have it both ways .

    We either keep chopping and changing after every bad run or give someone a chance to sort things out if they can .
    Dorset-Orn likes this.
  31. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    Keeping him is the logical thing to do. He may not be getting the performances he wants, but he is a much better coach than Hodgson and CR70 were. There is still 36 games to go, time to improve the way the play and the higher ups need to listen to what he needs in the next window. If we are nearer the relegation places than the playoffs come January (either is possible with this squad), then I fully expect him to be gone, but I hope the players' especially give him a chance and at least try for once.
    Robert Peel and wfc4ever like this.
  32. Chumlax

    Chumlax Squad Player

    I'm not necessarily countering by saying that we should get rid of him, but what on earth is this statement based on, exactly?
    WillisWasTheWorst and wfc4ever like this.
  33. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    It's based on my own personal view of how both managers seemed when they were in charge of us. Sure, CR70 and Hodgson have massive amounts of experience in the game over Edwards and have won the PL and managed the national team between them. However, we never looked like a side who wanted to try to survive under them. I know us and Norwich were the whipping boys last season - but the overal mentality of the squad was as low as I have seen it in a long time. I am not suggesting Edwards is the next GT or anything close to that, but he has done something that neither of our previous two managers could do. Bring back a sense of unity in the club, put a few more smiles on faces and it's a little easier to enjoy the football again. It could still turn sour, we haven't played well in any game bar one for 90mins. He's still learning this division but he shows passion on the sidelines, nothing last season from either manager came close to that.

    Again, just my own view.
  34. leighton buzzard horn

    leighton buzzard horn Squad Player

    Need to replace before you move them on, there is no depth behind the squad. Cathcart has been arguably our best defender this season and Sema one of the most productive attacking players.
    domthehornet likes this.
  35. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Thought he might survive this window but it was obvious he was a dead man walking.

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