Don't get me wrong I would keep Lukebakio and try him out but it seems he's made it very clear he wants to leave. Also looking at the physicality of the 2, Sarr looks much more suited to premier league football.
Lukebakio is a bit more physical than Pereyra at least, so it shouldn't entirely rule him out. Not that that's an especially high bar.
I haven't disagreed with that though. The post I was replying to stated that we could sell the two players stated (Success and Penaranda) to help raise funds - my point is those two won't raise much towards any funds. I didn't mention what the other players may raise or how much we already have in the bank.
Do the Maths. You'll easily get £10 million minimum combined for Success and Peneranda; £2 million for Okaka and lets say £18 for Dodi. That's £30 million. Would get the Hassan guy personally at £10 million but it is possible.
I don’t need to do any maths. We sent Penaranda and Success on loans to Udinese and Malaga and they couldn’t get in the team. Since coming back they have barely got in the team. You’re in dreamland if you think anyone is giving us decent money for them. That’s not to say they won’t be worth money in the future. But right now, given their fitness/attitude issues, no one will give us much for them. I’m not arguing we can raise money for players from other sales. But the market has to be there.
Dodi should be valued at least as highly as Sarr, if not more. £18mil for him would be nothing for him in today's market.
I doubt we have much of a budget at all, we're a selling club. We needed the Richarlison sale last summer to pretty much break even. Ok, the cup run and improved league position might take a bit of pressure off the need to sell but still don't think we'll be spending much and certainly not 20 million plus whatever we get from player sales. Dawson is a sign of intent, a low risk bargain for the area we most need to improve whilst other clubs will break the bank on young Championship prospects or expensive gamble that someone who has never played in the Premier League will adapt. We might gamble on a couple of overseas signings but they'll be cheap ones.
I’m not convinced that we couldn’t afford £35m, because the more I’ve read over the years shows football finances aren’t quite as simple as that (and I still don’t fully understand them!) Obviously there’s a limit, but that figure doesn’t seem out of reach. The bigger question is would Pozzo risk that amount on one player. Our signings tend to work on the percentage game, is that player more likely to bring in a profit or not. You’ve got to be pretty sure this guy is of the quality in a few years to be at a top Champions League team for it to pay off. That percentage game isn’t the same with the likes of Dawson, who has been bought to make the team good enough to achieve Premier League status. Players like Deulofeu are the ones who push you into cup finals and a push at Europa League qualification, but still have that profit making resale value. So, long story short, I’d bet against this happening due to the high level of risk of success.
We only lose so much money in the accounts because we spent so heavily in years 1 and 2 though and the transfers are released into the accounts each year via depreciation. At some point we will catch up as it were and have a decent budget again. Might not be this summer though. If we lose money full stop with premier league money and a relatively modest wage bill something is wrong.
If we have made a bid for Sarr it is probably a cheeky one or just as silly as Arsenal's bid for Zaha, dependent on one's viewpoint. The Hassan guy might be our real target and realistic if we throw in Okaka as a make weight. I don't really think we will smash our transfer record.
Success and Penaranda have been a big disappointment but even a dog average player in the Championship can be worth £3 million nowadays. We won't really know the market until the window is closing. It would be a surprise if none of our fringe players are sold or loaned out come August. We might even hold onto Dodi but he could be even more difficult to manage than these two.
Where has it been linked that we would throw in Okaka? I’d say the Trezeguet deal is more likely a distraction for the Sarr deal to try and get his club to drop their price. The Sarr deal has been more widely reported so I’d think he’s the main target.
But Success and Penaranda haven’t even been dog average at Championship level for 2 years. They have barely accumulated any meaningful minutes at any level. I’d be very shocked if any club was willing to part with ANY money at all on them really. Loan deals would be any buying clubs preference given their circumstances.
It wouldn’t surprise me if we have a bid on the table for Lukebakio or Delefeou, neither of which I am convinced want to be with us, and are not going to accept until we have a replacement e.g Sarr, already lined up.
Adam LeventhalVerified account @AdamLeventhal #WatfordFC transfer update Sources: interest in Ismaila Sarr (Rennes) for record fee, not only club in mix & punchy auction possible Kim Min-Jae (Beijing Gouan) deal still possible. Buy now, join in Jan option due to China season Outs likely: Prodl, Okaka with Dahlberg (loan)
I'll defer to the accountants on here but haven't wages gone up substantially year on year, as well as the debt owed to Gino (all at a tasty interest rate)?
Maybe Gino is thinking that Ismaila Sarr is a whole club. Somewhere in Southern Europe with access to a dodgy visa approval scheme. Only logical way to square this circle.
I am not an accountant but we made a loss of £31m last year after the £41m depreciation charge so even if we did not have to write down the players purchase price over their contract period we would have a £10m "surplus". Any increased surplus has to come from players sales albeit finishing higher up the league would help In round terms the accounts for FY18 show we have assets worth £160m made up of players (£123m) and the ground. That is funded by £80m of interest bearing loans from the parent and £80m (net) of player related creditors (so money owed on transfers in -£94m -less money due on transfers out-£14m). The £80m lent by the parent is not all Pozzo money as the parent has borrowed £55m at 6.3% interest rate from 23 Capital Ltd who as security have a charge on the ground and over the players contracts. We therefore make a small profit on being in the PL but not enough to spend big unless we trade players IMHO. The accounts for the year just ended should be better as we will have the Richarlison profit in them
As at 30/6/18 the £20m loaned to the club by the parent Hornet Investments ltd that is the Pozzo money-well it looks like it -is charged at 5% so not usurious
I dont c us as a selling club. We have significantly upgraded our squad every year for the last 5 years and Richarlison is the only big player we sold in that time. Even last doom laden summer we brought in 2 first team regulars. We are in such rude health that our loaned out 5th choice striker was good enough to keep Udinese up with his goals, a loanee who barely played for us is valued at €20m and we have a potential star in Joao Pedro in the pipeline. Watford FC is a vehicle for the Pozzos to attract players. If a player is worth the investment the purchase will be made. Sarr at £35m isnt about the money it's about the odds on him being worth at least 25% more in 2-5 years. Is he worth the risk? If our transfer squad believe he is worth that risk we will offer that amount. We are moving up the food chain. Some people invest on property, some in currency, the Pozzos invest in footballers and they are no mugs.
Sounds like actuarial talk to me - a notch or 3 upgrade on your common or garden accountant. Who else would use ‘usurious’ when ‘extortionate’ has a better ring to it? (Not a criticism of the post btw).
Also there's been some changes on FFP so we're allowed to carry more debt - I think it will derisk a larger investment for a smaller club like ourselves in terms of FFP. Especially if the club see a player with potetial for significant future returns.
A good statement but one things for sure the Pozzo’s don’t really get into bidding wars as far as I can remember. Also the figures are increasing year by year, 18m they paid for Gray would probably be more today so 30m is probably where we’re at in the league table of financial figures with other teams. Agree they will only spend this big if they believe that profits in the future. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's hilarious that sky sports are even bothering to run this story. There is no way in hell we'll spend £35m on a player this summer. I doubt we'll spend more that £15m on a single player and that's generous! I will eat a lump of coal if we spend £35m on one player.
My brother used to eat coal when he was five. We are all carbon based life forms so must be OK. There is a hundred weight on it's way if this happens (might even be able to grow a diamond).
Never signing this guy in a million years. This is just a publicity stunt from the Pozzo’s. There is one every window. A stupid target who will never join us yet “we tried our best” etc to sign him. The deal just couldn’t get done so we signed another RB instead.
The 10m surplus is disappointing. If we are 16th in wage bill and still can’t turn a decent profit then I suppose it shows how ridiculous and unrealistic player wages in general are (unless we are getting stuffed on the loans). We will go down at some point and all 20 clubs will have billionaire owners. Or everyone will go bust I suppose is another alternative!
This is the utterly crazy football business. Any sort of surplus proves we are in rude health. Looks like Arsenal will have to re-mortgage the Emirates to get Zaha.