Watford Fc 1-1 Newcastle United - 25/09/2021

Discussion in 'Match Day' started by reids, Sep 19, 2021.

  1. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Squad Player

    Kabasele and Ekong are both far too error prone to risk as a partnership imo. Particularly when our Keepers all seem error prone too.
     
  2. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    Would have helped if he brought in a decent (or any?!?) CB.
     
    Chumlax likes this.
  3. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Squad Player

    Yep. It's not like there aren't affordable options available
     
  4. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    True, but to be fair his budget was £0. So he did quite well on that.
     
    Bwood_Horn likes this.
  5. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    His budget was whatever we spent on Louza. Although I'm not sure if that purchase would have been out of his hands.

    Refuse to believe there wasn't a capable CB available on a free/loan/small fee that would have been an upgrade on Cathcart.

    Overall happy with the summer recruitment though, considering the (lack of) budget.
     
  6. LondonOrn

    LondonOrn Squad Player

    I'm quite sure we'd have lost that though with Bachmann in goal, it's good to have Ben back though it's almost certainly his last season with us, likely in football altogether.
     
    dynamo380 likes this.
  7. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Net spend was £0, so that was the budget.
     
  8. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Squad Player

    Two poor GK's don't equal one good GK unfortunately
     
  9. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    Okay mate whatever you want. We had absolutely no money to spend on a centre back (despite spending money on players in other positions). Okie dokie.
     
    folkestone orn and Jumbolina like this.
  10. lutonh8a

    lutonh8a Squad Player

    So I have just watched the highlights and Kucko makes the tackle on the halfway line and runs forward with the ball and passes to King who then passes to Dennis, Cleverley does not touch the ball, in the whole phase of play.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2021
  11. AndrewH63

    AndrewH63 Reservist

    I forgot to day the ref was dreadful. Australian, enough said.
     
  12. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Had we sold another player we would have. Right back at ya.
     
  13. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Foster made 4 or 5 excellent saves. He kept the score down. On another day that could have been a very heavy defeat.
     
    dynamo380 likes this.
  14. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    Got a source for that? Or have you just made it up?
     
  15. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    The budget was zero pounds. Any money we spent had to be generated by players sales. This is why we ended up with a net spend of £0.

    We signed Louza for £10m and sold Hughes for £10m and so on.

    I think it’s quite easy to grasp what went on during the summer………but clearly not it seems.
     
  16. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    All true. But don’t buy Louza if you are bringing in Sissoko, Tufan, Etebo and Kucka. Buy a centre back rather than keeping your agent mate sweet.
     
  17. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    I hear there's this Chilean geezer who's available, wonder what happened to him?
     
  18. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    I'm not seeing that at all, Foster did nothing in that game that Bachmann can't, he's a perfectly competent shot-stopper (can't really say anything more since he's not been called upon often to make worldy saves), whereas Foster has looked shaky with shots Bachmann would have got himself in position to save comfortably. Foster did make some crucial saves, but they were fairly routine for the most part, a decent 1 on 1, but again, Bachmann is quite good at those
     
    scummybear likes this.
  19. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    I'm sure we knew ages ago that Hughes could have been leaving, just a baffling decision from a footballing perspective to sign a 6th choice CM for such a fee. PS, didn't Hughes get sold for £6m or so initially?
     
  20. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Totally agree with that. Louza is not used so not needed. Money should have been spent elsewhere.
     
  21. LouOrns

    LouOrns First Year Pro

    We have money to spend, it’s why we left two spaces open in the squad and why we’ll spend money in January. We looked at a centre back but didn’t bring one in
     
  22. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    Begs the question why we couldn't get one in before the window closed, we needed one as soon as Wilmot went out the door! Can we still sign free agents? A bit hacked off to see Brentford sign Zanka (albeit there is the Danish connection there) as I'm sure he'd have been a fine squad option
     
  23. LondonOrn

    LondonOrn Squad Player

    I need to watch the highlights to be sure, but I thought he did seem braver than Bachmann in being prepared to come out more and make crucial interceptions (not just saves) - also I’m not sure Bachmann would’ve got to the ball either in what was you have to admit a good strike.

    He just seems to provide a bit more solidity in defence and our record of 2 conceded in 3 games with him between the sticks as opposed to 10 in 5 seems to have something to do with that.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2021
    dynamo380 and LaClusazSki like this.
  24. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Squad Player

    Say what you like about Bachmann, but his mistakes aren't normally saving shots that you'd expect a keeper to make, Foster after a very good start to last season, increasingly does let in doozies. Norwich were crap and basically only had one good opportunity which they took, whereas Newcastle had plenty but spurned them through their own wastefulness, not through Foster making particularly good saves, so I'm not sure about adding extra solidity. Would have to look at the highlights though to check if Foster's more assertive style from crosses could have made the difference mind you
     
  25. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    Why doesn't Gino just invest in some defenders it's rather baffling? We could have finished top 10 in Prem a few times last time round and even now our attacking options are pretty good, just seems so obvious to spend some money on a centre back and a keeper? David Raya was £3 million two years ago he's gonna go for £15-20m eventually.

    3 of Prem all time top transfers are defensive players,

    It's actually baffling as a business model too now let alone from a squad / footballing perspective.
     
    Chumlax likes this.
  26. Eddie_Hitler

    Eddie_Hitler Academy Graduate

    You accidentally let in a goal ofnTV, you’re labeled a prat and that’s the game
     
  27. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever Administrator Staff Member

    Well Bachmann must have been injured as he wasn’t even on the bench so he would have not been available anyway ?

    We’ll never know if he’s made the saves Foster did or Foster would have saved that Spurs goal.

    Neither have made real howlers tbh and both have had solid spells of making saves.

    Foster probably comes off his line more but that might be down to expensive and having more confidence because he has a lot in himself !
     
  28. Eddie_Hitler

    Eddie_Hitler Academy Graduate

    We were a pretty much a shambles until we scored. After that we started to grow in the game, albeit 60mins late.

    The Turk looked briefly rattled by his characteristically robust welcome to English football but quickly recovered and by the end of the game was probably our most effective attacking midfielder. I’d like him start against Leeds.

    King got another assist but still has a whiff of Andre Gray about him. I was delighted when he scored but his oft praise movement was poor as he was miles offside. He’ll score eventually but can Watford afford to wait until he does? Are you really a striker if you go 34 league games without a goal? Would like to see Fletch given 15-20mins against Leeds. He can put himself about a bit and so let’s see how he compares to King in the EPL.

    Probably Rose’s best game so far and Kiko didn’t do too much wrong. It was more he was well marked and the team seemingly forgetting he was playing. Oft isolated on the touch line surrounded by blue shirts cutting off the supply to Sarr. This changed went Ngakia came on, who’s definitely a better player coming off the bench than starting at the moment.

    Foster still starts. Wasn’t solely responsible for the goal, which they telegraphed twice before it went in and we had 11 players in the box. That said, he got a hand to it and should have tipped it round the post.

    As for Newcastle, they’d done their homework. Played physical, ugly football and exploited an inexperienced, nervous referee. I wonder whether the Longstaff set play was the result our tactic of having 11 players in the box defending corners. They had 6 up for the corner but by the time Longstaff got the ball there were 9 Newcastle players in or around the box. We need to keep on of the front 3 up when defending corners or have the opposition queuing up to put shots into a crowded box.

    In summary, I’d have taken 1-1 at HT and was disappointed we didn’t nick it at the death. But we were very lucky so happy with a point and the pluses we can take away from the game, an improving Rose (who’d want Masina at RB now?), The Turk, and JP back available. Think we’ll get something at Elland Rd.
     
  29. domthehornet

    domthehornet Moderator Staff Member

    Poor performance from us, we seem to start games slow with no link between midfield and our attackers. We are set up poorly almost too defensively in the middle. Despite the set up teams seem to waltz straight through the middle of us with ease. Defensively we are far too narrow which allows the overlaps from opposing full backs. We look better when we play a 4231 but Xisco still persists with a 433 which is far too open.

    The ref was diabolical, should have sent Kucka off for a needless elbow and let other challenges go that should have been yellows in particular Ritchie on Sarr in the first two minutes and Manquillo leathering the ball away towards the end of the game.

    Newcastle came to do a job on us and we played right into their hands. They time wasted from the get go and caused us problems having numerous free headers. Luckily for us they are pony, mind so are we.

    Xisco is improving but slowly, he needs to buck his ideas up if he wants to be a PL manager at the end of the season.
     
  30. LaClusazSki

    LaClusazSki Reservist

    Foster made a mistake on their goal. He missed it. It should have been a fairly comfortable save..
    Bachmann is not good enough for the Premier league.
    Dahlberg made a right mess of an easy catch in the last minute to hand Plymouth the win. It's the second howler this season, but he has been very good other than that .
    Cathcart should never play for us again. Out of his depth
     
  31. EnjoytheGame

    EnjoytheGame Reservist

    Longstaff's shot looked like it took a deflection off Sissoko. Difficult to tell from the Sky mobile highlights and waiting to see on MOTD. Perhaps that, and being partially unsighted, made it hard for Foster to adjust his position because he got a hand to it but not a strong enough hand from a strong enough position. Disappointing because, as you say, it should have been a relatively straightforward one to palm over the top.

    As others have said, we once again struggled to get the ball to Sarr in positions where he can be dangerous, particularly in the first half. In large part that was because Newcastle doubled up on that side. The consquence was we had a lot of the ball on the left in the first half. In those situations, I do wonder why Xisco doesn't swap Sarr and Dennis over for 10 minutes to see if it unsettles the opposition. Perhaps that's too simplistic a suggestion but it might sew a seed of uncertainty for the entire back line if they have to face a different problem all of a sudden. What do the two players who are on Sarr detail do now? How does the other full-back cope with a different challenge? Maybe showing my age and nostalgic biases here – and perhaps it wasn't as regular thing as I remember – but Barnes and Callaghan used to do this to good effect. Instead, the approach seems to be to get to half-time without inflicting any further damage on ourselves and try to reset then. The overall effect from the game, and particularly from the chaotic last 15 minutes, is that if we'd played with the intensity we finished with for longer stretches we'd have won, even though Newcastle had far more good chances.
     
    reg_varney likes this.
  32. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Squad Player

    He's also played a large part in us conceding yesterday and against Norwich.
     
  33. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    That's ok then. We'll fill in our quota in a more expensive market when half the season has already been played out. Makes total sense.
     
    Steve Leo Beleck likes this.
  34. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Well, if the defence did their job better he'd be more protected. I do recognise Foster should have done better with the shot that beat him, and he also gifted a ball straight to a Newcastle player. I'm seeing signs in Foster that he is mistake prone, but he's doing far more good than harm.

    The downside with Bachmann is that he's costing us goals in important times because he doesn't come for crosses. He's cost us 2 games against Spurs and Wolves with the score at 0-0 because of his error of judgement. I can accept one-off mistakes when someone kicks the ball badly or allows a ball to go past him that should have been saved, but when it's a fundamental flaw in your game, such as not coming for crosses, then he cannot play until his game is more rounded.

    I think, if you take everything into consideration, Foster is the stronger keeper and should play above Bachmann. That's not to say he's perfect and we don't need a new keeper. It's highly likely Foster will go at the end of the season, so we'll need to sign another keeper then, unless Dalhberg is the answer.
     
    Happy bunny and We hate 48 like this.
  35. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    Again, have you got a source for this? Tranfermarkt says the incomings and outgoings were:

    Louza: £9m
    Dennis: £3.6m
    Sissoko: £3.1m
    Tufan: £0.9m (loan fee)
    Pollock: £250k

    Hughes: £6.3m
    Dawson: £2m
    Success: £1.6m
    Wilmot: £1.5m

    Tranfermarkt isn't always spot on, but if you actually think we got £10m up front for Will Hughes with 1 year on his deal then...wow.

    So a net spend of about £5m, and no first team CB brought in. And besides, we're not privy to the structure of the deals above. We might only be paying £2m this year for Louza etc. All guesswork. You can get up on your high horse again as much as you want, but you've got no idea.

    The only facts we have to work with are:

    -We have 1/2 (at most) PL level CBs, to last us to January.
    -We have spent £10-16m on players this summer, none of which are first team CBs

    Whatever way you want to spin it, that's a **** up.
     

Share This Page