Watford FC On MOTD/MOTD2 - BBC1/2

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Smudger, Aug 8, 2015.

  1. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina Squad Player

    Fantastic stuff on the Debate on Sky. A 10 minute discussion of the Austin disallowed goal and how we need VAR. Not a single mention of the penalty decision. Southampton should have won the game and it’s as simple as that. Townsend even demanded the ref came out and admitted his mistake so Southampton “could move on”. Laughably low quality punditry.
     
  2. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I just wrote a similar thing on the match thread. They were said how sorry they felt for Austin having his goal chalked off and even for Redmond being denied an assist. What an absolute joke.

    The entire football world mourns when something goes Watford's way, just like when Capoue fouled Zaha. How long were we demonised after that? A few weeks at least.

    Why don't they discuss endlessly when we're dumped out of the Carabao Cup because of a referee's blunder, or sympathise when we get a second yellow card as well as a penalty in the 30th minute against Bournemouth, which evidently is not something referee's like to do.

    It's all bollox.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2018
  3. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Andy Townsend - didn't he play for Southampton once?

    And if it was Andros Townsend he is probably still bitter from his time here!

    TBF Talksport talked about both incidents - some even suggested ours was a more obvious error.
     
    The Voice of Reason likes this.
  4. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    And if it was Sue Townsend? A mole?
     
    wfc4ever likes this.
  5. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Turnip Townshend? Influential in the revolution which saw huge increases in agricultural productivity in the eighteen century & beyond. This led to a surge in population which, in turn, provided the large urban pool of labour which was a catalyst for Britain’s rapid industrialisation.

    Without this, one could argue, football would have remained rural. Charlie Austin would foam at the mouth at the injustices visited on Hurstbourne Tarrant in their clashes with Bovingdon & Sarrett.

    The evolution of worker self organisation would also have been different.
     
    Unhappy bunny likes this.
  6. Diamond

    Diamond Squad Player

    Did none of you listen to me when I said what would happen if we dared to beat Tottenham?
     
  7. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    You're surely not suggesting the game is corrupt at the highest level? Heaven forbid a referee would favour one side over another to try to engineer as result. :eek:

    The thing is British referees are so dopey, they do this sort of thing just for their own amusement. They don't even get a brown envelope from some shady Malaysian syndicate. Why not earn from it?
     
  8. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    Here's Jon Moss, just to highlight what he does to us and how he deals with things differently for other teams.

    (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXrA7Lep58c) If the link doesn't work, just copy & paste inside the brackets into your browser.

    He gives two penalties in the Man Utd v Everton match played 28th October 2018, just 3 weeks after our game. Scroll forward to 1.40 for the Everton penalty. Both Gueye and Smalling, who committed the fouls, were on yellow cards. Why didn't they receive a second yellow?

    Here's the stats page for the match, so you can see Gueye was booked in the 22nd minute and Smalling was booked in the 20th minute. https://www.premierleague.com/match/38404

    Now watch how he reacts to Kabasele.
    https://www.watfordfc.com/matches/highlights/highlights-watford-0-4-afc-bournemouth Scroll forward to 5:58. A penalty and a second yellow card.

    Please can anyone tell me is there a reason for a different outcome? or is Moss just a ****?
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
  9. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    A little bit more to add to the post above. I've just researched every match in the Premier League over the last two seasons. Watford are the only team to have had a player sent off after giving away a penalty.

    For it to happen twice, in the Carabao Cup as well, is extremely rare and very, very strange. It's not happened once to any other club in any game this season, apart from us (twice).
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
  10. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard Squad Player

  11. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    The last time any player was sent off after giving away a penalty was Ron Vlaar sent off by Roger East in the Aston Villa v Stoke match on 21st February 2015, in the 2014-15 season, and that was in the 92 minute!!

    I didn't realise it was quite that rare, so any official sending a player off after giving away a penalty as early as the 30th minute of a match is virtually unheard of.
     
  12. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    I could be wrong (normally am!) but wasn’t there a directive that players shouldn’t be sent off for giving away a penalty? They called it ‘Double Jeopardy Rule’ or something? Not sure if it’s what happened or doesn’t apply to two yellows maybe.

    However, and I when I say this I do know Jon Moss is an bad referee who is the most inconsistent...but it could be that he forgot that directive when reffing us but was reminded of it after by the PGMOL, so applied it in the game you’ve highlighted?

    Not an excuse for him but it’s plausible.
     
  13. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    If The FA want to be seen as being consistent, they will come out and charge Austin for his comments. They won’t because they will have sympathy for him - but one wonders what they’d do if Mourinho had said/done similar.

    The inconsistencies and hypocrisy starts at the top of the game so I’m not surprised when it creeps into the officiating as well.
     
    Jumbolina and FromDiv4 like this.
  14. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    The exact same thing happened in 82!
     
  15. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    Well both Mason and Moss suffer from the same loss of memory on the directive then, as they both did the same thing to Kabasele. They all know the rules, and apply them whenever they feel. This is what is so frustrating, the deliberate manipulation of matches. There is no rhyme or reason to it. Unless something extraordinary occurred, the match was over as a contest from the 32 minute because of that unfair, unjust and extremely rare decision.

    I remember on the day Moss was eager to stamp on Watford early, for whatever reason. He booked Kabasele for the charge on Begovic after 11 minutes, then booked Cathcart after 22 minutes, then sent off Kabasele after 32 minutes.
     
    Jumbolina likes this.
  16. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    To be fair Kabasele’s first yellow was as a clear a yellow as you’ll see on a football pitch. Not sure we can blame Moss for that one.
     
    Steve Leo Beleck likes this.
  17. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I'm not questioning the first yellow at all. Just the need he had to issue the second yellow after giving a penalty. A decision which befell Kabasele in two matches this season, when this sort of punishment has not been applied to any Premier League player since Feb 2015.
     
  18. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    As an aside, as the game you're discussing was vs Muff, an unusual thing happened during their game against Newcastle on Saturday. They were NOT awarded a penalty that seemed a more valid claim than most I've seen them get. Now that's real controversy!
     
    Glenhorn and hornetboy1 like this.
  19. Otter

    Otter Gambling industry insider

    As a result Newcastle will be ceded to Scotland.
     
  20. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    So no player has been sent off for giving away a penalty in 3 years - be it a 2nd yellow or straight red?

    There must have been a few handballs on the line or last man fouls before the new ruling came in in that time.

    Wasn't Kabasele given a straight red card against Spurs which was overturned on appeal?
     
  21. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    The change in the rules to account for "Double jeopardy" or "Triple punishment" relates to denying a goalscoring opportunity. Previously that was a red card offence regardless of whether the challenge was deemed deliberate. Now it's a yellow card if it's not deemed deliberate.
    In both of the Kabasele cases it must have been decided it was either a deliberate foul.. or that a goalscoring opportunity was denied (2nd yellow) Rightly or wrongly.

    Here's a link explaining this.. that oddly features a Watford player committing a foul (they really dont like us!) and further down a Bournemouth player getting sent off!
    https://www.skysports.com/football/...-softening-rules-on-fouls-in-the-penalty-area
     
  22. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Reservist

    Memo to HB1:

    OK, you’ve convinced me. The whole football world - the authorities, the media, referees, other clubs and their players and managers - all have it in for Watford and are biased against us.

    Now will you cease and desist please?
     
  23. Bahrain Hornet

    Bahrain Hornet Academy Graduate

    Was he not booked for the shirt pull just before the foul that resulted in the penalty?
     
  24. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I checked second yellow cards for penalty awards only. It was 4 season's ago the last time someone was sent off after giving away a penalty and getting a second yellow card.

    Straight reds, although I didn't spot any, are usually only given for dangerous foul play or deliberate handball. This is also quite rare these days as well.

    At the end of the day, as my research showed, it's highly unlikely a player will receive a second yellow card after giving away a penalty. Referee's just do not do this these days....apart from Mason and Moss on Kabasele, for whatever reason.
     
    Jumbolina and wfc4ever like this.
  25. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    It's up to you to make your own mind up. I've just provided the evidence.
     
  26. Hornpete

    Hornpete Reservist

    All this prooves is Kabasele is stupid enough to get the wrong side and lunge into tackles in the box when on a yellow card. A feat no other defender has been dumb enough to do in 4 years - and he done it twice the plum.
     
    domthehornet likes this.
  27. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Surely the most obvious explanation is that during the debrief after the Bournemouth game, the referees assessors pointed out to him that he'd made a mistake by giving Kabasele the second yellow. That would've still been in his mind three weeks later in a bigger game so that helped him make the right decisions.
     
    UEA_Hornet likes this.
  28. Burnsy

    Burnsy Reservist

    Yep, this.

    What is ridiculous is that you can’t appeal yellow cards and the FA don’t rescind them either.
     
    Glenhorn and wfc4ever like this.
  29. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Reservist

    No mention of us at all tonight. No highlights. No explanation. Nothing.
    Have we been relegated?
     
  30. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    No Muff penalty today.

    Wilson not playing.
     
    wimbornet likes this.
  31. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Tidy solution.
     
  32. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    I noted that Keown has had his eyebrows sculpted.
     
  33. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    When you look as scary as that, something has to be done to protect the British viewing public. He will look like Tom cruise in 6 months time.
     
  34. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Eddie Howe moaning about the first goal changing games - bit like the offside goal Bournemouth scored in the week I guess.
     
  35. Forzainglese

    Forzainglese Reservist

    Scotland refused to sign for them: "Return to sender".
     

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