Watford Fc 1-0 Sheffield Wednesday - 02/04/2021

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Otter, Mar 23, 2021.

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What will the outcome be

Poll closed Apr 3, 2021.
  1. Watford win by 3+

    14.4%
  2. Watford win by 2

    46.4%
  3. Watford win by 1

    19.6%
  4. Score draw

    5.2%
  5. No score draw

    2.1%
  6. Wednesday win by 1

    2.1%
  7. Wednesday win by 2

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Wednesday win by 3+

    2.1%
  9. Almen Abdi chooses the winner

    8.2%
  1. Eastcoastorn

    Eastcoastorn First Year Pro

    That was an Ivic performance. Absolutely dire. This season has been one of the most painful to watch. I’ll take the vital 3pts but boy we are hard work to watch this season. I can’t remember a season where I’ve been so annoyed with our play even when we win. I normally couldn’t give a **** how we win as long as we win but this season has really been unenjoyable. Maybe it’s the fact that if we fail to get promotion this season it would be a financial disaster and a 1990s style downward spiral. Maybe it’s because I can’t be there to cheer the goals, applaud good moments and shout my annoyance at poor play. Four more wins should see us over the line and we can hopefully forget this season and that relegation ever happened.
     
  2. zztop

    zztop Eurovision Winner 2015

    I absolutely think we'll go up too, and have done all season but our improvement has been through our mindset and attitude (and no Deeney). All I'm saying is that it isn't perfect, and I think we don't get up enough for the easier (on paper) games.
     
    Wexford-yellow, Chumlax and Moosegasm like this.
  3. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    You have to give the players huge credit for consistently winning when they are playing in soulless empty stadiums, we have actually done much better without supporters, when some (the chosen few) were let in to the Vic we didn’t get the results losing to Cardiff and I believe drawing at least one of the others.

    you can only beat what’s in front of you and 10 out of 11 says it all!
     
    EB Hornet likes this.
  4. davisp2

    davisp2 Reservist

    My only concern with the performance yesterday, was that at 1-0 we seemed to sit back. It’s going to be a very nervy finish if we play like that; on another day Rhodes scores and its 2 points lost. That said Sema being out was clearly an issue, Pedro wasn’t effective out on the left and Success was poor. A front 3 of Sarr, Sema and Pedro/Gray with the Zinger behind should give mean that we get enough goals to get over the line
     
  5. TBF that was the first off performance since the formation change.
     
  6. The Voice of Reason

    The Voice of Reason First Team Captain

    We should have played Zinc out on the left with Pedro down the middle leaving out Success and bringing back Cleverly into MF. That would have been much better IMO and we probably would have won more comfortably had we done that.
     
    Markoa$ and Moosegasm like this.
  7. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard First Team

    This league is so awful, we were absolutely woeful yet Wednesday couldn't even score.
     
  8. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Its making less grammar mistake's thats important

    A cad of the highest order.
     
    Bwood_Horn likes this.
  9. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Its making less grammar mistake's thats important

    I don’t agree. The forwards in particular were off it yesterday, not helped by the line being led by the rusty/hopeless Success, but the intent as a team to dominate, attack and score was still there. It was a world away from the Ivic (and early Munoz) displays.
     
    stevetalboys and PowerJugs like this.
  10. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Then his venomous barbs will be invaluable
     
  11. Siohmy

    Siohmy Reservist

    Well firstly the offside rule is an arse. Seriously, who makes up this ****. If we’d conceded that goal we’d have been furious it was not disallowed.

    As for Success, he showed glimpses of what he’s capable of but still question if he can really be a consistent performer. However, somehow allowing himself to be offside, even though not given in the end, when on the shoulder of the last defender is next level incompetence. I mean he was right next to him! How do you not keep yourself onside in that position looking across? Got very lucky with the resulting goal.

    As for the game? It was reassuring “Watford” making hard work of it and putting us all through the stress mill. Still don’t know how Rhodes missed that chance. Hopefully this is just a case of shaking off the rust from the break but we know only too well how that can affect a team. The amount of times a long run of positive results can be followed by a run of indifferent results (or worse). I really don’t want anything to be riding on the last two games. Sorry Sky and neutrals but I want dead rubbers!

    One final thing. I’m glad the referee at least booked the Sheff Wed centre back after 2 minutes. Sick and tired of teams coming out clearly with instructions to hurt Sarr early on. Noticeable that often the culprits are lead by limited ex-players. Jason Tindall, Jonathon Woodgate, Darren Moore. You can see them all saying to their players “go out there and leave one on him early”.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  12. Chumlax

    Chumlax Reservist

    Mostly agree with the sentiment and am similarly glad action was taken, but, I mean, Woodgate literally played for Real Madrid. He is clearly an extremely limited manager, but it's a tad unfair/revisionist to label him a limited player!
     
  13. Mollyboo

    Mollyboo First Year Pro

    The merest glance at other fans' forums makes it obvious that performances immediately after international breaks aren't great.
    Win, lose or draw, no one was waxing lyrical about their team yesterday.
     
    Rozerhorn and Forzainglese like this.
  14. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Would we then be moaning that we didn't have an Ivic type who played for draws against very beatable opposition? :D
     
  15. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    As Cleverley wasn’t on the bench, maybe he wasn’t fit enough after his injury.
     
  16. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    They said in comms that he'd suffered a setback, how serious, I don't know
     
  17. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Plus I don't know how much you can blame 'Big Dave' for hacking Sarr, he was isolating, and Wednesday didn't even know he was playing until 2pm!
     
  18. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    After we scored we did sit back a bit and tried to play the ball around the middle of the park when we could have gone for it more, probably trying to take a breather as we've been pretty good at during this run. It was a more functional performance rather than spectacular (to put it mildly), but we did at least go for it a bit more than under Ivic, we could and perhaps should have had more if not for Success
     
    Dorset-Orn and Forzainglese like this.
  19. Siohmy

    Siohmy Reservist

    Ok, I did think when writing that Woodgate was a stretch. Did score own goal and get sent off on Madrid debut though!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Chumlax likes this.
  20. Happy bunny

    Happy bunny Cheered up a bit

    Woodgate looked like the best central defender of his era until he suffered a long succession of injuries
     
  21. The Voice of Reason

    The Voice of Reason First Team Captain

    My bad I thought he was on the bench :oops:
     
  22. BusheyOrn

    BusheyOrn Reservist

    Can anyone remind me when was the last time Bachmann had to make a proper save? I know we let a goal in at Rotherham but it wasn't a mistake. Maybe Cardiff? Otherwise it is quite a few games ago. (Sierralta backwards header?)
     
  23. Supertommymooney

    Supertommymooney Reservist

    Glad I didn't pay my £10 for viewing that.

    Bring back QSF immediately.

    Style over promotion any day.
     
  24. Otter

    Otter Gambling industry insider

    Surely the penalty save at Rotherham
     
  25. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I didn't really see a problem with the goal. Yes, Success was offside, and he would have made a play for the ball had it gone to him, but the defender put the ball into his own net. I've watched the clip back several times in slow motion and only once did Lees look at Success' position and that was before the ball was crossed in. He saw that Success was ahead of him and offside, then he turned his attention completely on the ball and was unaware where Success was after that. Success could have stopped his run completely, and I suggest the defender would have dealt with the ball exactly as he did, just like when Mapps panicked and put the ball into his own net at Brighton last season when no one was anywhere near him. A defender has to just leave a ball like that and hope the striker is either offside or caught out by surprise and misses the chance.

    I lip read the conversation between linesman and Kavanagh. He lino thought Success had put the ball into the net, but referee informed him it was the defender, then he agreed with the ref that it should be a goal. Had the lino seen the defender had put the ball into his own net he wouldn't have flagged in the first place and nothing would have been said about it.
     
  26. BusheyOrn

    BusheyOrn Reservist

    There you go, my Swiss cheese memory coming into play!
     
  27. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Success would have probably missed !

    That should annoy them the most..

    They said on Quest there isn’t a ruling for an incident like that so guess you have to give the goal.
     
    Hogg-DEENEY!!! and Forzainglese like this.
  28. Forzainglese

    Forzainglese Reservist

    I think Bachmann coming out and successfully smothering an attempt from some Wednesday clogger or other should count as a save. I can't think of any others during this game.
     
    Hogg-DEENEY!!! likes this.
  29. Siohmy

    Siohmy Reservist

    Possibly. Not sure in a ground with no fans that the defender wouldn’t be aware of the player behind him. Likely he’d have been aware that Success was at least fairly likely to be behind him. The fact is the attacking team have gained an advantage by being offside. At which point does it stop? Taking it to the extreme, Success stands a yard from goal and a yard offside and a cross is put in. The defender is meant to let the ball go and be absolutely certain the Lino will call the offside?

    I’m of the line of thought that if you as a player are manoeuvred into making a play you would not normally make by a player who is offside then it is offside.

    It’s like the case a few weeks ago where the Prem central defender (can’t remember the specifics) took the ball down and a player who was offside nicked the ball because it supposedly entered another stage of play when he looked to bring the ball under control. BS of the highest order. Why should the player in question be forced to just “lump it” or head it clear by a player who is offside?!


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    Happy bunny likes this.
  30. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    There's the rub. How can anyone predict what a defender would do? Using my previous example of Mariappa at Brighton. He put the ball into his own net when no one was anywhere near him, so defenders panic all the time in this situation. Surely putting the ball into his own net is the last thing Lees should have done, but he did it because he panicked. The most logical thing to do in that situation is to leave it alone, but defenders do not do this. They score own goals regularly in this situation.

    I'm of the opinion Lees would have scored an own goal regardless of where Success was. You could argue Lees knew Success was offside as when he glanced at him he saw he was ahead of him but decided to play the ball no matter what. The forward player being onside or offside is irrelevant unless the actually ball reaches him.

    I think the referee got it absolutely right, as there is too much doubt over whether the defender played the ball because he knew a striker was behind him or not. It was just bad play on Lees part and was a valid goal.
     
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  31. Chumlax

    Chumlax Reservist

    Not at all going down the 'we've just been so lucky, should have conceded hatfuls' road, but it's also true that the reason this is the case owes as much to multiple strange and fairly inexplicable failings from opponents, as to the idea of an iron curtain-style prevention of opposition chances - the most recent example obviously being Rhodes yesterday managing to miss the target entirely from about 4 yards.

    Again, though, that being said, we do allow very few clear-cut opportunities.
     
  32. Malteser2

    Malteser2 First Year Pro

    We win a few matches with the new formation but then lost at Bournemouth. Cue lots of angst about our good run being over and we might not bounce back again.

    Reality...6 straight wins after that bad-tempered loss.

    In the middle of our winning run came a real tough challenge..Cardiff away. Lots of pre-match angst that we weren’t good enough to win matches like that.

    Reality...we did.

    Then three straight matches against relegation teams. Lots of angst that it would be typical Watford to mess those up.

    Reality...9 points out of 9.

    In that run came the international break, and lots of angst that we’d lose our momentum.

    Reality...yes we did lose some of our momentum and weren’t great yesterday, but we won.

    We are on our best run in years. We are a ruthless winning machine. Sometimes it’s pretty and relaxing, sometimes it’s edgy and stressful. But we are winning, while our two closest rivals trying to catch us are not.

    If we can’t enjoy this amazing few months, we will never enjoy watching Watford again.

    10 wins in 11. This is almost as good as it gets. It’s just fantastic. We’ve transformed from play-off hopefuls to promotion favourites.

    I respect those who have doubts or criticisms or who aren’t enjoying things so much in these difficult times, but this poster here has been savouring every minute of football life ever since Bristol city rocked up to the Vic.
     
    wfcmoog, EB Hornet, W4BS and 9 others like this.
  33. Forzainglese

    Forzainglese Reservist

    I think you are right. I also think the referee was right in awarding it, because that is the way it seems to be interpreted at the moment.
    VAR and, in this league, slow-mo replays have exposed just how difficult the referees' job is - constantly having to see the action correctly and then interpret the application of the rules to that situation.
    Football fudges a lot of its rules (not just the offside) and referees are expected to, and praised for, 'letting the game flow'; all in the name of entertainment.
     
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  34. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    Not that I care as the goal stood but anybody in an offside position in the six yard box must be interfering with play. Make it easy and say it’s offside no mattter whether he touches it or not
     
  35. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    Some very funny comments after the Bournemouth game, wet sheets all over the shop

    "We don’t have anywhere near the mentality to get autos, we’d won four in a row and they’d been crap, we needed to take this game by the scruff of the neck, you know, like we were going for promotion. Instead we get that pathetic display"

    "With their games in hand, Swansea could very easily and plausibly be 8 points ahead of us when their games are evened up...We can't claim to be competing for automatics, especially when what we just witnessed was achieved with what was theoretically our first-choice XI. Incredibly annoying as it is, it's the playoff lottery for us, which is worse for us than anyone else because we're incredible bottlers who play the occasion not our own game and have a Head Coach who is incapable of in-game management or adaptation"

    Obviously the job isn't done, but as you say, let's enjoy the ride
     

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