Watford Academy/U23

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by wfc78, Aug 14, 2012.

  1. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    5-0 down after 50 minutes. This is painful.

    Header from a corner, 2 pens, 2 open play. The second pen looked outside the box, but still.

    Leeds have a pretty strong side out with Douglas, Berardi, Eddie Nketiah and Jack Clarke all starting (the first 3 subbed at half time). However, Leeds are just more energetic than us all over the pitch, we look leggy. Only 2 shots for us so far. Hinds off injured in the first half also.

    Casey their CB and McKinstry their winger also look like good youth prospects for them.
  2. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    5-0 down after 59 mins, not a good day for the under 23's!
  3. Smudger

    Smudger Messi's Mad Coach Staff Member

    Six now. Shows the step up required from developmental football to full professional football.
  4. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    Hugely impressive from Leeds. Pace, power, good movement off the ball, technically good and even in defence, forever on the front foot.

    Most u23 games I've seen are ponderous affairs with only short periods of what Leeds offer over 90 minutes.

    They also play with a mentality that will get individuals knocking on their 1st XI door, a door that's open to them.
  5. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Worryingly only a few of the Leeds lads were more experienced pros.
  6. RMT79

    RMT79 Academy Graduate

    Good idea using the U23 matches do player fitness ... who’d of thought it ?

    Hopefully QSF will use those games for the likes of Welbeck more than Javi did
    Burnsy likes this.
  7. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Im aware that Leeds have a larger fanbase than us, but if a Championship club are able to stream all their home youth games live on youtube then couldn't we as well?

    (Though not that I'd watch too many of them if they kept performing like last night)
  8. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    Last season there was a Watford article which said once a player reached 1000 minutes (I think) of physical work, be it through games or training, then that players workload was tailored to keep him at optimum fitness with as little chance of injury (strains, pulls etc.) as possible. It was said a player was more susceptible to injury after that initial time period.
    It was pointed out players not involved in, say, a game on Saturday would train more minutes at the beginning of the week than those that did play.

    That should mean each players fitness is comparable whether they're in or out of the side, not taking into account injuries.

    Obviously match sharpness is a different matter if the players or the coaching staff aren't able to push training enough to replicate match intensity etc.

    Also, by putting 1st XI players in the u23 side too often there is the chance of upsetting the pre-planned development match time of the u23/u18 players.
    That's not to say the u23s shouldn't be used to help the 1st team but there is a balance to be had.

    Just to finish off, both Prodl & Zeegelaar have both played in the u23s this season so it's not like the club aren't using it in particular situations.
  9. RMT79

    RMT79 Academy Graduate

    Many good points made The Recluse - I hadn’t seen the article around player fitness.

    However I can’t believe we can’t use the u23 matches more to give players at least try and get 45mins of match sharpness.

    Your right Prodl and Zeegelaar did play in the u23s but under Javi they were nowhere near the first team
  10. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    Not long got in and seen your reply so I've had a little think about what I see when I watch the u23s.
    In the main the games are quite slow. They're competitive but nowhere near the speed of the first team or how Leeds played the other night in the u23 fixture. At times they seem like glorified training sessions, so I'm not sure how much match sharpness could really be gained by playing in them.

    Yes for someone coming back from a long term injury, like Chalobah last season for instance, but I think behind closed door friendlies may be more beneficial without competition rules to follow, possibly a better mix of first team pro's & youngsters on both sides and a little leniency with substitutions and cautions.
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2019
  11. reids

    reids Squad Player

    I know for a fact (aka from someone at the club) that we want the youth games to be there for the youth players - we're trying to attract young talent to the club and to do that we need to show that we give game-time (even at youth level) to young players. Imagine if we're trying to tempt a young LB to the club, he sees Zeegelaar (despite being **** he's got a decent footballing CV), playing for the U23s with Masina + Holebas in front. Do we as a club then look attractive? Or does he see the blocked pathway and reconsider? Now what about if instead of Zeegelaar we have another 18 year old at left-back there instead? Suddenly the youngster will see that as a challenge - "I reckon I can get ahead of him".

    The same as results. Youth football isn't supposed to be about the results - but it is. What young player is going to want to join a team that's bottom of the youth league getting smashed each week? Winning breeds competitiveness and confidence in the squad which brings drive and a willingness to improve. Which will look attractive (especially combined with my first point) for any youth player we might be trying to entice.
  12. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    What happened to the B team idea or was that scrapped when Andy Scott left?
  13. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

  14. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

  15. tonycotonstache

    tonycotonstache Reservist

    Well our first teamers obviously took inspiration from this. Taking 40 minutes less time to do it too. Impressive.
  16. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Lets hope they can bounce back like the Under 23s...
    Sahorn likes this.
  17. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    True, though the under-23s were able to call on Zeegelaar for their second match, and for whatever reason he seems to have been frozen out of the first team, despite his obvious quality.
    wfc4ever likes this.
  18. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    Spoken like a true Watford fan ..
    That’s the spirit ..

    (And I post this without a hint of irony, we can bounce back at Wolves..)
    wfc4ever likes this.
  19. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Goals galore for our youth teams .

    A 3-3 and 5-5 draw yesterday!
  20. Davidmsawyer

    Davidmsawyer Statto Statto Statto

    Our youth teams used to get spanked week in week out, but seem to be doing better now. Do we have a better selection of players now or better coaching? I preferred it when our youth teams get spanked and our first team didn’t, but I guess you can’t have everything.
  21. goldpapaya

    goldpapaya Academy Graduate

    any chance any of them ever getting into the first team? just wondered.
  22. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Well the Under 23s is a whole new team basically!

    Youth team have got a new manager again - the defence seems to be well organised but then we did give away 3 goals yesterday! (wasn't at game..)

    It interesting Brighton played a young Irish striker and he got 2 goals - our young Irish striker wants out,,,

    Maybe due to his head being turned....or just wants to play games?

    Quina and the Dele bloke aren't in the squad so cannot see anyone getting games.

    Even Sarr who we paid 30 million for doesn't get many chances.
    Davidmsawyer likes this.
  23. carboy98

    carboy98 First Year Pro

    I understand that in a backs to the wall situation like we find ourselves in now, it may not be the right time to throw these younger players in (I do think Quina should be involved, though).

    What I've found frustrating over the last few seasons though, is that even in more relaxed times - ie end of seasons when we're safe and basically phoning it in - we've hardly used our 'prospects'. Would it have really hurt us to give them fifteen minutes here and there?
  24. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    What was the 5-5 game? Can't see any details.
  25. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Under 16s I guess .
  26. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

  27. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

  28. luke_golden

    luke_golden Space Cadet

    May be wiser to pick on whoever is expected to be the top scorer in the Championship next year. Wrecking a rival might be more helpful to our cause.
  29. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    The official site seems a little preoccupied to give news of the u23/u18 sides this weekend, which is a shame as they've both won again.

    The u18s won 3-1 at home versus Millwall but, as of yet, there are no line-ups or named scorers that I can find anywhere. (Not that I've looked too hard!)

    The u18 table AFTER Saturdays win.
    SCREENSHOT 2019-10-14 AT 16.06.48.jpeg


    The u23s won 2-0 away at Crystal Palace this afternoon with goals from Henry Wise and a Sam Dalby penalty.
    One thing I've noticed with the u23s this season is how settled the side is with a healthy core playing the majority of games.

    The u23 table BEFORE todays win.
    SCREENSHOT 2019-10-14 AT 16.10.53.jpeg
  30. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Good job they are getting used to winning - might need some next season .
  31. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    The Recluse likes this.
  32. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Are the youth teams both in the second divisions of whatever youth leagues they're in, and if so if they won the league would they get promoted?
  33. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    The top divisions are for the Cat 1 academy clubs, so I don't believe we can go any higher.
    The Recluse likes this.
  34. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    It looks like there are two Premier League 2 divisions (cat. 1 academies) and there is promotion & relegation between them. Clubs in these divisions also play in the Premier League Cup, Premier League International Cup and the EFL Trophy. All but the EFL Trophy (u21s only) are for u23 players.

    Watford are in the Professional Development League (cat. 2 academies) and this is split in to two regional leagues but the fixtures are inter-divisional. There is no promotion or relegation between the two (North and South) leagues. This is also an u23 competition.

    The u18 set up is slightly different.
    For cat. 1 academies there is the u18 Premier Division. This is split into two regional divisions with the two league winners playing-off to be named champions and qualifying for the UEFA Youth League.

    For cat. 2 academies there is the u18 Professional Development League. Again split into two regional divisions (North and South, Watford play in the South) with the overall champions coming from an end of season play-off series.
    EB Hornet likes this.
  35. The Recluse

    The Recluse Academy Graduate

    Not good news for three of the young players.

    Dan Phillips (18, central midfielder) has had ankle surgery.
    Currently on loan at Hemel Hempstead, the future 1st teamer will be out until the end of January.
    His loan was supposed to finish on December 31 2019 so presumably it has been cancelled.

    Kane Crichlow (19, attacking midfielder/forward) has a lower leg fracture.
    He's halfway through a 12 week lay-off following a training ground injury.

    George Langston (16, right back/centre back) has had knee surgery.
    He faces an unspecified but lengthy lay-off.

    I'll add it here although it's not as serious;
    Michael Folivi (21, centre forward) has a back injury and is currently out of action.
    He's on loan at Wimbledon until the end of the season.
    wfc4ever likes this.

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