Yeah and where did that get us? Nearly into admin and no longer existing. I don't understand what anyone's problem is, criticising and not supporting are not mutually exclusive. There's nothing wrong with criticising a player when he's clearly not played well. It's life, I for one thought he was bloody awful, I didn't boo him, I wouldn't clap his substitution but I'll come on here and vent without being judged because it's what we do and what the forum is for. Nobody is doubting his commitment but he played fecking shyt, get over it.
I was probably one of Amrabats few supporters on here post his early season form (much like I was one of Nyoms few big supporters the previous year). However even I eventually succumbed to the fact at the very end of last season that he wasnt good enough to be part of the first 11. Was hoping that maybe Silva had seen something extra or been working on the bats game to improve it sufficiently enough to keep him in the srarting lineup. Yet to see that. Again too intent on fouling his player while trying to toll him, poor crossing and slow release play (though there was an improvement that he was moving the ball slightly quicker). Maybe give him a couple more games before passing full judgement, but either way I see no reason to get rid as he can do a really good job as a back up utility. I'd actually really like to see Fermenia pushed up into the advanced roll.
The 2nd striker is offside if ahead of the 1st striker passing the ball Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Can anyone really imagine Liverpool fans beating themselves up over whether a goal they scored was offside or not? No, me neither. Being mere humans, refs make loads of offside decisions every weekend, and some of them end up as goals. Does it really matter? If it's any consolation to those insisting it was offside, there's a huge chance that Liverpool will score at least one offside goal this season. And Klopp won't mind in the least.
Yes, and it was refreshing to see a coach getting animated on the touchline on Saturday. For the last couple of seasons, apart from the odd loss of temper, our two coaches have stood there like they are watching a coffin being lowered into the ground.
I have very critical of Amrabat of late as his quality and end product are somewhat lacking. But he put in a good shift on Saturday and was a complete physical nuisance in the first half. For this he needs recognition. Also he appears to follow his manager's instructions, whether it's QSF. Walter or Marco. He might still make the 25 cut, something I did not think possible a few days ago.
Watched at home on Sat and loved every minute of it, it feels like we’ve been deprived so long of any sort of excitement and the fact last season when we it was levelled first time, second time and when they finally took the lead our heads would have dropped and I doubt we’d have got anything from the game so it was so good to see us keep going. You can already see the positive influence Silva has had and players talking about him so highly is so refreshing. Gomes & defence were OK, made erros but it’s easy to forget how good and how quick those front 3 are so I won’t judge too much on that match to be honest. Their first goal especially was absolute quality. Midfield was good, thought Doucoure and Chalobah were excellent and I think Chalobah will only get better and better. We could have the makings of an excellent central midfield pairing there and so young too. Pereyra is a class apart he really is and it will be devastating if he’s out for any length of time again. Cleverley was good and busy, created the goal, one of his better games for us and I think he could be really important for us this year with his experience with so many youngsters around him in midfield now. Amrabat the effort is there and I want it to come off for him I really do but he is so frustrating, if he stays a decent squad player and he can do a job but I think he needs a fresh start really, I just don’t know if I can watch him back in to and wrestle a defender then look upset when he gives a foul away anymore. Okaka was brilliant, it’s such a shame he can’t seem to keep going the full 90 because when he’s at it defences don’t know how to or cannot deal with him, really pleased he got his goal and hopefully that gives him a massive confidence booster for the season. He’s a brilliant option to have, he’s not going to play every game and he’ll probably look woeful at times but games like that he gives so much. Very worries about the muscle injuries again, I am a massive Janmaat fan but he’s becoming too much of a risk. When he is fit we are reduced to 2 subs of choice almost every game. He offers so much and one of our most influential players when fit I think but something is seriously not right there. Thought Ferminia did well, seemed nervy at first understandably but really grew in to it and overlapped a good few times. Cannot remember what his delivery was like so something to keep an eye on. Gray looked lively and you can see what he brings already, there were 1 or 2 moments when my heart skipped a bit because he looked so close to getting through on goal. Loved the look of Richarlison and so happy to see him thrown straight in rather than us keeping him back for months like we have in the past. He looks exciting and he doesn’t look lightweight at all which is a good thing and not afraid to stick his head in where it hurts. Klopp can’t really complain and 3rd may have been marginally off but there were so many bodies in the way and it happened so quickly it would have been such a tough call and to be fair Carra and Redknapp on Sky even said the same with their Liverpool specs on. Really enjoyable game and a fair result in the end, really excited for the season and for us to play again which feels like it’s been a while!
Mt thoughts on the match Doucoure. Scintillating performance. POTS seems certain. Holebas close behind for me. Handled that scouse **** very well I thought, who is a pretty good player and was effective going forward. Shame he's getting old. Pereyra would have pushed doucoure but for injury. He's the best player ever to play for watford. Chalobah was ok, needs more time before I will make a full judgement. Outclassed by doucoure. Cleverley...........he will divide fans this season. Works hard but is ultimately limited. Simple watford fans will love him, but those of us with a bit of a more refined understanding of the game will see him for what he is: abitshit. He's heading towards my boo list. Gomes. Lovely man, great servant but too old and too error prone. We cant afford these errors: get rid. Okaka must keen his place ahead of deeney. Deeney is incapable of putting in a performance like okaka did. He was immense at times. Imagine playing against him (I know a lot of you have never kicked a ball before, but try and imagine) Richarlison had a decent debut and worked really hard. Seemed brave too. I am certainly glad we have him rather than niang. Didnt see much evidence of the goal hogger tag, must just be bitter fluminese fans spouting nonsense, or that tim vickery whopper getting things wrong again. Gray. No opinion on him yet, but the ex-luton thing means he needs to work extra hard to impress me, otherwise it's on to the boo list he goes. He's got until the end of the brighton match to score. Amrabat. Total ****. And had the nerve to make critical gestures to his team mates a coupe of times! I booed so loud I nearly brought up a lung. B-b-b-b-but he runs around a lot! **** that. He offers nothing whatsoever. How garbage like his gets a game while a rolls royce like success isnt even on the bench is sickening. Why no hughes, and more importantly, will success ever play for us again?? Everyone else did ok. I dont think britos deserves quite as much criticism as he's had in this thread edit: oh yeah, forgot about janmaat. I was gutted when he went down. He is excellent and started the game well. Ferminia was ok, needs more time, but janmaat looks the better player on the very early evidence.
how does your view settle anything? As a former ref (in my day the phases of play thing was not a factor i accept) the basic rule is simple, if any part of the player is ahead of the ball = offside - based on the shot i would say level to left foot - Refs and linos can find it hard to see that of course so a normal interpretation for marginal ones if it is clearer is that if any part of the player is behind the ball = onside because it is hard to be both behind and infront of the ball at the same time - loads of Britos is behind the ball - a far less marginal call - my judgement is that 99 out of 100 linos level with play would say onside However - the ball came to him via a small Matip deflection from Charlies shot/pass - now some might say that to play someone onside you have to deliberately do so - bollox to that in a 6 yard box situation because a player is always trying to play the ball - if it flicks off a defender then onside everytime
> relegation certs Rolls Royce like Success? On what are you basing this ludicrous automotive analogy? One game against Man U?
I don't think it was clear cut for the ref or linesman It hinges on if you think Britos was interfering with their goalkeeper at the time Richarlison shot - I don't think he did, it's a corner pinging around the box and since when do goalkeepers get special rights not to be impeded during a corner? Their goalkeeper touched the ball before Britos so that phase should be ignored if you want to be pedantic Not offside for me although I can see why it might have been flagged If a goal like that had been scored against us I'd be more mad about the truly pathetic defending but once against clueless Klopp gives his defenders a free pass
I hope you're not as premature with your missus as you are with your statements. Best player ever to play for Watford. I would love to hear how you have come to that conclusion? Maybe it's the simple fan who can't see the benefits of Tom. Involved all over the pitch, put an excellent ball into the box for the second goal. Winning tackles, keeping the ball moving. Hey but what do I know. So we're you on the back of Sir Alec and Matty Spring. Big deal he played for loo town. Grow up. A quality striker who gives up different options up top. Wow don't you want to see Watford progress?
Agree with this. Criticising a player for a clear lack of quality on an internet forum and not supporting them on the pitch are completely different things. Anybody who does boo/heckle Amrabat is a complete ****. While he's on the pitch I'd love nothing more than to see him perform, however when he consistently underwhelms and dissappoints we have a right to point it out. He had a passing accuracy of 48%, made 6 fouls and completed 1 dribble. That's unbeliavable poor for a winger.
I came to that conclusion using my own eyes. We are now better than cleverley. I have nothing against the lad and he's a good squad player, but our first eleven has moved on from the likes of him now. Chamberlain proved himself over many games. Hopefully gray does the same. He's got until the end of the brighton match. I'm being very fair considering his odious background.
We're better than a player with 28 appearances and 4 goals in a PL winning season? I doubt anyone thinks Cleverly should be first choice in that #10/AM role, but he's a very decent DM perfectly good enough for us and more besides
So you think he should be in our first eleven, if we have no injuries? Who do you drop? Doucoure? Chalobah? Decent squad player, that's it.
Cleverley is a work horse and gets the job done, but he is not a flair player and will always be outshone by Pereyra, Doucoure and Chalobah, as a result any mistakes Cleverley makes will be pounced on by one or two fans whereas mistakes by the others I listed would get overlooked simply because they did something classy 5 minutes earlier. Cleverley is a good player and the midfield engine.
I assume this is tongue in cheek? You can't possibly think we're too good for Cleverley. And you can't possibly think Success is the answer yet. He needs a lot of work done on him, the fact that we played a kid from Brazil who can't speak the language and had only trained for a few days while Success couldn't even get in the squad speaks volumes.
You can't possibly think cleverley should be in our first eleven? Good squad player, but our first eleven is better than he is.
I do think he should be in or around our first 11. The defensive work he puts in is invaluable (his work rate allows him to cover that of two men), and he provides creativity (even if it is intermittent) when he has the ball. He's the kind of player that makes more attacking tactics possible. I'd start with him and then bring on a past attacking winger if we need a goal/ when he starts to tire. Reminds me quite a bit of his ex teammate Ji Sung Park.
where would you play him though? You'd have to break up the chalobah/doucoure axis of aceness to accommodate him.
Amrabat was (is) crap and thought Gomes and Femenia had poor games too. Femenia at fault for Salah's goal. Doucoure was brilliant (although didn't track Mane for his goal) and Chalobah looked promising too. Was also happy with Kaboul and Britos' performance and Okaka was very good. Hopefully see Richarlison start next week but badly need someone to play instead of Amrabat. Sent from my G3311 using Tapatalk
Cleverley was played where he was on Saturday for tactics. He took Henderson out of the game (who incidentally had the worst pass completion % of the Liverpool midfield) and got an assist and generally ran his socks off. An excellent performance.
Is Cleverly the new Mahon? midfield workhorse who is accused of not contributing but as soon as he's out of the team we lose? He fulfils a vital role that is never going to get any attention.
On what planet is an entire season played by the same 11 players? Fitness, injuries etc means rotation. Because it's a WC year there are a lot of games packed in. Cleverly is a perfectly decent DM more than good enough for our squad and more than good enough should Silva decide he wants him to start in one of the DM positions, or should it be needed tactically in the AM position. Yes personally I prefer Doucoure or Chalobah but that is irrelevant, Cleverley will play 20+ games for us this season and yes I'm perfectly happy with that.
Due to a few stubborn fans claiming the 3rd goal was offside I sent the evidence away for forensic examination and the result is in: He was onside. The reason is that the camera shot is from the one positioned level with the goal line. Apparently if you run a laser beam directly from the camera, through the ball and on into the penalty area, there is a 15.8 degree refraction to Britos. Therefore from the photo we have seen he looks level or marginal either way, when in actual fact, when the angle of camera shot is taken into consideration he is well onside and behind the line of the ball. Secondly the ball was then deflected backwards towards the goal by two Liverpool players (one being the goalie) rendering the first argument pointless anyway as the deflections plays Britos onside. **end of** ))
So me and you are playing up front, we're in the opposition half no defenders between us, your further up the pitch and I can pass to you and your not off side ? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Well you must be a he'll of a lot younger than I. Bisset, Barnes, Callaghan to name a few. Plus all those before my time. I've not even added the legend that is Ian Bolton. Lol @ fair. So you would give someone longer if they hadn't played up the road? You're a total buffoon. I like most of the others believe Tom as a vital member of our team. He will only get better under Silva and am pleased to see him start. A solid midfielder who works all day long. Will he get the recognition, I hope so and by the look of it, he is.
I'll clarify:; it's the player's position in relation to the BALL that determines on or offside, not the other player. It's not pedantic, with the ball in the same place had Richarlison shot with his left he'd probably have been ahead of or level with Britos but it still wouldn't have put Britos onside.
I must admit that Pereyra has the potential to be a top player for us. Dare I say the best, but has a very, very long way to go.
You seem unable to put your emotions to one side and look at things rationally. That, and your hasty use of personal insults, is the the sign of a very weak, limited mind and makes conversing with you very frustrating. So I think I'll just leave it.
Some of your derogatory quips about other fans not appreciating the nuances of the game like you do suggest you have played at a high level. Many of your ill informed opinions however, suggest that this is very much not the case.
