The Second Coming Of Quique Sanchez Flores

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Manatleisure, Sep 7, 2019.

  1. pleaseenterthenamebywh

    pleaseenterthenamebywh Academy Graduate

    Shocked at first but I think it is a very good move bringing QSF back. We were a club in a period of drastic transition the last time he was here, and in all fairness to Quique he did a very good job. 13th place was a great accomplishment and Quique had every right to feel disillusioned by the end of his reign at the lack of appreciation that was shown towards what the team achieved. A season of consistent football is very difficult at this level, especially for a newly promoted team. "defensive football" "hoofball" is all nonsense, you can't expect fireworks from a mediocre squad.

    I think QSF is the best manager Watford have had since Taylor and it's a clever move going back to him. Bringing in another unheard of foreigner after having that exact coach in Javi would have been a very uninspiring and risky move. Now the club has settled down in the Premier League and we have a squad of real quality, Quique has the ability to take us far.

    The key thing that will determine whether this is going to work or not is are the board and QSF on the same page? Both parties must have learned plenty since then, and if they have total understanding about what the aim is for the club we should end up being very successful.
    foxywfc likes this.
  2. Moosegasm

    Moosegasm First Year Pro

    Scary fact: in our last 20 league games we've scored more than once 4 times. 3 of those teams are now in the championship.
  3. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    Neither have I.
    Burnsy likes this.
  4. Cassetti's Beard

    Cassetti's Beard First Team

    Was his English always that good?

    For some reason I think we'll be seeing the return of Prodl
  5. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    That team was pretty decent. Gomes was in his prime, Cathcart was better than he is now, Britos was excellent in his first season, Ake was brilliant (and still is), Capoue is still with us, Ighalo was playing like one of the best strikers in Europe at the time, and Deeney was better than he is now. To be fair we didn't have a lot on the bench, but that first choice is similar to what we have now. In fact better in some areas.

    Is Kiko, Dawson, Cathcart, Holebas better than Nyom, Cathcart, Britos, Ake? I'd we're weaker now than we were back then with those four.

    Abdi, Watson, Capoue, Jurado. Compare to now. Hughes, Doucoure, Capoue, Pereyra. We are clearly stronger now.

    Deeney, Ighalo and now Deeney, Deulofeu. I'd have to say the way Deeney and Ighalo were playing back in late 2015 is better than Deeney and Deulofeu are playing now.

    Gomes then and Foster now, I'd say there's nothing to choose between them.

    Flores has a much better depth to choose from now, and we've got the unknown star quality in Sarr and Welbeck waiting to shine. But first choice defence is worse and the attacking third is largely unknown but has potential. Midfield is vastly superior now which has to be used to maximum effect.
  6. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    As far as it goes for me, I just want to see the defence tightened up and believe QSF can do that. If that means all defenders start with a fresh slate, then so be it.

    Might draw the line at Zeegelaar though...
  7. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    Yep, that's the best thing about this appointment. All the defenders will be scrutinised closely this week and all given an equal change.

    And I've got a sneaking suspicion that kabasele is going to become an absolute superstar after a few months being nursed at Quique's teat.
    W4BS likes this.
  8. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Interesting that our dip in form has also coincided with the club's growing insistence on plastering videos all over social media.
    Cassetti's Beard likes this.
  9. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    You could tell he was narked off about having the camera crew in his grill for his first minutes back at the club.
  10. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    I'm just amazed that Smudger managed to break in and get that iphone footage without being stopped. Capoue didn't seem pleased to see QSF....
  11. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player


    Are you assuming that from the bit where he's laughing to himself while stepping out for training.

    My favourite part of that vid is the quote from the cameraman while he's trying to take a photo of Quique and his team: "look like you're enjoying it".
  12. Happy bunny

    Happy bunny Cheered up a bit

    If we were choosing our Head Coach on the basis of looks, I'd rather we had gone for someone like Luton's Stacey Dooley.
    Maninblack and CleyHorn like this.
  13. Happy bunny

    Happy bunny Cheered up a bit

    Nor me. I want her to stay.
  14. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    I think that was the big selling point for bringing QSF sort out the defence. I have massive sympathy for Gracia, but he does have to carry some of the blame for his dismissal. Having said that, he has been badly let down by the lack of investment in defence plus the players have not shown anywhere near the level of desire as they did at the start of last season.

    Last season it was clear. Everyone was united and singing from the same page. Gracia won the Manager of the Month award and you could see the warmth the players had for him, but as always with Watford, after a good 9 months it all goes stale. The board need to get to grips with why this happens as we cannot keep sacking and hiring managers every 9 months or so. It's just crazy. A bad run usually turns into a terminal one. There must be a reason for it.

    Gracia is a good coach, he proved it right up until the FA Cup semi final. So why did this decline occur, out of the blue, AGAIN?

    Now, QSF has come back, after he himself presided over another specular collapse in form, picking up just 16 points from the last 20 matches, winning just 4 of them. Before that collapse Flores could consider himself a very good coach. He had Watford in 7th place at Christmas. He won the Europa League with Atletico. His stock must have been high, but it's been pretty much downhill for him since then. He had the disastrous tail-off with us, and something similar occurred to him at Espanyol. He won only 2 of his final 15 matches, losing 4 of his last 5. It is a similar story for him.

    I'm not convinced he's the right man, I must admit. As with a new coach there's usually an upturn in form, but look at our next 5 matches. Arsenal (h ), Man City (a ), Wolves (a ), Sheff Utd (h ) and Spurs (a ). It's horrendous. With the best will in the world, how the hell are we going to pick up points from that lot? He could easily lose 4 of the first 5 matches. Sheff Utd is the one I think everyone will be looking at, but even then, they've started well. If doesn't win that, and loses the rest, he could be fired after the Spurs game.....which would really make us a basket case club.

    It all has the smacks of desparation. Clearly it's all gone wrong, or else they would have kept faith in Gracia. They've brought in a sticking plaster coach, who may or may not be successful. The board have always been successful in the past, but I'm not so sure it will work out for them this time around.

    Fans have been calling out for defensive reinforcements for at least the last 3 transfer windows, and nothing has been done about it. "The club knows best". Of course, their decisions have always been justified previously, and may well prove to be the case again this time, but even they must admit, just bringing in Craig Dawson from the Championship was nowhere near enough. Which makes me question their wisdom now. If they are so far out with their analysis of the teams ability, then surely it's right to question what they are doing right now?

    The entire summer has been strange. Like we almost have a different owner. We do nothing in the transfer window, then spend a massive amount of money on a winger, who is far from the finished article. Welbeck was a great signing, and so would have Rose been, but that in itself is strange. We're going for big name players, which is not something we've really done before. The friendlies were strange too. Three high profile fixtures, Ajax, Bayer Leverkusen and Real Sociedad. The only "normal" fixture was QPR. We didn't have enough games, but elected to go for prestige over quantity. We weren't ready for the Brighton match, and Gracia plus the club have to take the blame for that.

    We did well to stay up in our first season, and you have to give Flores credit for that. But when he came in, his stock as a coach was very high, and players believing he walked on water. I remember Deeney saying something like the players were in awe and listened intently to every word he spoke, when he first arrived. I'm not so sure the reception will be quite the same this time. It's that initial belief in him which gave us that platform to do well, but once that faded away, we just fell off a cliff.

    The other season, when I felt we dodged a massive bullet was under Mazarri. How we survived that season was good luck more than anything. It was down to the failing of others below us. I remember we beat Hull City with a Michael Dawson own goal, in a match where we had zero shots on target. Hull were the better team on the day, and had they actually won that, they'd have finished on 37 points along with us. That match proved to be the pivotal one and a "real" 6 pointer. Fine lines indeed.

    The way this season is shaping, I think it could be our biggest challenge yet to stay up. If we achieve it, with flying colours, then brilliant, my concerns will be proved to be unfounded. But the alarm bells are loud right now.
  15. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    I’ve already asked her to grow her beard back.
    Supertommymooney likes this.
  16. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    How many of that starting eleven would get in the current first eleven. Deeney, Capoue, Ake and Cathcart. I would say we have improve a heck of a lot since he was last here
  17. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    I still look at Ake as the one who got away. Wasn't part of the reason he wasn't interested in coming back was because we didn't want to play him at CB?
  18. Guy

    Guy Squad Player

    Didn't seem to be many happy faces on the video footage ... Still not convinced about this appointment
    Bwood_Horn likes this.
  19. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    I've warned that her current disappointing run of performances has to end or she will be replaced. She needs to rediscover some of her earlier form, and quickly.
    Burnsy likes this.
  20. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Any chance that's because QSF has a reputation as more of a disciplinarian than Javi? No idea if that's actually the case, just speculating.
  21. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    I thought the issue supposedly last time was that discipline was lax. The Pozzos turned a blind eye while results were good but it became an issue when results turned.
  22. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Then maybe he's just less fun/more dull/more serious than Javi?
  23. Bwood_Horn

    Bwood_Horn Squad Player

  24. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    The beginning where they all get out of the van is like a post health and safety version of the A-team, where instead of BA, Hannibal, Murdock and Face jumping out of the back of a van and spraying bad guys with AK fire, a bunch of grey haired spaniards carefully disembark and then go and remove their luggage from the boot.

    I can't wait for Sunday!
  25. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    W4BS, Arakel, Burnsy and 1 other person like this.
  26. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Take age out of the equation - 2015 Britos and Ighalo would get in our side. Admittedly the latter is based on form, rather than age, but at that point he was one of the hottest strikers in the league, if not the continent.
  27. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    I know you couldn’t stand him but the reality is Mazzarri had 40 points and secured safety with 6 games to spare. Granted he went into a tailspin after that and I wasn’t sad to see him go but the job was done comfortably.
  28. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    Mazzarri also had to deal with the worst injury crisis we'd had in years.

    People conveniently forget that because they are still upset he didnt used to wave at them after the match.
  29. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    Mazzarri maybe a good coach, but he was a poor fit at Watford. Without being able to speak English well enough, it was never going to work. The constant show of disapproval during games towards his players and all the excuse making really didn't go down too well either. The players never liked him. Deeney had a big fall out.

    We survived that season....just. One place above the drop zone. Had any of those below us put in a run of form, we'd not have been able to do anything about it ourselves as we were completely shot by the end.
  30. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth Squad Player

    I'm still not 100% sure we are safe.
  31. Squibba

    Squibba Predictor Choker 14/15

    The world-renowned and revered #PozzoScoutingNetwork didn't want to pay an extortionate £20 million for a defender who had hit his ceiling in transfer value despite his value tripling in just as many years lol. But don't worry they found Alexis Sanchez.
    CleyHorn, scummybear, Burnsy and 2 others like this.
  32. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    Dull?! Pah!

    He’s just smouldering. Exquisitely too.
  33. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    I get possibly Britos but Ighalo is a difficult one because as you say, he was one of the hottest strikers around for a few months and then he couldn't hit a barn door with a handful of gravel. Clearly he gets in for the first half of that season but not the second half
  34. Oh come on, Iggy wouldn’t get in ahead of an injury free fit up to speed Welbeck
  35. a19tgg

    a19tgg Reservist

    You can make a case for the defence being better but that is it. Ben Watson? Jurado? They are truly players. Back then Capoue was also extremely lazy.
    Chumlax likes this.

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