The Elephant in the Rookery

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by GoingDown, Aug 15, 2019.


Who wins?

  1. Millennials

    7 vote(s)
  2. The Dads

    13 vote(s)
  3. NathWFC

    12 vote(s)
  1. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    The much vaunted 1881 move seemingly went well.

    Leventhal reported in his new publication that a normie fan with his 'next generation of supporter' 5 year old nephew was verbally abused by a member of the 1881 when asked to sit down in the new section and ended up leaving at half time.

    The 1881 responded by saying the usual whenever they are called out, 'two sides to every story', 'we are used to this', basically washing their hands of the whole affair and blaming the non-1881s.

    What was most interesting about the article was the claim that of the 1,100 members of the 1881 (!), only 50 were able to move due to the evil Watford supporters fighting against a good atmosphere. Leventhal stated that those 50 that moved all felt unsafe in their new seats and moved back to their original seats amongst the 1,050.

    How did they do this? How were there 50 spare seats in the big section of the 1881? Do they all get 2 seats, is this the reason for all the empty ones?

    How long did the club spend on this laughable attempt to move supporters to facilitate the 'fan group'?

    Anyway, a few twitter fights broke out last night with various dads being accused of being '**** supporters' by 17 year olds who have a Watford themed Arsenal Fan TV knock off that gets about 200 views on YouTube. Another group said, '"we're Watford FC, we'll sit if we want'.

    A battle has begun for the fandom of Watford FC. Millennials vs the Dads.

    Pick your side.
  2. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    Hang on...

    Leventhal’s got a new publication? I wish he’d be clearer about that.
  3. Diamond

    Diamond Squad Player

    One day I'll tell you my tale of Wembley in 2019. I can't right now because things are still ongoing with the club but suffice to say we have people in our own fanbase who are happy to threaten people's lives whilst they're standing there with their kids. Whilst scum like this are associated with the club then it's dead to me.

    (I wasn't there Saturday).
  4. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    Whilst it sounds like you had a horrendous day - was it the S/F if I remember correctly? - it’s perhaps a bit harsh to say the club is ‘dead to you’ due to the actions of a minority group of fans?

    But perhaps the club have been less than forward since in helping you with your particular cause. I remember at Wembley, especially in the lower tiers, there were certainly areas where there were more fans than seats - perhaps if you have complained to the club, this is a reason as they are struggling to identify the perpetrators due to the movement of fans?
  5. wfcwarehouse

    wfcwarehouse Strangeland

    Really sorry to hear this Diamond, hope you and the kids are alright.

    Unfortunately, we seem to have a fair few idiots popping up most weeks now.
    domthehornet likes this.
  6. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    We just have an obstinate fan base full stop. People very wedded to their ways and their routines and their individual seats and the people they sit near and their view etc etc. We've had petitions over a jaunty tune, bin bags on Upper GT seats, letters to the WO whenever there's any kind of plan to deal with clear issues.

    It has to be generational. I wasn't around pre-all seater but get the impression in ye olden days people knew which areas of the ground were for which type of fan and went and stood there. A bit for the likely lads, a bit for old geezers, a bit for the kids, the family section, a bit for the silent types? Now people just seem stuck in place like they're glued down. Surely people understand the area in the main home stand behind the goal is supposed to be the atmosphere generator? Instead the lack of movement out of there means the age profile is getting older every year. It’s been pretty sedate for a few years now.

    Having spent the best part of the last decade as a Vicarage Road nomad, sitting mainly in the Rookery but elsewhere too, I don't really get it. Views are good in 90% of the ground, so that regular excuse is out. People just need to accept their time is up and it’s time to shuffle off new horizons elsewhere in the ground.
    J.B, EB Hornet, Derbyhorn and 5 others like this.
  7. Lloyd

    Lloyd Reservist

    I've always thought of the 1881 as being comprised mainly of pi55ed middle aged blokes and kids. I did read somewhere that the 1881 section was being moved from the side to a more central position in the Rookery. Did this happen? I sit roughly in the centre of the Rookery and I'm pleased to say that I was surrounded by the same dribbling, mumbling, goons as usual last Saturday. Perhaps they are already 1881ers? How would I tell?
  8. I read somewhere that there's a pretty intense conflict at Palace between the homsdale fanatics vs the rest of the crowd. Abuse, bullying etc.

    Seems like this is developing into a similar situation.
  9. Cthulhu

    Cthulhu Keyboard Warrior Staff Member

    You dont get a seat for life.
    Try some variety.
    Im no fan of the 1881 per se but stuck in that corner they cant make enough noise and atmosphere.
    Need to be in the middle of that main stand.
    People have to move. It isnt their seat. The seat belongs to the club like seat a at the theatre belongs to the theatre. You can have season ticket for years, but guess what, it isnt your seat. The club should designate 1500 1881 seats in the centre and tell those their that they can stay and be part of the 1881 or get first pick elsewhere.
    I know thatll upset some people, tough.
    And the 1881 need to stick to the same code of practice and bahvaiour as anyone else. Any abuse and they are out
  10. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    If they are furiously gluing carrier bags to sticks to call ‘flags’ and talking about ‘the craic they had in the bunker pre-game’ - they are the 1881.
    Lloyd likes this.
  11. miked2006

    miked2006 Premiership Prediction League Proprietor

    Naughty Nige's core demographic.
    wfcmoog likes this.
  12. lowerrous

    lowerrous Squad Player

    Millenials are born between 1981 and 1996; current 17 year-olds aren't Millenials (the most commonly used term for the most recent generation, born after Millenials, is Generation Z).
    a19tgg, lm_wfc, kVA and 1 other person like this.
  13. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    Genuinely learn something new everyday.
  14. Mazzereth

    Mazzereth Academy Graduate

    I'm going the game against West Ham. I will be in RS 5 (where I sat for the games I attended last season). I'm unsure if I should be standing, sitting, singing, not singing, being happy, being angry, laughing or crying?
  15. Bwood_Horn

    Bwood_Horn Squad Player

    My son and I use the family stand or the sensory room.
  16. WillisWasTheWorst

    WillisWasTheWorst Reservist

    I started sitting at football when we were effectively forced to in the top two divisions in the early 90s. In those days of lower crowds you could sit in the Vicarage Road end where you liked with friends who were not ST holders, provided you got there early enough. When the Rookery became the home end in '99 the demand for Premier League tickets meant that the free seating policy was gone forever, so we were invited to go along and physically choose a seat for our new season tickets. Mrs Willis and I still sit in those seats to this day.

    Our seats are not in the centre behind the goal but we would have no problem moving elsewhere in the stand or ground if required. However the vast majority of ST holders surely just renew their tickets year after year and sit in the same seats as a result. Some others will have waited some years so that family and friends could acquire seats around them, but I'm sure very few people would object to moving out of sheer bloody-mindedness. We would only seek to move in the 'seat movement window' if we found ourselves next to someone particularly obnoxious the previous year because it takes a bit of effort. The general lack of movement is down to sheer inertia in my view.

    Although I had heard it mooted that the 1881 might be moving to the centre of the Rookery, I must admit I did not realise it had (partly) happened either before or during Saturday's match.
  17. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    I'm not part of the 1881 but I certainly admire their efforts and have assisted with the flags in occasion. I visited the bunker pre-match for the first time on Saturday having only been there post-match previously.

    Things have moved on. They now have a proper alcohol licence as opposed to running a 'the club turning a blind eye' operation previously. This progress has resulted in two very decent draught beers being available plus optics etc. But at £3.50 a pint as opposed to £2 for a can previously. Still £1 cheaper than the Lion though and even more in comparison to 'in stadium' prices. All profits go to a good cause of course. Excellent atmosphere.

    I thought the 'atmosphere' generated in the Rookery on Saturday was the worst I can remember since we re-joined the Prem. though. Obviously the match itself didn't help but neither did splitting the 1881 effort.

    If there's an elephant in the Rookery then requiring it to move should immediately release loads of seats all in the same place.
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2019
    CaveManHornet and RookeryDad like this.
  18. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Be prepared to cry.
    Mazzereth likes this.
  19. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Will it Gen AA next?
  20. goldpapaya

    goldpapaya Academy Graduate

    This is about standing. If people in the middle of the Rookery are allowed to stand all match, then all the people to either side will have to stand as well - else they won't be able to see. I don't think the majority of the people in the Rookery want to stand all match. If the Club want to have a standing area, then put it in an area that won't affect others i.e. at the sides of the stand i.e. leave it where the 1881 already are. If the demand for standing out grows the current 1881 area then look to give then the other end of the Rookery as well, always starting from the back to affect the least number of people. IF the demand is great enough then eventually the areas will expand and lo and behold the Rookery will through time become the all singing, standing and dancing area that the younger generation seem to want. If the club want to achieve this then they will have to start offering better incentives than temporarily suspending the fee for changing seats. Another issue of course is where do the non-standers move to? Perhaps the family stand area could be reduced in size?
  21. Harrow Orn

    Harrow Orn Squad Player

    This is why I rarely do home games now. Too many fans stuck in their ways and more worried about a change to their matchday routine, rather than doing what's best for the club and allowing the atmosphere to get better. No place for abuse, but there is no chance of compromise when it comes to a section of our fanbase, and that is why the 1881 will always be stuck in the corner. Its time to move the family stand out of the vic rd end, and stick the 1881 and like minded fans in there. Will make for a far better atmosphere.
  22. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    Yet Z-Cars had to be brought back as it's 'traditional'.
  23. Lloyd

    Lloyd Reservist

    Isn't the problem with that idea that the Vic Rd end has virtually no bar or catering facilities? I think the 1881 area seemed to be working well as it was at the side of the Rookery. Why not let it spread organically rather than try to force it?
  24. Lloyd

    Lloyd Reservist

    Apologies to you both for any upset caused by my insensitive phrasing. That certainly wasn't my intention. Sorry again
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2019
  25. Timbers

    Timbers Apeman

    The club were not really that bothered getting fans to move. I now sit on my own as my dad is now too old to come and my uncles have moved further north to retire in cheaper housing. I got a call one evening from the ticket office, which I missed and an email, that was it. They were wanting me to contact them to move, I couldn't be bothered to go through the hassle and I would happily be surrounded with more fans signing etc anyway, like it is at all the away games I go to. It was just half-assed by the club, they were not really bothered about getting fans to move. They could have just moved me and send me a new season card, I would have been happy to do it but I am not going to go chase to move and hang on phone lines etc.
    WillisWasTheWorst likes this.
  26. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    This is a tricky area, because season ticket holders in the middle of the rookery were given the option of moving it appears from posts above only a few actually decided to move!, the atmosphere in the centre of the rookery is usually as good as the team is!

    Last Saturday the team didn't turn up after the first 30 minutes so no surprise neither did the supporters! I myself sit in the rookery and have done for the last 15 odd years since I moved on from dead mans row in the old " main stand " when it was deemed unfit!

    We had a few unsavoury supporters behind us who were unable to say sentences without the F and C word that even my 38 year old son said were an embarrassment! If just 50 of the 1881 have moved I am sure they will prefer to go back to their friends in the corner and sing from there!

    I don't have much problem moving, but one of the things about sitting in the same seat is that you get use to like minded people around you, you may not know their names but you all smile and frown together! that takes time to reciprocate!
  27. Carpster

    Carpster Reservist

    Just create a safe standing area for the 1881. I've hated sitting at football for the entire time of all seater stadia. Along with a clubhouse and own entrance. Ginos Italian, he knows the score.
    reids and Cthulhu like this.
  28. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    The Sensory Room is a wonderful facility and an absolute credit to our club.
  29. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    Saw the thread title and thought it was relating to Troy jumping in the crowd after the Leicester goal.
    wfcmoog likes this.
  30. NathWFC

    NathWFC First Team

    The 1881 are as useless as Gracia and the players. Those are my thoughts on the matter.
    wfcmoog and Cassetti's Beard like this.
  31. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    Quelle surprise!
    J.B likes this.
  32. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    Christ it's wearing.
    CaveManHornet and J.B like this.
  33. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    Crossed my mind too.
    Stevohorn likes this.
  34. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    Woz East Stanned m8
    CleyHorn likes this.
  35. Since63

    Since63 Reservist

    If we play as we did vs Brighton, it’ll both of the latter
    Mazzereth likes this.

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