The Championship 2020-21

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Markoa$, Jul 26, 2020.

  1. LondonOrn

    LondonOrn Reservist

    If you mean a very good side by Prem standards instead of their usual 15th-17th place, then it would be an incredible transformation of a side currently six points above the drop zone if all it takes is signing a decent striker, especially for a club that has never finished higher than 13th in the top flight in their history.
     
  2. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Brentford are a point better off, with a better goal difference, and while they have Bournemouth which will be a tough game, you'd fancy Muff to make the play-offs comfortably. Swansea have Reading which might be a 6 pointer. Besides, Brentford aren't playing well but are still picking up points, continue at a point per game (even though they'll probably do better than that) and they'll make the top 6, can Swansea even pick up 7 more points? I wouldn't bank on it
     
  3. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    It’s a matter of opinion - but they look ready to kick on. And from what I’ve seen of them under Potter, they have a number of decent players and play some very nice football. A lot of the time they squander chances up top that lets down the excellent play behind that. Seems to be the thoughts of their fanbase by-and-large and also that of a lot of pundits and analysts - so it’s not a unique opinion.

    You can be labelled a ‘very good side’ without being in the Top 6. If Toney went to them, scored 15 goals and they finished anywhere 8th to 12th, I’d say that makes them a very good side and it’s hardly beyond them.
     
  4. 538 have our chances of 1st at 10%; of 2nd at 74%; and if the 16% chance of playoffs happens, they give us a 16/5 chance of going up as play-off winners, giving our overall promotion odds of 89%.
     
    EB Hornet likes this.
  5. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    How much have you seen of them this season? It's actually comical how much they dominate games only to come away with nothing
     
  6. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Harsh on Sarr, remember he was played up front in a 2 early in the season! Still, he had some good moments even though he wasn't at his brilliant best
     
    wfc4ever likes this.
  7. Carpster

    Carpster Squad Player

    It's going to be interesting how clubs value their players come the next window. Villa have been overspending on players for the last couple of seasons which has put a spanner in the works though. They may value Toney at a similar price to Watkins but who will come in for him at that price I'm not sure. He may even have a clause in his contract nobody knows.
    Personally I'd love him at Watford and I believe he'd score goals in the Premier, he's shown that he can play in our favoured formation right now, but I can't see us lashing out much money at all this Summer.
    Thinking about it I could see West Ham making a bid they're desperate for a striker.
     
  8. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    We absolutely could not play this well under Ivic even if he'd gone all-out attacking, not with the sheer number of players who were missing/not even at the club yet! He got dealt a shoddy hand, one that looks even shoddier in light of Deeney's recent comments, I bet he's pulling his hair out that he never got the chance to manage us in this current set-up! I don't think he's naturally THAT boring, there were a few times when he wanted us to push forward more, only for the players themselves to make the decision to sit back
     
    The Voice of Reason likes this.
  9. VR94

    VR94 Academy Graduate

    And did so without Hughes or Masina. By far the least impressive period of the season was Jan-early Feb when Xisco had both available and still fluffed it.
     
    The Voice of Reason and Burnsy like this.
  10. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Agreed, Swansea was pretty dire, and the three wins in a row weren't any better than the fare we were getting under Ivic. QPR and Coventry were diabolical, only really Wycombe away can compare to that crap. I don't know if we'd have got promoted under Ivic but I am convinced that he's a better manager than Xisco
     
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  11. Malteser2

    Malteser2 First Year Pro

    I remember being so nervous towards the end of our last promotion season, I could barely sleep at times!

    This time everything feels so different.

    We’ve hit form at exactly the right time, which in turn has coincided with our two main rivals for second place both losing it.

    Maybe that’s partly because of the pressure our winning run has put on them. Especially as quite often of late we’ve kicked off first. That will be the case again on Friday. Even a point against Reading means we have a double digit lead over the chasing pack, and that’s a lot to make up especially when they’re out of form anyway.

    I have no doubt in my mind that we will be a Premier League club again next season, and that’s simply stunning considering where we were just a few weeks ago.

    Ivic stabilised us, made us better organised and harder to beat, but lacked the sparkle we all craved. Xisco worried many with his lack of much of a CV (although personally I found some of the criticism of him when he arrived absolutely ridiculous) but he’s proved he has the winning formula, turning a group of decent players into a proper team who look like they’re really enjoying life again. And although our recruitment team made their usual mistakes, they certainly got it right in a few cases and these have made all the difference. The guy we all thought would probably be a dud and 5th choice centre back wins my vote for Player of the Season. He’s been immense. And while Gosling and Sánchez might not pull up many trees, what invaluable experience to come off the bench in tight situations.

    Sometimes as we are all so close and emotionally wrapped up with the team, we don’t see what outsiders are saying. If you do, you won’t see anybody neutral who doesn’t think we are NOT going up. I get texts from friends at other clubs on a daily basis now all saying well done. I read the Brentford feed last night and trust me, they’ve all given up. While some of fans criticise Xisco everytime anything goes slightly wrong, or some of the team when they’re not at their best, outsiders comment on what a great manager we must have unearthed or how much they’d like some of our players in their teams.

    Last promotion season I don’t think I ever enjoyed it until that Saturday evening when our rivals all failed to win and we knew we are up. I was too nervous, too consumed in constantly trying to guess results and permutations. Watching our rivals matches while barely able to watch our own because of nerves. This time I’m determined to make it different. I’m determined to enjoy every second of this running, because it’s a magic time and won’t happen again for a while.

    The bottom line is a team that was drifting badly and got even an optimist like me moaning constantly and demanding Pozzo do something, today sits NINE points clear in a promotion place with only six matches to play (seven for the one team who could catch us with an unlikely series of results).

    Let me say that again. NINE!

    We aren’t used to this, I know. Usually our triumphs are won the hard way. Promotion last time clinched after 45 matches. Before that a play off final win. We make the cup final and we do it from 0-2. We get relegated and it goes to the final match. As Hornets we are all used to ‘doing it the hard way’. The nervous way. The anxious way.

    But NOT this time.

    Just wait and see :)
     
  12. Simmos

    Simmos First Year Pro

    I would suggest that Bournemouth and Barnsley on current form have a better chance of winning all their remaining games than Brentford or Swansea. I doubt they will but assuming they do, we need 3 wins from 6 games or some other combination of 9 points from 6 games. We have won over 57% of our games so far this season so the chances of not getting 9 points from 6 matches must be extremely slim. The bookmakers have us at 90% chance of being promoted. We are averaging just under 2 points a game. There is no reason to believe that will not continue this form regardless of the opposition.

    I have stated the absolute obvious because some on here still believe we may not get promotion.
     
  13. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    On paper we'd be far worse off, no Doucoure, no Deulofeu, and it remains to be seen whether the chief charlatan(s) will remain. Gonna be a struggle to stay up, will need some smart wheeling and dealing, not least finally getting rid of Deeney (I fancy Gray will have done just enough for a Championship club to take a punt on him on loan)
     
  14. Moosegasm

    Moosegasm Reservist

    If we go up we will have a team of largely young (ish), hungry, talented players who want to fight for the club and each other. I'd take that over Turncoat Doucoure any day of the week.
     
  15. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    Yes - meant our main strikers.

    Don't think I need to say who!

    ;)
     
  16. Moosegasm

    Moosegasm Reservist

    well said
     
  17. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    The games in Jan-Early Feb when Hughes and Masina were both available to Xisco were:

    Swansea 2-1 Watford
    Watford 2-0 Huddersfield
    Watford 1-0 Barnsley
    Stoke 1-2 Watford
    Millwall 0-0 Watford
    Coventry 0-0 Watford

    3 wins, 2 draws, 1 defeat. 1.83 PPG.
    6 goals scored, 3 goals conceded.

    Hughes played a total of 23 minutes against Swansea and Huddersfield. I think he was still getting his fitness back at that stage.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021
  18. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    All scenario's are possible. No one really knows how it will pan out right now. We could become Champions, we also have a very good chance of second place, but we could also be caught and end up in the play offs if we have a little wobble. Those outside the club saying Watford are as good as up, were probably the same saying Watford would never go down last season, as it appeared unlikely until right at the death.

    I think you can only really enjoy a promotion season after it's run its course. You can only really enjoy it in retrospect (IMO). If we go up, the cautious types will be feeling a bit silly for being nervous. If we don't go up, those optimistic ones will have a hard fall in emotion and will have a very tough summer of reflection.

    As a bet, it looks like it will be Norwich Champions, Watford runners-up and either Brentford or Bournemouth play off winners. But football has a nasty habit of kicking you when you least expect, or giving rewards when you think all is lost. It can all happen and I've followed football long enough to not trust the game until it's mathematically certain.
     
  19. We will be fine staying up as long as we can replace 8 of the starting 11 with better players. Remember we got relegated with a squad including Deulofeu, Pereyra, Doucoure, Capoue, Foster in great form, Welbeck occasionally, and Dawson.
     
  20. Fans make the mistake of looking at runs and just assuming they will continue. We are on a great run so will just continue winning, Brentford are wobbling so will continue to wobble. However when Brentford won 8 in a row, or whatever it was, they were guaranteed to continue that run and stroll to the title ? Form can come and go in a blink. There could still be some twists to come, let's hope they don't involve us.
     
    El distraído and ITK platypus like this.
  21. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    We had Hughes against QPR, yet we still played abysmally, not sure Masina would have made all that much difference (Ngakia did look awkward at LB, but I don't think he was the main reason for the defeat). If you look a bit deeper, that run should have been pretty favourable, at no point this season have Swansea played well, yet they deservedly won, Huddersfield had an injury crisis, Stoke were beginning to look hopeless without Tyrese Campbell, Millwall were on a horrible run of form at the New Den, and Coventry have been relegation candidates all season yet played us off the park
     
  22. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Tbf we don't necessarily need 11 proven Premier League players to survive, we had players like Anya and Abdi (who may have been Prem quality had he played in his correct position, but as it was struggled). What that season (and last season) show is that a genuine goalscorer can go a long way, if only we had prime Iggy and Deeney last season, we'd have survived comfortably!
     
  23. ForzaWatford

    ForzaWatford Squad Player

    Managers don't have any time on the training pitch this season. He was never going to turn it around in a short time period.
     
    WatfordTalk likes this.
  24. Malteser2

    Malteser2 First Year Pro

    HB1 we are all different and I’m certainly not telling others how they should be reacting to recent events. We are roughly the same age I think so I too have followed football long enough to know things twist and turn. From my side it’s because of my instinct developed over five decades of supporting us that makes me feel supremely confident right now. I think I can sense a promotion run when I see one, but I know I could still turn out to be horribly wrong. Only time will tell.

    I am very much enjoying football life right now. Regardless of promotion or not, we are winning practically every match we are playing, and that’s a great place to be.

    Undeniable, the difference for me is we are having are best run of the season right now while the end is in sight. Ditto Brentford and Swansea having their worst. In both GT’s and AB’s first season back in the Championship after relegation, we went off like an express train at the start and fell away. This time I believe we’ve hit form just when it really matters.
     
  25. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    I don't think that Brentford will win all their remaining games, not least because they have a tricky trip to the seaside to play Bournemouth (as well as us of course), but I don't for a second think they'll continue to struggle like this, especially with Henry and Dasilva to come back
     
  26. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    That's a bit sweeping, isn't it? They can't have been that awful to have been in second place.
     
  27. watfordfcmoose

    watfordfcmoose Academy Graduate

    In our run of DLD against Millwall QPR Coventry. Despite being crap we hit the woodwork in all 3.
     
    Knight GT likes this.
  28. Ágætis Byrjun

    Ágætis Byrjun Reservist

    Exactly. Much like out great run came after our worst spell of the season and Xisco looked a dead man walking.

    Just get the job done, boys.
     
  29. TBH it all feels a bit boring, perhaps because we have to experience this promotion remotely, or perhaps because (barring a wobble) Norwich have first place tied up, and (barring a wobble) we have second.

    2020-21 promotion the most boring ever.
     
    Luther Bassett likes this.
  30. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

    They were able to keep clean sheets and take wins - I suppose a bit like us under Ivic to an extent but now they cannot even score 1 and letting in goals.

    The only really consistent team has been Norwich.

    A lot of teams have had runs of wins.

    Us
    Brentford
    Swansea
    Cardiff
    Barnsley.
     
  31. sydney_horn

    sydney_horn Squad Player

    Yes, exactly. We can't rely on others to get us over the line.

    The fact that Swansea and Brentford have wobbled has given us a useful lead in the race. But we have to keep picking up points or we will be caught.

    Hopefully the squad are just focusing on Reading and getting a win. That's all they need to do each game and the rest will take care of itself.
     
    Moosegasm likes this.
  32. WatfordTalk

    WatfordTalk First Team

    We had Ngakia at LB and Navarro at RB against QPR, we never stood a chance.

    Swansea have definitely played well at times this season, and I remember being impressed by them when we played.

    As we've seen, form etc doesn't often count for much in this league, you need to earn every point. But this is straying from the original point, that Xisco had a fully fit Hughes and Masina available during that period and fluffed it, which I don't think is true.
     
  33. Malteser2

    Malteser2 First Year Pro

    We’ve actually been fairly consistent ourselves tbh.

    Our longest run without a win has been 3 matches (twice).

    We’ve not lost back to back matches all season.

    If you break down our season into 6 game runs these have been our points...

    13. 9. 10. 10. 11. 15. 13 (with one still to play).

    That’s very consistent I’d say.
     
  34. wfc4ever

    wfc4ever First Team Captain

  35. Hogg-DEENEY!!!

    Hogg-DEENEY!!! Reservist

    Even at their best this season, they've been solid yet unspectacular. How many times have they scored more than one this season? A damning indictment on us that they managed to come back from a goal down to win, and even more so that they looked the better team
     

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