Medical/Fitness Department

I personally look forward to reading this because from an outsiders perspective I can't really understand why our players seem to take so long to recover from what seems to be relatively minor injuries, hopefully there is good reason to it.

 

Agree that people are making assumption but this may be due to the fact that there is very little informatoon from the club
This will always lead to speculation and rumours
I think Supporters are just trying to understand why this is happening

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/...he-was-sacked-because-he-is-english-7kv82d9sx

For those that can't read the whole article basically Collinge is taking us to court over claims we sacked him because he is English. Not a lot else to read, except that we hope to speak to Leicester today or tomorrow about Slimani.

 

So first time round he walks out on the club to go to Cardiff with Malky. Second time around he decides to sue the club. And people want him back?

 

It does seem a bit petty on Collinge's part. As far as I know the club can employ and dismiss whoever the they like with reason. In this case our reason being that we have built the (highly successful.....) new medical centre with a permanent doctor installed instead of having a physio as head of medical.

I know nothing about law but in my biased opinion I don't think the club will have any trouble winning this one. It'll probably just come to a settlement anyway.

 

I don’t blame. Sounds like unfair dismissal to me. Seeing he couldn’t sue because he was employed under 2 years, he’s gone for something he can sue the club on.

He must feel he has a strong case to go through with this.

The decision the club made has backfired as the ‘state-of-the-art’ medical centre has performed dreadfully and now there’s more haste from a disgruntled former employee.

Are we sure Gino is not a front man for Bassini? Lol

 

Are we sure you’re not Baz, “you muppet”

 

Again, what is your actual evidence that care is substandard, or was better in the good old days of plantar fasciitis or muscle imbalance?

It could be so, but until you can compare the record like for like (hard to do) or have evidence of poor practice or can discount other factors like over training or poor pre and post match routines then you risk unfairly criticising people who may be trying their best.

 

Do we even have a medical department at the club?

 

When Collinge was employed we had the best injury record in the Premier league.

As soon as he goes and we get this all singing, all dancing medical centre we instantly drop to one of the worst, and this has been consistent for 2 years now.

In anyone’s book, that’s not impressive and questions are correctly being asked.

 

This forum is a breeding ground for the overly sensitive and short tempered.

It’s quite amusing.

 

Your post rushes to conclusions rather than ask questions.

It’s bad enough when our fans speculate about football without them branching out into medicine.

Still, as they have become the fall guys of the moment maybe the owners will join in to rubbish them.

 

There’s a lot more than just me questioning the validity of the medical centre.

You have to look at the results. Do you think they are performing well compared to our first season?

For the past two seasons our injuries have been extreme. Not only with a amount of players but the recovery time.

If you’re happy to ignore and not ask questions then that’s fine, but I’m not one to sit around quietly without even raising a concern.

 

He might have a point. I don't think we can claim dismissal due to poor performance.

Any legal action will be in respect of his contract. If he had a normal permanent contract of employment then he might well have a case.
If he was a contractor on a fixed term like most footballers, managers etc, then as long as the contract is paid up he doesn't have a broken leg to stand on.

None of us know the full details apart from the fact that the medical team appeared to be better under him than it is now. Might be luck, might be skill. Think we'll have to see how it all pans out when a judgement is brought after hearing all the evidence.

 

Training as well has an impact on the number of injuries and recovery time. As does playing players before they've fully recovered. So whilst the majority factor, the medical team are not the only area to look at .

 

I agree. Training does play a big part. I know Watford train with high intensity, which will probably have an adverse effect on the body.

However, playing players before they are fully recovered would be down to the medical department. They make the assessments and advise the club when a player is fit for duty.

 

But that's the point Moose is making. You're not asking questions, just glibly stating as fact things that you have no knowledge of

 

I’ve raised loads of questions. Just scroll through. I even started this thread.

 

We've cocked up somewhere along the line. After a decent first season back in the Premier League finishing in 13th place and an FA Cup semi final. The following season we regress to finishing one place above the relegation zone, apparent dressing room divisions with a hated manager who leaves to chants to 'Get out of our club' at the Vic. We finally assemble a few quality players, many of whom we never actually see due to (yet another) injury crisis. Our defence is for all to see an absolute shambles yet according to our club , we have a 'well balanced' team in spite of having just seen it lose to virtually all the worst teams in the league. It hardly inspires confidence or trust in the club's hierarchy.

Marco obviously has to take some blame as Head Coach, but none of us know the true extent of what went on between the head coach and the owners. Personally I wouldn't be surprised if serious fractures hadn't developed well before the Everton debacle over drafting in players in the Summer. Bringing in Gray certainly didn't help his system. To say he's given up or doesn't care is ridiculous. At the Vic Saturday I saw him off his feet and directing the team the whole game and you could see him fist-pumping the air as the goals went in - doesn't look like someone who doesn't care to me. To be honest, I don't care what our 'model' is, if I was a manager (or Head Coach) of any worth looking to build something longer term why would I? Inadequate say over players to bring in, apparent lack of communication over injuries, openly contradicting your views to the press, little chance of moulding a team and likely to be shown the door after a single year - sounds an attractive proposition to me.

Looking at our injury crisis, shambolic defence and Christmas results, given in January we've fallen to just two wins away from the drop zone, I genuinely haven't a clue how anyone could say we're in no or very little danger of going down. I hope if there is a serious divide between Head a Coach and owners for the sake of our players it is resolved as quickly and professionally as possible, so far it doesn't look like we're going to be at all active in the transfer period, with the wonderfully 'well balanced' and in-depth team we currently have available, (and arguably unlike the last couple of seasons) we're going to need to fully focus on the remaining part of the season.

 

We don't know and will never know, exactly what has gone on in the medical dept. I'm sure the Pozzos will be all over it though.

As for Collinge, his case is reminiscent of half-inebriated yuppies those who complain loudly in bars that really it is middle class white men who are the most discriminated against y'know.

Unless he's got some very strong evidence of discrimination, which I doubt, I think he's on to a probable loser. If I were representing him, I'd suggest raising a hullaballoo for a week or so to see if we can scare them into a little payout to make it go away, but if they're sticking firm then to forget it and move on.

 

Ask the question another way - we have a supposedly state of the art medical set up - does anyone see evidence that it is doing a great job?

 

You opening assertion was 'Since the sacking of Richard Collinge, and the reason has still not been made public, things have gone rapidly downhill.

We've gone from the club with the fewest injuries just two years ago, to the club with the most, and this has been a problem for the last two seasons, since the new medical department has been set up.'

I know you and others like nothing more than a scapegoat, but I suspect that our current injury problems cannot be blamed entirely on our medical team - if, indeed, there is any 'blame' to be apportioned at all.
But my view is based on no medical knowledge whatsoever. I assume you have some to be so certain of your position?

 

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Always have to bring class into it eh? I wonder what your post would read like if on some building site a few English people were sacked when a new Polish employer took over and replaced them with their own countrymen.

 

Of course he does, HB1 is a jack of all trades, weren't you aware?

 

Ha ha! Yes, I did read elsewhere that he runs a global business empire and spends much of his time (when he's not stressing about Watford FC) shuttling between Toronto, Barcelona and, erm, Watford, on a private jet

 

To be fair though what HB1 is saying is factually correct. Our injury situation had undoubtedly gone downhill. It may be just bad luck but it is still a fact.

 

I’ve already said that it probably wasn’t all the M.D. fault. I said training could be a contributing factor.

You don’t have to be an expert to raise a question whether something is working as intended or not.

It’s like saying, have you ever been President of America? No? well you cannot voice an opinion on Trump if not.

 

You are saying that the medical team has ‘performed dreadfully’, your words. That’s not asking a question, that’s laying blame for what may be a collection of long term casualties and bad luck mixed with other reasons.

Former medical teams may have been more fortunate, but disappointing injury news is nothing new if you care to remember every player from Danny Webber and his shoulder to Almen’s recurring feet problems. Let alone Keith Mercer.

Only the two hamstring injuries are really questionable. Our centre backs have had injuries for ages now and Chalobah’s injury was always likely to be season ending. Much of the consternation rests on what we were told about likely recovery times, but I’m not even sure what gets printed the day after an injury even comes from the medical team.

 

Right on cue...

A perfectly timed piece of PR from the club:

https://www.watfordfc.com/club/medical-director-meet-dr-emilio

 

I’m imaging Dr Nick Riviera.

 

Or, just possibly, the recovery time of the injured players is entirely in line with accepted best practice timescales for the type of injury sustained?

 

The club have just appointed a new head of medical. It’s on the official website today. Read it. It’s very clear there have been problems but this new Dr is here to sort them out.

The club have acted and hopefully the issues will now dramatically improve.

 

Do you think that is what it is? You do not share a widely held view that our players seem to be taking longer than expected to recover?

 

I once brushed my teeth with Savlon after a long evening in Warsaw.

All I had to hand to rinse my mouth out was a miniature of Chivas Regal.