I’m old enough to have seen him play for us but unfortunately I was somewhat late to the game in supporting this great club. The point of this thread is that people have been saying how much of a one-man team we are with Sarr, was that the case with Barnes? When he left us for Liverpool in the summer of 1987, we were relegated the following season. Of course, I know Barnes’s departure wasn’t the only factor that contributed to that, but he clearly had a massive impact on the team. Were we still a capable team when he wasn’t playing, did he have any spells when he was out for a long time and did our form suffer greatly as a result? Who were our deputies and main threats in his absence?
Callaghan, Blissett, Taylor, Jenkins, Simms, Sherwood, Bolton, Rice, Jackett, Armstrong, Mo, Reilly plus many others played with Barnes. He was good, but it would have been unfair to put him on the pitch on his own.
I was there on his league debut. From memory he came on against Oldham at the start of the 1981-82 season. He then set the world alight in his next game, which was a 3-1 win at Chelsea. Yes, he was a brilliant player and a real match winner. When he left it was of course a big loss, but the real reason we were relegated was because we lost Graham Taylor as well. Dave Bassett came in and "sold the family silver". He were completely dismantled in the 1987-88 season and never really recovered until GT came back again. In those days, we didn't have big squads and the regular team played most weeks. We didn't really have a replacement. We certainly didn't have another winger apart from Callaghan and Barnes in the early years. Worrell Sterling came through the youth ranks around 1983 onwards who and was a back-up winger. He's the only one I can remember from that time.
Yes we drew 1-1 and the only thing memorable from the game was the performance of this young sub who I'd never heard of until I saw him on the pitch. He showed so much raw promise in that little cameo. We had a couple of reserves over the years behind Barnes and of course he played more centrally some of the time, esp in the 2nd year in the top league, when he and Luther played upfront. Sterling, Smilie, David Johnson?, Paul Atkinson, were sub widemen but never really played much. I can barely remember Barnes being injured at all. Success at a small club depends so much on the atmosphere at the club being right and everyone pulling together for the common good. In addition to changing personnel, Bassett totally killed the atmosphere and togetherness.
Dave Bassett certainly did sell the family silver. Couldn't believe it when he got rid of Colin West. As for JB, I don't remember the Oldham match, but I clearly remember the Chelsea game. John Barnes was by far the best player Watford had ever seen, but at that time we where only just beginning life at the top. I was very excited by John Barnes, but you know what, I think I am even more excited by Ismalia Sarr.
Smilie was an attacking midfielder and David Johnson was a striker. Atkinson was a winger, but like you said, hardly ever played although he was sub in the FA Cup final team of 1984.
Atkinson and Smilie were the same - wide attacking midfielders who were cover for the wingers. I barely saw Johnson.
It amazes me to think that teams didn't have big squads back then. Before the 1970 World Cup, even subs weren't allowed! How on earth did teams cope if players were seriously injured during training and especially during games? And this was before great advances had been made in fitness, training methods, nutrition etc.
Smillie was a decent enough winger but no JB or Cally. Sterling never fulfilled his potential,.despite getting a lot of chances, and nor did Johnson (who was a left winger). Atkinson was a terrible signing.
Given Barnes was a Liverpool player shouldn't this be in other football? I jest. Legend, we have had others of a similar standing, but not many. Football is very different now. The overall quality is far higher, in his prime would he stand out as much now? Dunno. In recent years maybe Ashley Young is the closest we've got. Others have had potential. King if he wasn't such an arse, Helgusson maybe. Time will tell but Sarr does look very good indeed at the moment.
Barnes was a quality player, a real match winner who didn't get enough credit particularly from the Watford hating media which was very real at the time. Rarely missed games but personally preferred Cally as a player as he was a bit of a maverick and a fantastic crosser of the ball As for Barnes leaving yes was an issue but the travesty was David Bassett wanting put his own personal stamp on the club. Mark Morris preferred to Mclleland, selling Bardsley and Richardson who went on to play in championship winning sides was a crime
Bardsley joined a RFB from Blackpool. Was great there but GT used to sometimes use him as a RW which Bardsley hated and effectively lost him his preferred position at RFB. Great attacking full back - the best ever at the club ?
John Barnes was a great player. It was 7 long years of wilderness until we saw the like of him again.
Made us regret letting him go though a few years later after he rediscovered his form and banged in 59 in 96 for Barry Town. Just like Liam Henderson at Spennymoor Town. Guess we were just unlucky that they just couldn't deliver the goods for us.
To be fair Barry Town was probably a more appealing club to play for back then. In fact it probably is now too, considering it's right on the Welsh Riviera. Plus the girls there will drop their knickers for a bag of chips, so I hear.
To be fair, Morris and McClelland played alongside each other pretty much all through that season, but Bassett's dismantling of the squad was devastating. Also in mitigation, David Bardsley was a – how can I put this politely – quite a negative personality. Lots of players mentioned he was a bit of a moaner. Kevin Richardson told Bassett very early on he didn't want to play in a non-existent midfield, and Bassett was happy to let him go. Falco left, which was a peculiar one, but Bassett insisted Falco 'couldn't run'. Richard Hill holds his hands up and says he was nowhere near fit enough when the season started. So when Oxford came in for him and Bardsley they were as happy to go as Bassett was for them to leave. Probably all summed up by Kevin Richardson arriving for training one day with Englebert Humperdinck's song "Please Release Me" blasting out of his car stereo after he'd realised how few times he'd touched the ball in a pre-season friendly. Before long, Blissett was dropped. Coton was dropped. The replacements for those who'd left were nowhere near good enough. It's probably not right to say the players stopped playing for the manager but hardly anyone was enthusiastic about Bassett's style of play. GT's Watford had been direct but this was another level of direct – smashing the ball into the corners, very little subtlty to it at all. Having said all that, having spoken to Bassett about his six months at the club I almost – almost – felt sorry for him. It wasn't for a lack of effort that his team were so poor, he did try to persuade Barnes to stay, he felt the people he was letting go were not right for the way he wanted to play. But it just didn't work on any level.
Yes but Morris replaced a fans favourite didn't he ? Who was it - Sims, Jackett ? He turned out to be not too bad but he started poorly which didnt help. Falco left because they got a decent offer from Rangers, following in the footsteps of Colin West a year earlier, both having achieved a 1 in 2 scoring record with us.
I can echo all of the above posts, without doubt Barnes was the best player I have seen play for us, at 17 he was unbelievable with so much natural skill! unfortunately players so young now don't get anywhere near the first team! However I am extremely excited by Sarr, whose pace is deceptive and certainly makes a huge difference to the team when he plays, he is a great " out " ball so much so that we didn't miss Deulofeu when he went off injured last Saturday, something that would be hard to believe beforehand!
Was it not Arsenal away in the Quarter Final? Took the so called great left back Kenny Sansom to the cleaners
Unfortunately I couldn't get tickets so only saw the highlights, but from memory it was David Bardsley who tore Sansom apart.
I totally agree with all the accurate criticism of Dave Bassett. But losing Barnes was also a big factor in our relegation that year. Everytime Barnes got the ball and cut in to the box you could expect either a very decent cross or a penalty shout.
Two different games. Birmingham (A) was the quarter final on in the 1984 cup run, Barnes scored twice including the memorable dipping volley over Tony Coton. Arsenal (A) was 1987. Bardsley and Barnes played in that and tore both full-backs, both England internationals (Anderson and Sansom) to pieces.
Morris replaced Steve Terry. To be fair, Terry was going through personal issues at the time. Sims had already left to join GT at Villa. As you say, Morris turned out ok after a hesitant start, finished top three in Player of the Season as I recall.
Ah yes. Was never completely convinced by Terry. Great in the air but didn't look right trying to tackle or distribute on the ground. Don't remember him ever really be coming a first pick. I guess mentally I had Morris replacing Sims as Sims had been the first choice until he left with GT at the end of the season.
it was Steve Sims, who went to Villa with GT. watford didn’t even try to keep him. Bizarre really. falco left because Bassett made it clear he didn’t want him and circulated his name more or less straight away. Tried to bring in an Aussie guy who’d played for Rangers called Dave Mitchell but eventually went for Trevor Senior. Made his mind up on Falco more or less immediately. Crackers when you consider his record but Falco wasn’t the man to chase hopeful balls into the corner.
