Javi Gracia "fired"

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Squibba, Sep 7, 2019.

  1. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    QSF had a championship standard squad. He did what it took to keep it up. Capoue was by far and away our superstar back then.

    Things will be different now we've got some rolls royces in the squad.
     
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  2. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player

    Both managers would weave wonders with our current squad.
     
  3. Horace_goes_up_north

    Horace_goes_up_north First Year Pro

    The only people who pay any attention whatsoever to him and his regular panel of numbnuts are armchair top 6 supporters who loyally glue themselves to motd each Saturday night in the hope of getting some soundbites to regurgitate in the office kitchen on Monday morning.
     
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  4. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    I can understand people’s scepticism about bringing QSF back - they’ve back then wasn’t pretty and he certainly had his favourites.

    The caveat to that is that the squad was awful compared to what we have now and had few options in the squad. Cathcart arguably played his best football under him and Capoue was good too.

    A few noses will certainly be out of joint though in the squad. Can’t see Holebas being a huge part of things going forward.
     
  5. domthehornet

    domthehornet Moderator Staff Member

    Players supposedly found out about Gracia's departure through WhatsApp. Classy.
     
  6. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    Apologies for the ‘do one’ comment - that was uncalled for.

    But I think your judgment is just as clouded. We got some good results pre-April last year but the football wasn’t of an outstanding standard. We scored some wonder goals throughout the season but we still missed plenty of chances, played long and weren’t exactly dynamic. The wonder goals paper over the fact that we still didn’t do a lot of the ‘basics’ and it wasn’t always nice to the eye.

    I don’t want to feel like I’m talking down of Gracia. He worked wonders, especially with the defenders at his disposal and for the large part of his tenure he brought good times. His legacy is cemented due to the Cup Final and can leave with a largely enhanced profile. But the classic signs were there that he’d taken us as far as he could.

    The 2 year cycle referred to by Duxbury played out. As I said before Gracia was sacked, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if the owner and chairman gave him last week to see what he was planning in training - and when the motions were being gone through and the same preparations that have failed us were being undertaken, then they acted. Couple the above (if it happened) with the formation and tactics against Newcastle and the writing was on the wall.

    Yes, he wanted a point on the board. Understandable. But we have a great record against Newcastle - shutting up shop for that point wasn’t a good look and I doubt leaving a £40m new signing and England international on the bench aided his case.
     
  7. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    How else would they be told? It’s International break so I doubt they were in training yesterday. I think it’s doubtful that they would have each individually got a phone call.

    If they sacked Gracia via text I’d get the point, but letting the squad know that way doesn’t seem a huge issue to me.
     
  8. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    They should have been looking at the odds checker. Would have known far quicker.

    Can't help thinking how costly Craig Pawson's VAR ignoring the handball for Newcastle has been for Gracia.

    Had we won that match 1-0, with the Coventry 3-0 win back-to-back, he'd still be in his job.
     
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  9. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    Schar's equaliser was in the 41st minute. I think it's fair to say that had that not counted, they'd have scored at a later point anyway as we shat ourselves in sight of three points.
     
  10. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    I'm not convinced. The owners don't seem the type to react to just one result. Settling for a point at Newcastle won't have helped his cause but I imagine there's been worrying signs in training etc that things weren't being changed.
     
  11. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    The damage was done with the way things panned out home to Brighton and West Ham, coupled with the non-performance at the end of the season, I doubt whether our two away's this season had much bearing on it, wouldn't be surprised if the decision was made before the Newcastle result, just took a week to execute it!
     
  12. Sting

    Sting Squad Player

    Telephone calls would not be good unless they set 20 odd people to phone at the same time.
    A WhatsApp group tells everyone simultaneously.
    Wish these grandads on here would get up to date on technology ;)
     
  13. domthehornet

    domthehornet Moderator Staff Member

    I disagree, we looked like we had a coherent plan at the start of the season and played some wonderful football in parts but as the season wore on we regressed into a more direct approach. There could be a multitude of factors in this including the distraction of the cup or tired legs but it wasn't a defensive outset.

    As we have experienced, Quique set us up incredibly defensively and tried to nick 1-0 wins. It begs the question will he be the same again here?
     
  14. Burnsy

    Burnsy Squad Player

    So let me get this right...

    Quique started well but regressed but we should focus on the regression part...
    Gracia started well but regressed but we should focus on the good start...

    Is that right?

    I remember the last days of QSF and the football was turgid and we limped home. But look at the squad at his disposal. Just look at it. Its horrifically bad.

    We need to look at where we are in the table and the games to come. We need to become hard to beat and in my opinion, QSF will prove better at that than Gracia would have. Will be interesting to see how it pans out though.
     
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  15. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Where is the lie?
     
  16. Guy

    Guy Squad Player

    Hugely disappointed that things have not worked out for Gracia as felt he was a great fit for the club, always conducted himself impeccably and he seemed to have a great relationship with the squad
    The drop off in form at the end of last season was a worry and the Brighton home game one feels did for him in the end but was it down to him or a poor mindset of the players who seemed to believe they just had to turn up to get a result
    The use of subs though been baffling, why was Sarr brought on so late v West Ham and not at all at Newcastle when we should have been going for the win, he can't be unfit as played through the summer in the AFCON competition.

    Brave decision by Pozzo again, would be interested to hear reasoning behind the change firstly the sacking of Gracia and the return of QSF but doubt we will hear anything

    Will be pilloried by the pundits but who cares

    Team selection will be interesting
     
  17. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    My interest in football is limited to wfc and I never watch it listen to general football media, so I wonder if Sutton is just as bellicose about other teams or if it is a specific dislike of the Watford way?
     
  18. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    And Watford is in London as far as Javi and our other foreign employees are concerned.
     
  19. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    I hope they used a sad emoji
     
  20. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Reservist

    The fallacy is taking what Danny Mills says seriously.
     
  21. Really nice guy. If ever there was a bloke you wanted to succeed Gracia is it.

    Hoof and hope to pick up a 2nd ball tactics straight off a Sunday league park pitch.
     
  22. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Well, we do sack managers. Pretty much one per season at least. And it does work for us, as we're enjoying at least the second best period in our histor-history. Maybe it's a stopped clock and all that, but he's right. Can't see why it would anger people.
     
  23. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Almost certainly. It's what he did at Espanyol too, it's his default setting.
     
  24. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Reservist

    What I find irritating, is how sheep-like they all are. After QSF was initially dismissed, we were 'crazy' and this only changed last season. Since then what Mills is saying has pretty much been the norm. All of the usual MOTD mob have said similar. They haven't got an original thought between them. I don't know why people give a **** about any of their opinions.
     
  25. Norwayhornet

    Norwayhornet Squad Player

    Not technically correct
     
  26. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    Meh - genuinely doesn't bother me. Perhaps because I only experience this pundits 2nd hand via posts on here as I would rather put my balls in a blender than watch a programme where a bunch of ex-pros with an average IQ in the low 70s talk about football topics.
     
  27. Norwayhornet

    Norwayhornet Squad Player

    Of course
     
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  28. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    For those on here saying this change should have happened a week ago.

    You've no idea if QSF was top of the Gino short list. There may have been one or more ahead of him who were negotiated with but for one reason or another those negotiations fell through.

    What Gino likes more than anything is to be able to make the new appointment immediately. As hb1 pointed out, out with the old - in with the new, was done yesterday between England being 1-0 up and 2-0 up. Breathtaking.

    What Gino doesn't like is a gap. Some other clubs don't seem to get this and sack one manager/head coach and only then start floundering around looking for the new one.

    So, Gino only acts when all the ducks are in a row at which point he's decisive and ruthless.. It's very professional and impressive i.m.h.o. What he doesn't have is a 'magic wand' though.
     
  29. GoingDown

    GoingDown Pizza & Figs

    In this day and age, with highlights and rivers everywhere, the requirement to watch MOTD, which is the most criticised one, is zero.

    Equally, those who get themselves into a rage about football pundits probably have a few personal problems they need to sort.
     
  30. Steve Leo Beleck

    Steve Leo Beleck Squad Player

    Feel sorry for Gracia. Luck was definitely out for him - Gray missed a great chance and Pawson missed a penalty at 1-0 in the Brighton game, Hughes missed an open goal to put us 2-1 up against West Ham when we were well on top, Pawson missed the handball on VAR at Newcastle. Obviously we could've still conspired to mess things up in each of those games but if just a couple of them had gone Javi's way, we'd be in mid table.
     
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  31. Keighley

    Keighley Squad Player

    Or just need to get out more?
     
  32. Happy bunny

    Happy bunny Cheered up a bit

    But not necessarily in the team
     
  33. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    There isn't a "requirement", but I enjoy a date with MotD on a Saturday night or Sunday morning. Are any other options for viewing the footy any better? The MotD pundits are OK. I like Shearer and Murphy. Are any other pundits elsewhere better? The only tw.tish pundits currently doing the rounds that I can think of are Chris Sutton and Robbie Savage.

    The best thing that could be done to improve MotD i.m.h.o. would be for Mark Chapman to compere it (as well as MotD2) or maybe Dan Walker. Big-ears out.
     
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  34. folkestone orn

    folkestone orn Reservist

    Mark Chapman is much better than Lineker. An obvious way in which our license fees could be better spent.
     
  35. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team

    Well they didn’t score later, and I’m sure Newcastle would have if they could have.
    The lie is he and all his pundit mates, make out it's only Watford who sack managers. It's like they constantly focus on Watford with their condemnation, but when other clubs do it, it's understood and accepted.
     
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