Ivic has always been a defence first manager. Biggest difference between his older teams and now is that the personnel available to play his preferred 4-3-3 weren't recruited so he's adapted to a 5-3-2 to make the best of an imbalanced squad and has hampered his preferred method of controlling and dictating play. Against Spurs we saw how potentially effective it was with the preferred 4-3-3, but then we lost Estupinan and decided to not replace him foolishly.
I disagree with people who say we are getting better. I really don’t feel we are. I think in a month or so’s time, we will look back at Blackburn as our peak, and realise things started going downhill from there. That last minute goal on Saturday will be a turning point. I hope I’m wrong and may well be. Only time will tell. But I don’t feel we’ve improved much, if at all, from the early days of those 1-0 wins. And if Sarr and Capoue turn in more performances like they did last night, it was misguided optimism on our parts getting so excited when they came back.
I'vewatched 4 matches this season, the scum, blackburn, bournemouth and wycombe. The scum we were the better side, but we were ouclassed by blackburn, bournemouth and wycombe, with wycombe by far the worst performance. So I cannot imagine anyone saying we are getting better.
I think we have hit the ground running - we're joint second! Having a fit striker makes a huge difference and will allow Ivic to go to his preferred 4-3-3, it was obvious to see the impact Perica made on Saturday and the difference in the team when he came off.
Look at our squad for ****s sake. We might not think they are all great, but they are mostly good players for the division. Whether they want to be here or not, bang out a 4231 like everyone else on the planet and get on with it. Make the most of what you have, which is a pretty reasonable squad at the end of the day. If Ivic is so inflexible and inept that he can only play us in a clearly awkward, massively unsuitable 532 where nobody has any idea what they are doing or how to create chances then he is obviously not fit to be a second tier coach, let alone one at a team that expects a promotion challenge. If we are really playing like dogshyte just because we don't have a specialist left back it is pretty pathetic. Stop making excuses and make the most of whatever you have available..
Are there no out-of-contract players looking for a short-term job? They don't have to be that good, just good enough to allow the rest of our players to appear in their best positions.
I wish he would, once in a while. He seems very reluctant to actually take on some of these lower league cloggers.
Perica was fit on Saturday and we didn’t play 4-3-3. Murray has also been fit. It isn’t the lack of a striker stopping us playing that formation. Either Ivic bites the bullet and plays Femenia/Sema/Ngakia as a make shift LB, or this shape continues. It has nothing to do with the striking options. Perica scored. And wasn’t awful. But it wasn’t obvious the ‘impact’ he made. We still weren’t great. If you think we can go through this season playing this style and still be second, then great. But I’m convinced you’re wrong - Foster playing out of his skin has put the side in a false position in the table.
I disagree with you, Foster has only played well in two games, and in the others barely made a save. I think we all know that Murray is not up to starting every game, and Perica has only been available for one game (I think). Ivic will probably want to switch the formation once he's had a chance to get the right players fit for it, and a chance to actually work on it in training. I think we'll probably see this until the next international break and then maybe a change after that, provided we have our players back.
Going by Ivic's press conferences, I got the impression he's waiting for the next international break before switching to a 4-3-3. Three more games against Barnsley, Stoke and Coventry before the international break. Ivic is very methodical and sticks to his plan. He's not one to react quickly to things and you can see this in the way he waits patiently for players to return. He probably gives them too much recovery time, but will always side with caution, as it has served him well in his career to date.
You can disagree all you want, your prerogative. But I’d have to wonder what you’re watching if you think we are where we are in the table because we’ve been playing well. And when the things you blindly hope for don’t happen, what will the next reasoning be? You think we are suddenly going to switch shape, style and formation - but there’s been zero evidence of that in any game so far. Who is playing left-back in the formation you claim he will switch to soon? Because so far as I can see, he’s got one option there and hasn’t played him as a LB for one minute as yet, even though he’s been fit.
You can see evidence that Ivic has worked on movement and attacking - some good moves in the last couple of days. Sadly it's undermined by a lack of intensity off the ball and a lack of quality on it. We have players who ought to be decent on the ball at this level, like Cleverly or Quina who are often woeful. Frankly a few of our players are overrated and lack the willingness to take responsibility, but the lack of options to hit in all areas leads to more poor passing or running into cul-de-sacs. The antidote to an inability to hold the ball is going to be Deeney and bang goes the good movement. Unless one of the centre backs can regularly bring the ball out, we will struggle playing with a back three because we get outfought and outpassed in the middle.
Foster was good. It was clear there had been some work on some attacking moves but only really in the final third. We weren't good against their rather distinct style of play which we aren't used to; we should have admittedly prepared better though It wasn't a great match for us and on paper was a poor result with a lack of urgency in midfield and evident defensive frailties. I still have the feeling that many here feel we should be easily winning games by several goals. If you look at our promotion season we did score more but also inevitably conceded more. It is clear Ivic's preferred style is to defend and go for 1-0s. again inevitably this means games look tighter as the 3 or 4-0 wins become 1-0s and the 2-2 or 3-3 become 1-1s and we lose 1-0 occasionally. I think many are so frustrated as we don't attack more and score more. errors are more forgivable if we attack more . What I am saying is I am comparing this team to our last few championship teams rather than the decentish prem team or 18/24 months ago. There would be less anger if others held this view, just for the sake of your own blood pressure.
You can play well and win 1-0, it doesn't have to be swashbuckling football all the time. We have been defensively excellent. To me it's clear Ivic is building from a solid foundation. I know we need to create more chances, but I think we are game, by game getting there. I think it's actually very refreshing to have a manager with a clear way of playing and identity. I remember the same things happening in Dyche's season, and in Zola's season and they had full pre-seasons! With Zola as soon as he got the balance right, it clicked. Did people think we were actually going to go from winning 8 games last season, to suddenly winning every game 3-0 this season? We all know Kiko can do a job at LB. Ivic has said himself 4-3-3 is his favoured formation.
I don’t expect the team to win every game by several goals. Equally I don’t expect the team to be completely outplayed by a promoted team who had lost every match this season. It’s hard to get worked up as it’s just another poor performance, and I expect another one on Saturday. The fact is we are not playing well at all, passing poorly and failing to create chances. Our points haul is far above the performance levels currently and we will be down in mid table soon if performance doesn’t pick up.
Our performances are not getting better. And we certainly were not defensively excellent in our last two games. As for the last comment - do we? He's been a below-average LB. Ivic has suggested 4-3-3 is his favourite formation...yet he's had Femenia available all season and hasn't used him as a LB for even one minute. Why? He's had a player you are claiming is good enough to play LB to allow him to play his favoured formation but isn't doing so....and your reasoning seems to be that he doesn't have a striker available - but he has had. And still didn't play it. I want us to play the formation you're suggesting. But we have to be honest about what we are seeing and what the signs are.
COG Process #33:- COG - we'll smash this league as we have the best owners! (a few months later) Bedwetter - we aren't smashing this league. COG - Did you really think we were going to smash this league?
See I don't think COGs ever said that we will smash the league, that seems revisionist. We thought we had to cut our cloth and understood that lord Gino had to sell players and we wouldn't be as good. Its good that we are 3rd Ill give you that (and we will celebrate that achievement) but it wasn't an expectation. I think that's more the mindset of a subset of bedwetters (lets call them fallen bedwetters) who thought we would easily smash the league with our premiership players but aren't liking that we have sold a lot of players and aren't scoring much.
This is all a bit Republican / Democrat isn't it. You Bedwetters are definitely the loud shouty angry Republicans, your logic replete with foam mouthed conspiracy and projected self hatred.
It should be easier for him to play LB than LWB though, given that the biggest problem of having a right-foorted player on the left is that it's more difficult to cross. However, if playing further back in defence then that scenario is less likely to occur.
Perica wasn't very good apart from his goal and we weren't better than Muff, but I thought that was far and away the most entertaining match of the season.
I hadn't considered this excellent point, that the team who had lost all seven previous games and scored just 3 goals, were actually some sort of super team. Everyone else should be easy by comparison to them, Bournemouth, Wednesday and Reading. These games are all anomalies and it's the lucky wins against Derby, Blackburn and Luton which are actually representative of our real levels.
Anyway, I wish the Wykehamists the best of luck for the rest of the season. They've got a good manager and are playing at a higher level than ever before. A fairytale rather like ours under GT, and not to be confused with a more recent fairytale.
For clarity, your position is that you expected us to be shyte, you appreciate why we are shyte and you are pleasantly surprised that we are not quite as shyte as you had expected. Well, I guess if you hold the club you support to a low enough standard, you will always be content.
Agreed. If anything good comes out of last night, I hope they build on that and find a way to miraculously stay up.
You speak of revisionists but now claim that the bedwetters thought we'd keep our 'star players'? You don't have to look back far to see that's complete Trumpian nonsense.
Yesterday was disappointing and as other have said Wycombe wanted it more. However Our defensive is pretty much ok , Hughes and Capoue will make a strong midfield , our problem remains a clinical goal scorer I hope that either Gray / Deeney / Murray will step up. I still think promotion is within our grasp (wish reading were not doing so well) and think that we will get better. I think where we are when the January transfer window opens is crucial , if we look good for promotion why would we sell players / why would they want to leave , if we are 1/2 way down the table anything could happen
Play Femenia at left back. He maybe a **** left back but it's a **** league proved by the fact we're third. People saying we can't play 4-3-3 because we don't have a left back but we are playing Sarr as a centre forward and he isn't one so why not play Femenia as a left back and get Sarr back out on the wing. Against Blackburn he created the goal by being out wide and putting a in a perfect cross. The reason we were **** is not because we didn't sign a left back, it's more the negative approach of the coach. Can we also stop playing Chalobah. Been awful all season Here's a better solution, cancel football until fans are allowed back in. Football without fans is nothing and I'm finding it very difficult to feel that bothered about it.
Still bloody steaming from last night. Reminded me of when Rodgers took us to play Reading. Dominated possession passing it around whilst doing FA where it hurts. Lost 4-0. Should have been a similar score line last night with the added kick in the teeth that we didn't even dominate possession.
