Gracia Out

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by GoingDown, Apr 7, 2018.

?

Should JG go?

  1. Yes, now?

    42 vote(s)
    46.2%
  2. No? He deserves a chance to get us out of the championship?

    1 vote(s)
    1.1%
  3. Not yet. If we lose to Newcastle?

    28 vote(s)
    30.8%
  4. If we are bottom at Christmas?

    7 vote(s)
    7.7%
  5. If we go 10 games without a win?

    13 vote(s)
    14.3%
  1. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    I know most know this but I’m stunned Duxbury said the club probably won’t be investing in a striker at the latest FF.

    Had he seen our strikers play? He says we have six on the books so can we spa loan for loan? Give City Gray and we can have Sterling on Grays wage bill?

    Yeah right.
     
  2. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    The problem is nobody is going to match Okaka/Deeney/Gray wages and contract length even if we give them away for free. We’ve made poor investment decisions so we are stuck with them. Getting any of those 3 off the books permanently next month would constitute a cracking January window even if we get nobody in. They are complete dead wood.
     
    Cassetti's Beard likes this.
  3. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    Pozzo Model
     
    hatterhater likes this.
  4. Davidmsawyer

    Davidmsawyer Statto Statto Statto

    Here are some charts showing the number of points Gracia has picked up so far.


    First up lets look at Watford managers over their first 29 games. Javi has picked up 35 points over this period, with an average of 1.21 points per game. Keep that up and we’ll not get relegated.


    It means he is 21st out of the last 32 managers. No surprise to see GT in first place, and Dave Basset in last. Having said that 7 of those managers didn’t make it to 29 games which makes it a slightly unfair comparison (although 4 of them had less points per game anyway). Obviously this is a slightly difficult comparison for some managers, its fair to say you would always expect Jokanovic and Zola to do better as they were in the championship with a pretty good squad.


    [​IMG]


    The next chart looks at the average points over the whole period of a managers reign. Billy McKinlay sits proud in first place with an average of 2 points per game! Javi does a bit worse here and falls down to 23rd place. The dotted blue line is (1.37 points) shows the average points per game in the premier league last season - so this is a kind of average target for managers. Hitting this average will get you to about 8th place.


    [​IMG]



    Here is the underlying data for the two graphs.


    In here I’ve also added in “Premier League position” column. This shows where the managers would finish between position 1-20 if there ranking was ties back to a position in the premier league. Javi manages to avoid relegation in both options finishing in 14th and 16th spots.


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Sahorn and SkylaRose like this.
  5. wfcmoog

    wfcmoog Tinpot

    So basically, Javi isn't the shittest manager we've ever had, but he pretty damn close.
     
    Davidmsawyer likes this.
  6. GoingDown

    GoingDown "The Stability"

  7. Forzainglese

    Forzainglese Reservist

    Do you remember him?!
     
  8. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth First Team Captain

    Yes. Makes bloody marvellous chips.
     
  9. Keighley

    Keighley First Team

    All those stats say to me is that we should be tapping up Bill McGarry. Anyone have his Instagram number, or whatever the **** it is these days?
     
  10. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    Comparisons are difficult because the majority of managers we have had, had managed us in lower divisions than the one we are currently in!
     
  11. Arakel

    Arakel First Team

    Sod that, we should be getting McKinlay back in. 2 points a game average, incredible!
     
    kVA likes this.
  12. wfcSinatra

    wfcSinatra Predictor Choker 14/15

    So he's bang average?
     
  13. FromDiv4

    FromDiv4 Reservist

    Or the best manager we have had since promotion.
    upload_2018-12-6_8-21-50.png
     
    Bwood_Horn and BigRossLittleRoss like this.
  14. Just think, we had Billy McKinlay in our grasp and we let him go.
     
    Robert Peel likes this.
  15. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    You may speak Catalan or Basque, or have a heavy Andalusian accent barely intelligible to the Castilian ear.
     
  16. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Lewington IN.
     
  17. Relegation Certs

    Relegation Certs Squad Player


    Did not read a single ***in word of that nerdy statto nonsense.

    Can someone tell me if it means he's shyt or not? Ta.
     
  18. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    You don’t need graphs or charts to tell you that.
     
    SkylaRose likes this.
  19. SkylaRose

    SkylaRose Administrator Staff Member

    At least Liverpool did us a favour last night beating Burnley - not that it matters in the grand scheme of things.
    I personally hate playing on Monday - you have to watch all the other teams around you pick up points and
    hope and prey you can play catch up.

    Gracia can probably feel relieved the City match is done now, but Everton away is going to be no walk in the park.
    It's going to be a very heated affair I can tell. Bit of a grudge match with all the Shyte last season and Richy only
    turning up to play for Slither when the snake was happy in his place of work.
     
  20. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    I have a real fear that Richarlison is going to be the difference come Monday.

    I’m happy to admit now that I was wrong - I don’t think we should have sold him. I thought it was good money at the time and it would be reinvested in the key positions we needed. But it hasn’t been and he’s gone on to show he’s exactly the type of forward we’ve been missing.

    Whether he wanted to leave or not shouldn’t have been the consideration - he had a 5 year deal and more effort should have been made to keep him for at least another year.
     
  21. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth First Team Captain

    In best Manuel voice : "Que ?"
     
  22. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Yes, I believe we should have kept him for longer. I thought we'd keep him as I couldn't see anyone signing him after his poor season for us. However, it was unfortunate Silva managed to get the Everton job when he did as he was always going to go after him. I was hoping the window would shut before Everton could get him.

    Our board took a view to cash in, but I think it was a bit too early. It's clear Richarlison is going to turn a 20 goal a season striker. He's scored 7 already. £40m will seem cheap come the end of this season.

    We've placed too much faith on goal-shy strikers and now this is a problem and a key reason for our poor 11 game run. It's mainly down to not taking good chances that's costing us points.

    This has to be addressed in January or else this problem will continue. Deeney and Gray will not suddenly start scoring goals. They are at the stage of career where they will not improve as players. They are as good as they ever will be.

    Success, is different. He is still young and is getting to grips with the Premier League. He's doing well, but will be inconsistent, as Tuesday proved. He's unlikely to be a prolific scorer of goals either, as he doesn't appear to have that natural striker's instinct.

    Penaranda is another option, but Gracia doesn't seem to think he's ready yet. I know he has a convenient foot injury right now, but if he can't force his way past our current crop, then maybe he's only at a similar level or just behind those that are currently playing.

    Okaka and Sinclair are just not good enough. I suspect neither of them will play for the first team ever again. So that's about it. We either bring in someone better than we currently have or we continue on a wing and a prayer and hope against logic that that our strikers have a massive improvement.
     
  23. Jumbolina

    Jumbolina First Team

    Exactly it felt a good price on the assumption we would reinvest 40/50% of it in desperately needed areas. Nobody thought the extent of Pozzo’s reinvestment would be attempting to get Livermore on loan.
     
    Chumlax likes this.
  24. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    A bracing walk in Stanley Park might be the ideal way to limber up.
     
    SkylaRose likes this.
  25. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth First Team Captain

    So 20 points from 15 games extrapolated for the season = 51 points.
    Exclude those first 4 games and we have 8 points from the last 11 games. Extrapolate that rate over the next 23 games gives 17 points which would get us to 37 points.
    If we lose at Everton, 8 points from 12 games, extrapolated over 23 games gives 15 points, a total of 35 points.
    Just sayin'.
     
  26. Lloyd

    Lloyd Squad Player

    As a central striker I don't think there's much to choose between Richarlison and Success and in the wide left attacking role - widely seen as Richarlison's best position - Pereya is a considerable upgrade. So, even with the benefit of hindsight, I think flogging him represented shrewd business
     
    RookeryDad likes this.
  27. ITK platypus

    ITK platypus Squad Player

    Gracia must go now!

    Until we win the next game and returns to being a really good manager. As a Watford fan I'm capable of changing my opinion every 3 games as I lack long term perspective.
     
  28. Burnsy

    Burnsy First Team

    Richarlison is highlighting this season that it was most likely fatigue that beset him last season IMO and is a far more potent finisher than Success.
     
  29. The undeniable truth

    The undeniable truth First Team Captain

    Yep. Brazil's international striker would never get past Success with his goals track record.
     
    Burnsy likes this.
  30. HELGO

    HELGO Reservist

    Winning the next game is a long long way in the future
     
  31. HELGO

    HELGO Reservist


    35 points?, that’s worrying. Think JG will be long gone if we are struggling after the muff game.
     
  32. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    Just chattin’ **** more like.

    I want a graph going either up or down.
     
  33. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    I’m not convinced on this.

    Richie seems to be shanking them left, right & centre from what I see.

    If we had Siggie behind him, Prodl would be scoring every week.

    Not necessarily Gray, though.
     
  34. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    3 games, man!

    You’re a forward looking Methuselah.

    Btw, where is IBB?

    Hopefully not in some celestial mixed doubles with Nnnn, Kels & the large breasted current gf.
     
  35. RookeryDad

    RookeryDad Squad Player

    I always appreciate your contributions, Scott.
     

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