Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by folkestone orn, Dec 19, 2020.
Do you have faith in Pozzo to transform our season with the correct managerial appointment?
None at all. Always looks for a cheap option. And his policy with previous managers means he has encouraged player power to run riot instead of backing his manager. Other clubs seem to be able to pick young progressive managers or wise old experienced heads.
No. Misstep after misstep and the worst is probably still to come when we don't go up this season and the financial meltdown comes.
Unlikeable players, crap decisions and communication from the club, inability to find a coach to galvanise the place.
The strategy is simple, buy a load of players with question marks next to their name for something or other. Try and find a manager who is similar in that respect, but will hopefully be able to get a tune out if said players for long enough than if you just appointed your standard Pardew/Hughes type manager. Rinse and repeat.
Hard to have too much faith in that system anymore, especially as Udinese have declined considerably since they bought us and can no longer afford to spare a whole team of players good enough to get out of the championship.
No. He's been cocking it up both on and off the pitch for years now and we seem to be stuck in a tail spin. As ever he mostly gets a pass from the fans because of past achievements and the deluded fools that make up our fanbase ignorantly blind themselves to the present reality because of it.
Unless the club is sold I don't see us getting out of the downward spiral we're in.
As I said (to a degree) in the shoutbox, I have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to the Pozzos and their ownership - this window is their final opportunity to prove they aren't permanently incompetent and in terminal decline as owners.
Regardless, although I am waiting to see what happens then for a final definitive judgement, I cannot say that I have any faith in Gino in this moment. What I do still have a slight modicum of is hope.
Different things, for sure, and the next appointment combined with the upcoming window is what will decide for good whether even that hope is eradicated.
I think most of us said he had to admit failures of last season but more importantly get Pearson's replacement right.
He has failed and the same old issues of player power remain.
Everyone has to take responsibility- cannot keep blaming the manager.
Does it matter?
Yes, the hierarchy at the club should. Good luck in getting the fans to get behind that.
The main problem is that the' sack the manager' culture will put a lot of managers off from coming here as they got no chance to have time to build a team to how they want.
The system created a rapid springboard to get us promoted and stay there.
But it has definitely run its course. The players don't have the hunger for promotion as we signed them in the PL.
Very clear that they were arrogant enough to think we could sit still and stay in the PL without proper investment or progression plan.
Agreed. Think we've probably already got a reputation for that though!
I don’t necessarily have a problem with the player trading aspect that many do, as they’re not hugely wealthy in football terms, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.
What I do have a real problem with is their absolute disdain for homegrown players from the Championship down. The standard of player coming from the Championship to the PL, and from the lower leagues into the Championship is seemingly increasingly getting better and better all the time. Yet they seemingly completely ignore it.
Not when he hires this Xisco fella I won’t.
Get someone we know FFS! Not the winner of the Georgian league.
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The simple fact that we sack our poor managerial appointments is clearly not the "main" problem. At all.
We sack managers because Pozzo repeatedly appoints the wrong people and/or gives them a squad of absolute c*nts to work with.
It’s a never ending cycle. They completely undervalue the role of the manager (it’s almost complete disdain, in fact) so no manager ever gets the control they need to build a team how they actually want to play.
Any manager is given a ramshackle group of players, with the only option to try and succeed being to adapt to a way of playing that suits the players at their disposal, if they don’t they fail like Ivic, if they do it inevitably fails anyway as it’s not sustainable for a manager to perform long term based on the merits of random players, rather than actual tactics.
My point is that sacking manager isn't the "main" problem, it's one of the symptoms of the far bigger and more widespread problems we have.
When that was brought up when we were in the PL, it was fired back that players couldn't make the step up. I'm sure there were voices that said the same about Ivan Toney and the **** is worth £20-30m now.
Always an excuse ready for use.
I’m sort of agreeing with you, but my point is their managerial appointments aren’t necessarily always poor, but the managers they appoint can’t really manage ‘properly’ because they’re just given random players to work with.
Gino is an awful chairman, he's inability to find and back a coach for this club is partly responsible for the mess we are in, with the failings of the coach he appoints and players he signed making up the rest. Throw in the stories about bonus payments withheld, Doucouré and his transfer issues and it doesn't paint a pretty picture.
Faith in Gino, hell no.
Yep, so as I say the inevitable sacking either way is simply a symptom of the bigger issues.
At the end of the day it is clear to see at this point that Pozzo is the problem. He's turned the club from sh*t to gold and is fast reversing that process with terrible decision after terrible decision across the board.
And also it'll allow people to come here knowing full well they'll probably get sacked and get a pay-off
Do any posts on a football forum matter?
I'd say the COGs will be along to shoot this all down but they are very quiet tonight.
I’ve had plenty of cog tendencies, but it’s always been something that’s frustrated me.
Lower league players are cheap initially, but if they make it at the top level they become worth more than their overseas counterparts we fish around for. To more or less completely ignore players from the lower leagues in the same country your club plays is just madness to me, especially considering the amount of speculative punts that have failed from elsewhere in the world.
Dropping down to the championship I think it was even more strange, and I don’t just mean Toney.
Was very much in the 'Gino IN' camp, however, my patience is now paper thin with him and Duxbury and they now need to start being held accountable for their incompetence over the last 2 years in particular!
On-field we've gone back to where we were before they arrived (a mediocre mid table Championship side) and this is mainly due to how the club is set-up and hasn't evolved! That's all on their watch. Mistake after mistake with Manager appointments, signings/lack of signings in key areas (centre backs and strikers), allowing Giraldi to basically run things around London Colney and undermine Managers, they've let player power take control to the point now where we are rotten to the core and it's toxic beyond belief! I was hopeful we would re-set this season and play some progressive football with a young hungry side, but then we keep hold of sh*t like Gray, Cleverley, Deeney and sign Glenn frigging Murray!!??
Time for them both to go and we need to re-group as a club and move on. It's been a great run, but all good things come to an end and we've gone so stale it's unreal!
Farbeit from me to defend them, but we have seen several of the most prominent COGs see the light, mea culpa and come over to the light (correct) side in the past couple of weeks. It's a dwindling bunch.
No. Time to go, Gino.
When Ivic was first announced, like most of our head coaches I was like "huh?", but I'm always willing to give them a chance because we've made it work before and I don't buy into the whole "championship experience blah blah blah"; I buy into the ability of a coach to adapt and change their ways. This will sound very revisionist from me (so you can believe me or not) but I always had a doubt at the back of my mind about Ivic based on the sounds coming out from him, the dressing room and the club at the start of the season. The whole "my way or the highway" attitude was needed, but it also gave me an impression that that wasn't only meant with regards to respecting the coach, but also his tactics. As soon as I saw him to be a defensive style, slow-paced manager, I knew he wouldn't deviate from that. It made me think of Sannino a lot (and to a lesser extent, Mazzarri).
This is where my faith in Gino goes. Everyone else has covered all the other points (the revolving door of coaches, the toxic players that almost always perennially stink out the dressing room, the infrastructure changes to the club which have been amazing), but the point of knowingly hiring a coach whose negative have been seen in previous head coaches (which we knew ended in abject failure) does not help.
Here's the kicker. Remember that loan that Gino took out from Barclays bank in pre-season? Us paying that back is pretty much reliant on us going back up. Unless we get in an amazing new head coach, that's not going to happen. The firesale will then truly begin, but not in the way we would like it to (after all, I'm fairly sure the club tried to shift some players but couldn't as they found no attractive suitors) and the plunge into financial obscurity would follow.
Buckle up boys and girls and all other genders, it's going to be a galling ride
None at all, and seems like it’s only going to get worse.
We have no choice but to have faith in Gino, and I suspect we've got to be careful what we wish for here. We could get a lot worse if we were sold up to another useless chancer (like Bas).....and there is a long line of those out there.
Something has dramatically changed at board level over the past couple of seasons though. However, they've got a really bad track record over coaches. They all seem to have a 20 match shelf-life. The best manager they've ever had was the one they didn't appoint.
Joka was good though and we did get a tune out of Zola for a while. Gracia did well for a spell and QFS was brilliant for half a season. That's about it really. Not a good strike rate from 14 head coaches.
They have made us a basket case, and for that I'm dissatisfied. Even though it seems like we're crap, we're still better off than we were before they took us over. But, they ARE undermining all that good work now. They need to get back on track. They cannot continue to make so many poor decisions. Something has to change, and they do have to get this next appointment right or else it's goodbye promotion.