Discussion in 'The Team Bus' started by Squibba, Sep 25, 2019.
Success would never last 5 minutes!
Fair point though, I haven't actually seen the incident myself.
Blimey, if physios made their decisions based on how much a player rolls around, they'd be no players left on the pitch.
Sigh. Clearly referring to incidents when players go down with no-one near them and not with the intention of time wasting. You see that a lot do you?
Probably a different pitch side physio these days, but I'm pretty sure we did the same with Pereyra a couple of seasons ago.
https://streamable.com/gtrylt - there's the first one where he was allowed to continue. It's hard to say how much of it the medical team saw - but it was in good view of the bench and they would've seen his leg was in the wrong direction when he initially fell to the floor.
Presumably it was the second incident that actually did the injury. I can't see how a player could be getting around on the pitch like he was with a busted ACL, and he wasn't looking injured before the second time he went down.
From the replays it appeared his foot slipped or caught on the turf when he went down the second time.
Christ. Reminds me a little of the disgusting Zouma one a few years back. It's incredible he wanted to continue after that. Admirable, but probably not the smartest move.
Yeah, i'm not convinced he did his ACL there and then (the 2nd fall also looked painful) but I imagine it would've weakened the ligament significantly
My fault. I did only read up to that point, my apologies
You've lost me. What's funny?
I said on the shoutbox he had to be subbed after that as a precaution. It just seemed so obvious.
He went in for a challenge, he was near the bloke, who also continued past him. It wasn't clear what happened, especially at real speed. I saw the replays and felt he should have come off at the time, but DB himself said that he felt something but didn't think it was bad and could continue, maybe he told the staff that.
We do have a touch of the arsenal about us. Something in the water in London Colney?
That's not uncommon with ACL injuries, thinking it's not as bad as it is when being assessed by the physio at the time. I've read a few players relate the knee would feel okay, a bit stiff and sore maybe, when looking to come back onto the pitch. Only when weight is put onto the joint when twisting or in anything other than an up & down movement does the full extent become apparent.
I did say that he would not play a great deal for Watford this season, but l did not want him to suffer an injury.
Hope he recovers real soon.
I think Callum Wilson did something similar not that long ago. Came back on thinking it was ok but ending up with an ACL injury.
You do love being obtuse don't you? The point I was making, as I suspect you well know, is that players don't tend to roll around on the floor when they're not trying to get someone sent off by exaggerating some contact. There was clearly no contact here and it doesn't matter if the opposition player ran past him a second later. It was obviously a fairly serious injury.
There is still time to send him to Udinese and we could then recall him in January.
Tommy Mooney called it on the commentary straight away with the first one. He explained how the adrenline and what have you means the pain doesn't kick in right away.
He undoubtedly jiggered it more by carrying on playing.
I'm not being obtuse. You said there was no one near him, and that is obviously untrue as he went in for a challenge. And whilst we saw the replays from a different angle and could see there was no contact, that wouldn't have necessarily been clear from the touchline in real time.
And no, the point you were making, as I suspect you well know, is that it is all the Pozzo's doing,
What happened does not reflect well on our pitch side medical team. We just hope he can come back as he was. But hardly ideal for his development after he had put in a hard summer of work getting himself into the first team squad. Speedy recovery Tom. The thoughts of all Hornets are with you.
From what I've heard, if an ACL is gone, that injury itself can't get worse if you play on, but the knee being imbalanced can **** with other bits so I don't know if playing on made it worse. Didn't make it better, that's for sure!
Just speculating because I haven't read or heard the full extent of the injury, but he could have conceivably had a partial tear of the ACL which then became a full tear. Could also potentially have strained the ACL originally in the first instance, which then caused a tear in the second.
I've had an ACL. There's no way he had an ACL then carried on playing for several minutes.
I think @reids nailed it: he probably weakened it with the first incident and then actually wrecked it with the second one.
Best of luck Tom for a swift and uncomplicated full recovery.
Someone in my 6-aside team did his ACL a few years back. Thought it wasn’t that serious as he had rest it a couple of weeks, and was walking around on it fine - then he came along for a game, off the bench, and at the first point where he tried to exert any lateral movement through the knee and turn, he crumpled in a heap exactly like TDB did on Saturday. 2 surgeries over 4 months and 6-8 months of rehab later he was back. Good thing TDB doesn’t have to wait for the NHS!
The damage was done in the first fall. It was so horrendous re-watching it, but called the ACL injury there and then. The second one won’t have helped at all, but he would have still been out for a similar duration regardless of whether he played the extra 5 minutes or not. The ligaments were already toast at that point.
Absolutely gutted for him as he was looking to be making the step up to the first team well. Can only hope he comes through the other side a stronger player for it.
I wonder if there's an underlying issue with Tom, or whether it was just dumb luck (or **** from the medical staff). If he does have some kind of weakness in his knee, it could be a good time to work on that and get back stronger. Naturally we all hope he does!