Stadium Expansion - Bushey Hall

Discussion in 'The Hornets' Nest - Watford Chat' started by Stevohorn, Jul 13, 2019.

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For or against a new stadium at Bushey (see post #558)

  1. For

    102 vote(s)
    59.0%
  2. Against

    71 vote(s)
    41.0%
  1. ITK platypus

    ITK platypus Squad Player

    32,000 is a start, but I won't rest until Watford FC play in a 160,000 capacity mega-stadium, the likes of which the world has never seen before. We could demolish large swathes of Luton for building material.

    Until I see confirmation of plans for such a project I will question the club's ambition.
     
  2. Bwood_Horn

    Bwood_Horn Squad Player

  3. Eastcoastorn

    Eastcoastorn First Year Pro

    Excellent and overdue news. It means a cautious way forward. It gives us 25000 for the foreseeable future. Then if we manage to keep our PL status an ambitious 32000 which is pretty much normal for a PL club. I am surprised that the Vicarage Rd Stand will not be upgraded/ expanded before the GT but as I sit in the GT I’m pleased. The GT would be double the size it is now. I look forward to seeing the plans, as they could drastically change our little ground into a stadium to be proud of.
     
  4. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    Agreed.....at last some exciting news surrounding Watford. Adding the 4,000 seats to the SEJ stand is about what I expected, but they're going to do something pretty spectacular with the GT stand, to increase that by 5,000. The GT stand currently holds 5,771, so it will almost double in size. Wow...….imagine a stand of over 10,000 seats on it's own!!

    After seeing the job Populous did at Spurs, it can only be a good thing to have them involved in this project.

    I know 4,000 + 5,000 equals 9,000, but the report said 11,000 more seats, so not sure where the other 2,000 are going. That wasn't clear.

    32,000 capacity stadium would put us 19th in England for stadium capacity, and far more befitting a Premier League club.

    It could all be a pipe dream, because there are a hell of a lot of hurdles to jump over before work starts on the GT stand. 3 to 5 years down the line, big financing, and of course we'll have to be still in the Premier League.

    The GT Stand will be based on the design of Liverpool's main stand, although smaller of course. Either way it's going to be amazing.
    [​IMG]
     
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  5. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    Good news indeed. But I'm already proud of the Vic.
     
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  6. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14


    But somebody on here keeps saying they are leaving. Does this mean he was fibbing? I feel betrayed
     
  7. Dreadnought

    Dreadnought MMC 2010/11 Prediction league 3rd 2011/12

    Just hope that as part of the plans they improve Occupation Road as it is bad enough now without another 4000 being added to the mix at the end of a game.
     
  8. scummybear

    scummybear Reservist

    I understood the part about Anfield's main stand to mean the construction method would be similar, rather than particularly the design. The new stand was built behind the existing, whilst the existing was still in use, then once complete the existing roof was removed and the two sections joined. This would mean the GT supporters wouldn't need relocating and capacity reducing.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

  10. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Yeah, that's almost certainly what it means.
     
  11. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Shakespearo, brumhorn and Otter like this.
  12. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    Ha! I did wonder if anyone would notice that.
    What ive done there you see is to incorporate sprinklers to wash down the seats after the build and whenever they need a clean.

    Actually i wasnt so convinced about the scale.. so ive made it a bit larger and also got rid of the end stand floodlights which are no longer needed.

    upload_2019-10-21_21-21-27.png
     
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  13. hornet93

    hornet93 Academy Graduate

    Are they really going to just build a new tier on the existing SEJ stand? I was always under the impression that this was a temporary structure. It certainly looks that way.

    I've always though it's a bit weird that the entrance to the seating area comes out at pitch level. Do any other PL grounds have stands like this?
     
  14. V Crabro

    V Crabro Reservist

    Yes, but don't you remember that they spent weeks digging, piling and creating foundations which seemed way beyond what was required for the "temporary" SEJ stand. (remember the time lapse image that we used to scan everyday looking for evidence that a heap of soil had been moved a few yards?)

    Also I think the company which designed the SEJ was responsible for one of the stands at Worcester RFC which has something like a second tier built over, and independent from, the first tier.
     
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  15. hornet93

    hornet93 Academy Graduate

    I'm sure that they could do it if that's what they want to do. I was more thinking that if they're going go to all the trouble of putting another tier on, maybe it would be a good idea to make the existing tier a bit less crap.

    Really they probably shouldn't have cheaped out on it in the first place. Remember when it first opened and the seats didn't go all the way down to pitch level? Then after we got promoted they quickly added some more at the front.
     
  16. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    It's not a temporary stand at all. I think it was described as 'semi-permanent' at the time, but the actual structure looked pretty standard for how things are now. Metal frame, pre-cast concrete for the terraces and walkways etc. The front few rows are the only exception to that. The cost savings came on the fitting out - which was done as cheaply as possible - and by restricting its size. I'm pretty sure the reason they didn't build all the way down to ground level from the outset was to avoid the cost of dealing with the slope.

    I don't think loading from the front is that unusual either. But it tends to be older, 1990s-type stands that have it.
     
  17. Sahorn

    Sahorn Reservist

    Great plans and the SEJ was designed for expansion I believe.

    But:
    Objections of natural light blocked from Occupation Road houses and vegetable growing gardens.
    Congestion. Health and Safety and police concerns of so many people down Occupation Road.
    Parking.
    Rain on the parade, sorry.
    I trust these issues can be resolved.
     
  18. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    They are valid concerns, and some of that was brought up by The Athletic as well.

    The club must feel they have a good chance of getting this approved. The SEJ stand gradient is very steep, so I suspect they will reduce the gradient and build back, and there's room to do so, rather than build up.

    Rebuilding the GT stand makes perfect sense. There are no obvious obstacles, such as residents complaining about light on that side. You should be able to build a much taller stand on the hospital side of the stadium.

    I don't think parking will be an issue. People park away from the ground, always have done and walk in. With regards to Occupation Road, I suspect they will have a concourse inside but underneath the SEJ stand, which will only be open at either end after the final whistle. People will either exit near Vicarage Road, or at the bottom of Occupation Road, at the ticket office end. That way there will probably be less congestion as the majority walking up Occupation Road would be those exiting from the Rookery.
     
    Sahorn likes this.
  19. Leighton Buzzer

    Leighton Buzzer Reservist

    Look at the damage they did to the roofs (rooves) of those houses by dropping stuff off the construction site!
     
  20. Knight GT

    Knight GT Predictor extraordinaire 2013/14

    I think that's where the toilets will be as the infrastructure is already in place
     
  21. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    Reading further into The Athletic article there are some points that i think people havent seen or understood.

    The additional tier on the EJ stand will be at a more acute angle than the existing stand.. and i quote..
    "The additional seats will mean the gradient of the stand will be reconfigured with a new steeper portion added to the existing structure, similar to the lower sections of the North Stand at Manchester United’s Old Trafford"
    Somewhat odd as the rake of the EJ is fairly steep as it is, plus the lower tier of the North Stand at OT doesnt appear to show much difference from front to back (a bit) https://uploadscdn.sportnetwork.net/upload/261/261_0_1277591178.jpg but that's what they've stated. It will mean adding quite a bit of height to the stand i'd imagine and light to the houses will surely be an issue (as i mentioned earlier) As indeed they have acknowledged..
    "Being sympathetic to the residents who own houses backing on to where the building work would take place is a key factor to the viability of the project. Ensuring the new build doesn’t impede homeowners’ available light to a detrimental degree will be one of the important features of the design"

    "It would also become deeper and need to go further back onto Occupation Road, the narrow street that runs behind the stand"
    As my measurements suggested there doesnt appear to be sufficient space behind to simply add that many seats at the current rake. Even with the increased rake and added height it will still reach Occupation Road. So...
    "It is possible the designs would involve the famous thoroughfare being covered to become an internal walkway"
    Tunnels was something else i mentioned on here years ago. I recall some mocked me for it at the time. Well now you can eat yours words! ;) But anyway i guess they still need to work out if sufficient numbers could pass through such a walkway. Hence the "possible"

    As for the GT stand i wonder if the main stumbling block there will be the listed building that lies behind it? I'm not 100% sure if all the old workhouse building is listed.. or just the front part. But anyway it overlaps the back of the GT by about 15 meters. Maybe that's why the new stand at Anfield has been mentioned. Because if you look at it from above you will see that the back corners of that stand are cut off at angles. Also the inner seating tiers are chamfered off in the corners. Maybe they are thinking of what design could be incorporated around the old workhouse building.
     
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  22. zztop

    zztop Eurovision Winner 2015

    I had a quick chat with my mate Boris about this on his visit to the hospital today, as described in this Wobbie article.

    "The old Victorian building will go..."
    All he wants in return is a "complimentary" corporate box on a Saturday.​
     
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  23. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    Sorted! Though i could see some objections to that happening. Hey perhaps we could get Clive & his disciples a place in that box so they could all have some hearty half time political discussions?

    On a similar note i found out recently that planning permission has been approved in principle for a new mixed residential block on the stretch of Vic Road just past the service station and up to the cafe. There was no mention of the service station itself but perhaps the club could buy it up giving us an open plaza area for the new stand. Or build a new players entrance and use it for club coach parking.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2019
  24. AndrewH63

    AndrewH63 Reservist

    Are they going to level the pitch with all these plans, seems like a good opportunity? They could tunnel under the p[itch and make a giant basement and then using techniques from the great escape gradually level the pitch out from underneath. Then they could put all the circulating space and refreshment facilities in the new basement creating both lots of circulation space and ways to get people north south east and west to enter and exit the stands. We could have the first bottom filling pint filled from a bar under the pitch - All this focus on above ground improvements is not very original
     
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  25. hornetboy1

    hornetboy1 First Team Captain

    That's a very good idea. Schalke have something similar.
     
  26. UEA_Hornet

    UEA_Hornet First Team Captain

    Foster discreetly depositing earth in the goalmouth we're defending? Could cut down goals conceded.
     
  27. Stevohorn

    Stevohorn Watching Grass Grow

    Or go one further and build the proposed Vicarage Road underground station under the pitch. Get off the train and get on an escalator right to you seat!

    Underground overground Watford fc! The Hornets of Vicarage Road are we...
     
  28. ST1968

    ST1968 First Year Pro

    I've said it before and I'll say it again, under the pitch is where we should place some sheds for extra storage.
     
  29. CleyHorn

    CleyHorn Reservist

    I would just love a dirty great big stand built right out across Occupation Road with a concourse underneath it. Trouble is, not only would there then be an issue around light from the setting sun getting to Liverpool Road but access too. They've got garages along there. And what about access to the Rookery flats? Would tenants of those be expected to go all the way around via Cardiff Road? No wonder Liverpool bought up the adjacent houses. Maybe we could buy up the garages and a bit of back garden at a premium rate plus a 'nice little bung' to the Rookery tenants?

    Similarly, I'd love the same arrangement at the Vic. Road end. But that's a relatively mayor thoroughfare and they've just built some new flats adjacent to the Lion.

    NB. Two Liverpools.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019
  30. wincey74

    wincey74 Academy Graduate

    I think the stand will ultimately look like the one posted on here quite a while back. It will be built to the current boundary wall, but the upper tier will overhang the road slightly.
     
  31. AndrewH63

    AndrewH63 Reservist

    The rebuild of the Sir GT stand surely must compromise some of the flats in the Rookery (the block at right angles at the end)? The former workhouse block is grade 2 list, but its footprint might not compromised. It looks tight and it might mean the loss of the SE corner of the Workhouse block. That building has been substantially altered internally and externally, with additions and removal of the original wall and gate on Vicarage road.. i am sure any plans to retain the Vicarage road frontage, the central block and rear block - its a I shape. Restored and brought into commercial use, would be considered sufficient mitigation for the loss of the block that runs along that narrow roadway between the stadium and workhouse buildings. most of the area behind is either car parking or soon to be redundant buildings.
     
  32. Abso

    Abso First Year Pro

    You may find that if they build the SEJ first they incorporate new boxes into it. Then with the GT rebuild the current boxes may go and the current upper tier extended back for maximum bums on seats.
     
  33. Teide1

    Teide1 Squad Player

    I’m sure a free lifetime season ticket including a hot drink at half time, would do the trick, no cash payment necessary!
    Also that would fill one row of the extended stand, would kill two birds with one stone!
     
  34. BigRossLittleRoss

    BigRossLittleRoss First Team

    Only need to sell one player for the standard 50 mill fee for a half decent player and that should pay for the lot.

    Kabasele to Arsenal would do the trick .
     
  35. Abso

    Abso First Year Pro

    Would be nice if something was announced and acted upon and complete in time for 2022 to mark 100 years at the Vic.
     

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